Centerville was ranked 5th in Ohio, and had two sub-18 girls (Walsh and Bucher). The coach's ego got the best of him as he decided to run his JV squad at districts instead of the varsity - apparently thinkind they'd qualify easily. Oops. They finished out of the top 7, so their season is over.
No state meet for those sub-18 girls, or that 5th ranked squad.
Ouch.
Seriously sucks for those girls, not just the top 2 but all 7. Dobson has done this for years, and it worked for them when they were a national power or clearly had better depth. They’d finish like 4th-6th and get to rest their top girls. A luxury for sure, if you can manage it. I don’t get why you wouldn’t just tell your girls to just run it as a tempo if you want them to rest so badly.
Oopsypoopsy wrote:
Centerville was ranked 5th in Ohio, and had two sub-18 girls (Walsh and Bucher). The coach's ego got the best of him as he decided to run his JV squad at districts instead of the varsity - apparently thinkind they'd qualify easily. Oops. They finished out of the top 7, so their season is over.
No state meet for those sub-18 girls, or that 5th ranked squad.
Ouch.
That is ridiculous. Are you sure there weren't injuries or illnesses?
It looks like at least the top from the previous week were sitting out.
If they hadn't done this before, I would say maybe some freak illness or injury thing was possible.
Han Solo wrote:
It looks like at least the top from the previous week were sitting out.
If they hadn't done this before, I would say maybe some freak illness or injury thing was possible.
The coach came down with a case if hubris.
If your competition is that inferior, the race should amount to nothing more than a tempo for your top kids. This is just silly.
My top kid has been in 10 races this year, but only 5 have been competitive races for him. We just turn the others into workout days. Easy race and then add some reps after. No problem.
would love to hear this guy explain himself.
As a Beavercreek alum, I find this freaking hilarious! Same old arrogant Centerville High School.
Apart from the disappointment the girls whose season is suddenly over must feel, this is a very interesting situation.
As I understand the Ohio season, you have league meets one week, districts next, then regionals, then state. I don't think the league meet determines who goes to districts, but there's clearly some pride at stake in winning the league meet. At least there usually is.
So, there's a distinct possibility of going hard four weeks in a row here. That's a lot. I can understand why a coach might try to game the process a little as the Centerville coach did. After the results of this weekend, though, I doubt very many people in Ohio will be clamoring for a change to the advancement process. Which is too bad, because you could otherwise make a good case for an open weekend between districts and regionals or regionals and state. But I can understand people sticking to a system where a school like Centerville gets their comeuppance.
But, even before it was a matter of hindsight, that coach probably should have thought through a few things more carefully. One, Centerville didn't win their league meet. Surely they knew that was a possibility going in. And, if so, why throw your top kids fully on the line for a meet you may not win, anyway, if being primed three weeks later is the end goal? Maybe part of the problem here is putting too much emphasis on the league meet. Two, you definitely provide a little extra motivation for other teams when you pull your varsity from a qualify-to-advance kind of situation such as the Ohio districts. It's real easy to see how other schools might take this as a bit of rubbing their noses in the dirt and welcome the opportunity to prove you're not as smart as you think you are.
Some people have already said, "Well, just run your varsity at threshold." And that makes some sense. They almost certainly would qualify to advance and without any undue wear and tear unless you have a team member or two who has no concept of gearing it down. You could also split your varsity between weeks, three or four running at league and three or four running at districts. For that matter, you could distribute our varsity across all three weeks of league, district, and regionals, if you're that sure you don't need to full group even to advance out of regionals. In that case, it could be that nobody would even recognize that you're gaming the system.
I understand, in a highly successful program, you want to give your sub-varsity kids a chance to share in some limelight that, if they were running to same times at almost any other school, they'd already have. It is true, though, that if you're not careful, this worm can turn on you. It's entirely possible that a few of the girls could reason, "Well, I won't get to run after this, anyway, so why should I drop everything I've got for someone else to have a chance later?" If that thought spreads--and I don't know one way or the other if it did--you could be in deep trouble in a hurry.
Bottom line: if it's qualify-to-advance, you don't want to leave as much to chance as Centerville clearly did. Centerville is far from the only program around the nation to run a JV team to advance. We'll see what changes other schools in similar kinds of situations make in light of this. The warning shot has been fired.
It is the factor of the unknown that makes sports so interesting.
past his prime wrote:
Apart from the disappointment the girls whose season is suddenly over must feel, this is a very interesting situation.
As I understand the Ohio season, you have league meets one week, districts next, then regionals, then state. I don't think the league meet determines who goes to districts, but there's clearly some pride at stake in winning the league meet. At least there usually is.
So, there's a distinct possibility of going hard four weeks in a row here. That's a lot. I can understand why a coach might try to game the process a little as the Centerville coach did. After the results of this weekend, though, I doubt very many people in Ohio will be clamoring for a change to the advancement process. Which is too bad, because you could otherwise make a good case for an open weekend between districts and regionals or regionals and state. But I can understand people sticking to a system where a school like Centerville gets their comeuppance.
But, even before it was a matter of hindsight, that coach probably should have thought through a few things more carefully. One, Centerville didn't win their league meet. Surely they knew that was a possibility going in. And, if so, why throw your top kids fully on the line for a meet you may not win, anyway, if being primed three weeks later is the end goal? Maybe part of the problem here is putting too much emphasis on the league meet. Two, you definitely provide a little extra motivation for other teams when you pull your varsity from a qualify-to-advance kind of situation such as the Ohio districts. It's real easy to see how other schools might take this as a bit of rubbing their noses in the dirt and welcome the opportunity to prove you're not as smart as you think you are.
Some people have already said, "Well, just run your varsity at threshold." And that makes some sense. They almost certainly would qualify to advance and without any undue wear and tear unless you have a team member or two who has no concept of gearing it down. You could also split your varsity between weeks, three or four running at league and three or four running at districts. For that matter, you could distribute our varsity across all three weeks of league, district, and regionals, if you're that sure you don't need to full group even to advance out of regionals. In that case, it could be that nobody would even recognize that you're gaming the system.
I understand, in a highly successful program, you want to give your sub-varsity kids a chance to share in some limelight that, if they were running to same times at almost any other school, they'd already have. It is true, though, that if you're not careful, this worm can turn on you. It's entirely possible that a few of the girls could reason, "Well, I won't get to run after this, anyway, so why should I drop everything I've got for someone else to have a chance later?" If that thought spreads--and I don't know one way or the other if it did--you could be in deep trouble in a hurry.
Bottom line: if it's qualify-to-advance, you don't want to leave as much to chance as Centerville clearly did. Centerville is far from the only program around the nation to run a JV team to advance. We'll see what changes other schools in similar kinds of situations make in light of this. The warning shot has been fired.
It is the factor of the unknown that makes sports so interesting.
you are right about the structure in ohio. conference meet (league), district, regional then state. conference (league) has no bearing on district. everyone runs district and must run well enough there to qualify to regional, and then run well enough in regional to qualify to state.
that said, our coaches always placed the most importance on conference, which i think is antiquated. but to sandbag at districts is stupid. the atmosphere and sense of urgency is NOTICEABLY different at districts. to put your JV team out to qualify you is a complete suicide mission.
is that the douchey school where they do not have school name on their uniforms? just black tanks
The girls were ranked 4th in the state, by the way. And the JV girls only missed qualifying by 9 points.
https://www.baumspage.com/cc/dist/sw/dayton/2019/g1.htm
And this is not Coach David Dobson's first mishap. He almost got canned last year. Clearly the board made a mistake in keeping this clown.
iwasthere? wrote:
is that the douchey school where they do not have school name on their uniforms? just black tanks
I've seen that before by Hilliard Davidson. Intentionally change their uniforms in important meets to mask their real identity.
Well, there this though wrote:
The girls were ranked 4th in the state, by the way. And the JV girls only missed qualifying by 9 points.
https://www.baumspage.com/cc/dist/sw/dayton/2019/g1.htmAnd this is not Coach David Dobson's first mishap. He almost got canned last year. Clearly the board made a mistake in keeping this clown.
"Only" or "Close" doesn't count.
ohia wrote:
iwasthere? wrote:
is that the douchey school where they do not have school name on their uniforms? just black tanks
I've seen that before by Hilliard Davidson. Intentionally change their uniforms in important meets to mask their real identity.
Keep the name out of your mouth
OhioBuff wrote:
ohia wrote:
I've seen that before by Hilliard Davidson. Intentionally change their uniforms in important meets to mask their real identity.
Keep the name out of your mouth
na, Hilliard Davidson are a bunch of queefs.
it appears that was their uniform last year also, just a black Nike tank and yellow shorts
ohia wrote:
Well, there this though wrote:
The girls were ranked 4th in the state, by the way. And the JV girls only missed qualifying by 9 points.
https://www.baumspage.com/cc/dist/sw/dayton/2019/g1.htmAnd this is not Coach David Dobson's first mishap. He almost got canned last year. Clearly the board made a mistake in keeping this clown.
"Only" or "Close" doesn't count.
In horseshoes and hand grenades...
Bump because OH in the title
ohia wrote:
Well, there this though wrote:
The girls were ranked 4th in the state, by the way. And the JV girls only missed qualifying by 9 points.
https://www.baumspage.com/cc/dist/sw/dayton/2019/g1.htmAnd this is not Coach David Dobson's first mishap. He almost got canned last year. Clearly the board made a mistake in keeping this clown.
"Only" or "Close" doesn't count.
I didnt say "only" to justify the clown coaches actions. It was actually a compliment to the girls. I'm sure they feel terrible. It wasnt their fault and they ran great. Too bad they have a crappy coach.
And you can win multiple state championships and still be considered a crappy coach.
This is really, really bad for all the girls. This is really negligence on the coach's part.
I am not usually one to call for a coach to be fired except for pretty obvious cases or abuse, but this is one where the coach failed all the girls on the team especially those who would have advanced.
I know it is hard to get teens to run a controlled race and not go all out, but that is also a skill/strategy to be developed.
RIP: D3 All-American Frank Csorba - who ran 13:56 in March - dead
RENATO can you talk about the preparation of Emile Cairess 2:06
Running for Bowerman Track Club used to be cool now its embarrassing
Great interview with Steve Cram - says Jakob has no chance of WRs this year
Hats off to my dad. He just ran a 1:42 Half Marathon and turns 75 in 2 months!