You did a good job summing up the message board musings of myself and Bob Hodge for the 19 years this website has existed.
Five Star sign of approval, Wejo!
You did a good job summing up the message board musings of myself and Bob Hodge for the 19 years this website has existed.
Five Star sign of approval, Wejo!
Why finish workouts faster than you started? If that's the "basics" in the US, no wonder it's so far behind in the 800.
Bad Wigins wrote:
Why finish workouts faster than you started? If that's the "basics" in the US, no wonder it's so far behind in the 800.
Not like we got a bronze in the last Olympic 800 and recently won a diamond league 800.
Running revolution wrote:
Or get a private coach that knows this stuff and don’t run in high school like the Ingebrigtsens. 3:30 and 13:02 at age 18 could be the result...
Which is hard to do, maybe 10% actually know what they are doing. And 3:30 and 13:02 are so easily attainable for most, all it requires is a good private coach, haha.
malmo wrote:
You did a good job summing up the message board musings of myself and Bob Hodge for the 19 years this website has existed.
Five Star sign of approval, Wejo!
Pretty sure wejo is capable of drawing from his own experience for the article.
1776 wrote:
Bad Wigins wrote:
Why finish workouts faster than you started? If that's the "basics" in the US, no wonder it's so far behind in the 800.
Not like we got a bronze in the last Olympic 800 and recently won a diamond league 800.
More like we never ran a 1:41 let alone a 1:40. Not even a 1:42.50. We're #48 all time.
Now, if you're done, the question remains, why save the faster reps for last?
Bad Wigins wrote:
Why finish workouts faster than you started? If that's the "basics" in the US, no wonder it's so far behind in the 800.
Workouts and races are two different things. E.g. Coe ran his 800 reps each faster than the last (negative workout split), but raced positive-splits for the 800 like everyone else.
Very good article. I agree with your guidance to finish all runs faster than you start them. Thanks for the good ideas.
Bad Wigins wrote:
1776 wrote:
Not like we got a bronze in the last Olympic 800 and recently won a diamond league 800.
More like we never ran a 1:41 let alone a 1:40. Not even a 1:42.50. We're #48 all time.
Now, if you're done, the question remains, why save the faster reps for last?
I'm no genius, but not having 1:40/1:41 800 runners is not a good metric weather or not your country is good at the 800. As only 5 men ever ran those times. The country of those 5 men are England, Kenya, Denmark(really Kenya again), Brazil and Botswana. Out of those 5 countries. Only 2 are really still competitive at the world stage in the 800.
Great info. This also applies to masters athletes just getting seriously into the sport.
I would like to add that point 2 can be very difficult for some people who like exact formulas to follow and aren't good at "listening" to their body. I would encourage them to be patient and that the ability to listen to your body and know what to do comes with time, no matter how much you think it won't. Also, if you're not sure how fast/hard/far to run, err on the side of doing too little than too much (as was mentioned later in the article).
Thank you.
A good article for all Hs runners and coaches. One thing that unfortunately many HS coaches can’t get is that distance runners can’t be good on 25 miles per week and intervals (or something else high intensity) every day. Too many sprint coaches or uneducated coaches trying to coach HS
Weldon, good article. I will add that runners shouldn't be afraid to cross train. Right now there are a lot of top triathletes capable of running sub 14 and sub 29 for 5&10k so it really hasn't harmed them just look at Alex Yee. So runners can get fitter in supplementary ways without breaking themselves. Balance exercises and sit-ups are so helpful. People do recovery days too fast, elites lie that they train fast all the time they don't and they do less rep days then they let on.
Very good article wrote:
Very good article. I agree with your guidance to finish all runs faster than you start them. Thanks for the good ideas.
I'm sure someone can find exceptions to the rule of finishing faster than you start but if you follow it you're going to be a much better runner. I may discuss more specifics next week but am relaxing Labor Day weekend and letting people just read the article.
Subway Surfers wrote:
Weldon, good article. I will add that runners shouldn't be afraid to cross train. Right now there are a lot of top triathletes capable of running sub 14 and sub 29 for 5&10k so it really hasn't harmed them just look at Alex Yee. So runners can get fitter in supplementary ways without breaking themselves. Balance exercises and sit-ups are so helpful. People do recovery days too fast, elites lie that they train fast all the time they don't and they do less rep days then they let on.
Good point. If you're constantly getting injured running in a straight line and all you do is keep running in a straight line without changing something a) trying to fix some underlying issue b) cross train, etc you're likely to have the same issue
Plus when injured you need to maintain you aerobic base. Younger runners in particular who may be week in that area.
Bad Wigins wrote:
1776 wrote:
Not like we got a bronze in the last Olympic 800 and recently won a diamond league 800.
More like we never ran a 1:41 let alone a 1:40. Not even a 1:42.50. We're #48 all time.
Now, if you're done, the question remains, why save the faster reps for last?
Because the article is aimed at improving aerobic endurance in distance runners.
If you want to write an article aimed at 800m runners go ahead. Someone in the US oughta do it because the US certainly needs some guidance in this. And the person to look to is Brother Colm O'Connell who does a good job of explaining why 800m runners fail because...…. well they do exactly what wejo is illustrating. Think about that one.
Yes yes yes and yes wrote:
I just skimmed over it. Totally agree with what you wrote
+1. Good stuff wejo.
One big gap in this article is the importance of the non-running portion of a good program. I had four coaches in high school and college. Two had no non-running activities, one had us weight train like his football players, and one had some running specific strength drills and encouraged an occasional light day with some basketball, tennis, or ultimate on the side . Guess which coach got the most from his athletes, the later even though some runners grumbled about not running all the time.
So I would add something to the effect the a good runner does more than just run and stretch at the beginning/end of a workout.
Also think form drills are under appreciated. This is a key to running relaxed.
Your 6 basic truths reminded me of a quote:
"There are no secrets to running success,anyone who says there are is probably trying to sell you something. "
Marty Liquori
You hit some solid, time-tested, points.
Bad Wigins wrote:
Why finish workouts faster than you started? If that's the "basics" in the US, no wonder it's so far behind in the 800.
This article is just a few days old, so it may not yet have become the standard for all 800 runners in the U.S. But you have an interesting theory.
malmo wrote:
You did a good job summing up the message board musings of myself and Bob Hodge for the 19 years this website has existed.
Most of my own keys to becoming a better runner have probably been expressed in your posts at some time or other, too. But one of Wejo's main points seems contrary to your beliefs. Isn't the importance of relaxed running a concept that you have mocked in the past?
Your list is excellent advice for any runner, and would be especially helpful to new runners.
It reminded me that a few years ago I was giving summer training advice to a group of high school runners who didn't have any summer training guidance from their coach. I put together a list of recommendations for them, which now that I am looking over the list again is pretty similar to yours. My recommendations for these runners (most of whom had less than 2 years running experience and never ran more than 30 mpw) was:
Run every day
Keep a running log
Increase weekly mileage throughout the summer
Don't run too fast, yet.
Occasionally touch on speed/power
Stay healthy
Become a fan of running
I also expanded on each recommendation with some justification, but I won't add that here.
My only real additions to your list are maintaining a running log and being a fan of running. I'm highly confident you'd agree with both of those, but they seem like important principles to state to young/inexperienced runners who want to get deeper into the sport and improve their running.