Can I break 5?

August 31–September 6

Volume: 25.1 km, 1:53, 206 m elevation

* T 6.34 km (28:47) w/ 5:00 @ 3:37/km

* Th 6.40 km (30:15)

* S 6.31 km (29:41)

* Su 6.08 km (24:49) w/ 3 x 600 m/200j (2:02, 2:05, 2:02) and 3 x 200 m (29, 28, 29)

September 7–13

Volume: 26.9 km, 2:03, 235 m elevation

* T 7.10 km (31:36)

* Th 6.20 km (29:32)

* S 6.73 km (29:36)

* Su 6.87 km (32:01)

Feeling good. The next two weeks I want to build up to running 5 days per week. Once that feels good I will try to work up to 40 km (25 mi) per week with a tempo and fartlek from October to early December while doing a couple mile TTs during that time.

Basically, from the past year I learned that I can run 58 400 m, 1:34 600 m, 2:51 1000 m, and 4:57 1600 m (only ran two TTs) on about 3–4 days of training and 15–18 miles per week at my current age. I want to increase that to a consistent 25 miles on 5 days per week and see if I can dip into the 4:40s while still accomplishing "decent" 5 km of ~ 17:20.

September 14–20

Volume: 28.9 km, 2:12, 243 m elevation

* T 6.98 km (34:19)

* Th 7.92 km (38:01)

* S 6.00 km (24:31) w/ 1600 m TT in 5:01 @ 8:00 AM, 56 °F (13 °C) temp, 41 °F (5 °C) dew pt., 15 mph wind w/ 23 mph gust but not too bad, only noticed it when I got tired. (Mean training last 4 weeks: 24.3 km/1:50/4 runs)

* Su 8.00 km (35:17) w/ 8:00 @ 3:47/km

Start doing some intervals, at date pace, then at goal pace, progressing from 220's to 880's. You should get a good idea of what you are capable of. Keep your road mileage low, maybe between 25-30 miles per week. I don't see why you can't accomplish this as your times indicate you do have natural talent.

stan the corgi wrote:

Start doing some intervals, at date pace, then at goal pace, progressing from 220's to 880's. You should get a good idea of what you are capable of. Keep your road mileage low, maybe between 25-30 miles per week. I don't see why you can't accomplish this as your times indicate you do have natural talent.

Thanks for the input, stan! I will work on getting up to 25 mpw and adding in some intervals. Should I do intervals once per week, say 3000 m total of them? Sorry to ask more questions, but what distance is "date pace" and "goal pace", is it my mile pace?

Thank you.

Highest mileage since June this week! I think I will add in a fifth day of running next week.

September 21–27

Volume: 29.4 km, 248 m elevation

* T 8.06 km (35:58) w/ 6:00 @ 3:44/km

* Th 7.99 km (35:50) w/ 6:00 @ 3:35/km

* S 6.02 km (26:43)

* Su 7.39 km w/ 5 x 400 m/90s rest (70, 70, 69, 70, 69) and 2 x 150 m (21, 21)

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September 28–October 4

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Volume: 33.2 km, 2:27, 290 m elevation

* T 7.94 km (34:57)

* Th 6.41 km (28:08) w/ 10:00 @ 3:57/km

* F 3.81 km (19:08) jog in the forest

* S 6.45 km (26:44) w/ 1600 m TT in 5:00 @ 8:30 AM, 48 °F, 44 °F dew pt., no to light wind

* Su 8.61 km (38:45)

chin-up volume: 155

* M 12

* W 11

* Th 10,8,6,4,2

* F 10,8,6,4,4

* S 10,8,6,6,4

* Su 10,8,8,6,4

Saturday was the easiest feeling time trial yet, although I did not run any faster. A lot of that probably has to do with the nice running weather. My plan was to hit 800 m in 2:30 and then pick it up at ~ 900 m. I hit 800 m in 2:30, 1000 m in 3:06. I thought I was speeding up but I just maintained pace lol. Still happy with it.

I feel like I need structure. I have a dusty copy of Daniel's Running Formula on my shelf. I might jump into Phase III of either the 800 or 1500/3000 training plan and see what happens. I want to hit a "mini-peak" in early December if possible and then start a proper full cycle in January, hoping to peak in March or April for the 800 and 1500.

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October 5–11

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Volume: 20.6 mi, 2:24, 755 ft elevation

* T 4.53 mi (32:56)

* Th 4.85 mi (31:54) w/ 3 x 1 mi @ threshold/1:00 rest in 5:58, 6:11(turnaround), 5:42. Moderate hills.

* S 5.40 mi (40:00)

* Su 5.84 mi (40:00) w/ 5 x 1 km/1:00rest ~ threshold (3:43, 3:39, 3:37, 3:33, 3:29)

Felt great on the Thursday workout, like I was floating along.

chin-up volume: 212

* M 10,10,8,6,4

* T OFF

* W 12,10,8,6,4

* Th 12,10,8,6,6

* F 12,10,8,8,6

* S 12,10,10,8,6

* Su 12,12,10,8,6

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October 12–18

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Volume: 22.4 mi, 2:34, 866 ft elevation

* T 4.22 mi (31:57)

* Th 6.32 mi (43:10) w/ 5 * 3:00 @ threshold/2:00 jog (6:02/mi, 5:50, 5:45, 6:19, 6:02)

* S 6.05 mi (40:50) perfect weather post cold front!

* Su 5.83 mi (38:51) w/ 4 * (400 @ R/400JOG + 200 @ R/200JOG) in 73, 35, 75, 37, 77, 37, 76, 36. Total 3 mi in 18:49.

Pretty hilly route for the Thursday workout. I feel strong doing workouts at Daniel's threshold pace. Makes me think that I have always done workouts too fast before or that I have never trained at threshold intensity. Even during the cooldowns after these efforts I feel like I am floating.

chin-up volume: 264

* M OFF

* T 14,12,10,8,6

* W 13,12,10,8,8

* Th 13,12,10,10,8

* F OFF

* S 13,12,12,10,8

* Su 13,12,12,10,8

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October 19–25

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Volume: 21.0 mi, 2:25, 967 ft elevation

* T 4.09 mi (30:49)

* Th 5.61 mi (38:08) w/ 5 * 3:00 @ threshold (mean pace 5:57)/2:00 jog (mean pace 7:36)

* S 5.59 mi (40:01)

* Su 5.74 mi (36:28) w/ 3200 m controlled first half TT in 10:48 (5:30, 5:18 splits). 54 F (54 F dew pt, raining) wind speed 10 mph, only felt it on the backstretch so it probably helped me on the other side.

Friday did a mountain field hike at work.

Another week done! I signed up for a trail/xc 5 km race in two weeks (November 7), I am hoping to hold 5:30s on the course, but I do not know how hilly or difficult the course is.

The time trial felt easy. I wanted to hit the first 1600 in what I perceive to be my current 5k shape (5:30) and then speed up.

If anyone is reading, is it reasonable to think I can maintain 5:30 pace for a 5 km currently?

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November 2–8

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Volume: 21.2 mi, 2:25, 969 ft elevation

* T 6.22 mi (42:58)

* Th 5.36 mi (36:01) hilly w/ 3 * 4:00ON (mean pace 5:54)/3:00JOG (mean pace 7:18)

* F 4.23 mi (30:06)

* Su 5.39 mi (36:01) w/ 600 m/1000 m jog in 1:43, 1:45, 1:49

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November 9–15 (busy work week)

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Volume: 11.6 mi, 1:23, 537 ft elevation

* Th 4.16 mi (30:47)

* F 2.45 mi (19:42)

* Su 5.00 mi (33:22) w/ 2:17 3/4 800 m, 600 m in 1:43

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November 16–22

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Volume: 22.6 mi, 2:30, 961 ft elevation

* M 3.02 mi (19:25)

* T 3.01 mi (19:06)

* W 3.00 mi (19:06)

* Th 3.00 mi (19:06)

* F 2.04 mi (15:09) in the field at work right after

* S 5.01 mi (35:13) w/ 4 x 400m/90r in 69, 68, 68, 69 and 2 x 150m in 20, 20

* Su 3.56 mi (23:48)

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November 23–29

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Volume: 24.2 mi, 2:47, 1,056 ft

* M 3.51 mi (24:24)

* T 3.54 mi (24:21)

* W 3.53 mi (24:24)

* Th 3.50 mi (24:37)

* F OFF

* S 6.00 mi (39:13) w/ 4 x 1000m/200j (3:33, 3:39, 3:36, 3:33) and 2 x 200m/200j (35,34)

* Su 4.09 mi (30:06)

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November 30–December 12(today)

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Volume: 30.10 mi, 3:43

* M 4.03 mi (31:42)

* T 4.02 mi (30:55)

* W 4.60 mi (34:53)

* Th 4.67 mi (36:01)

* F 4.65 mi (35:48)

* S OFF

* Su 8.11 mi (54:05) w/ 5 x 1000m/200j (3:38, 3:34, 3:32, 3:31, 3:31) and 2 x 200m/200j (35,36)

Volume: 29.90 mi, 3:47

* M 4.49 mi (35:58)

* T 4.64 mi (35:49)

* W 4.59 mi (35:40)

* Th 4.60 mi (36:03)

* F 4.60 mi (34:59) w/ 4 x 0:20ON/0:60j

* S 6.96 mi (49:01) w/ 14 minute warm up, 1600 m time trial: 4:53, 1000 m split 3:05, 30 minute cool down. 49 °F temp, 47 °F dew pt., 7 mph wind, did not feel it

It looks like slowing down a bit and increasing mileage is paying off.

hey! i'm back and wanted to update the question:

can i break 4:40 next spring/summer on the road?

i've been running 15 mpw for a few months now with two workouts per week:

• a 5 mile run where i run comfortably fast, but don't let my breathing increase (usually this is ~33:00)
  
• 1–3 tempo 1000s/200jog and then 4–6 x 200 m in 33–35
  occasionally i'll run a running start 100 in ~13 or 150s in 19/20 as well
  
  

my recent results! :

• 4:45 mile in September, had a pretty bad cramp so super happy w how it went!
• 16:55 5 km today solo and felt really great!

future training plans:

• build up to 30 km/week
• stay at 5 days/week

First off, if you just ran 4:45 and you’re asking if you can run 4:40 with consistent training when you’ve run under 4:30 in the past, the answer is almost certainly yes. If I did my math right you’re not even 30, it’s not like your ceiling has declined that drastically by now.

I think you’ll give yourself the best shot by doing more mileage for the number of workouts you’re doing. You said 15mpw, 10 of which is harder work. This is inefficient at best and unsustainable at worst. Try to work on getting to 30mpw at least (assuming you have time), where nearly all the additional mileage is easy running.

I second this.

Really, you could set yourself an actual goal such as "can I break 4:20?".

You could break 4:40 next week if it was a good day for you.

So break 4:40 and set yourself a difficult goal worthy of your talent and ability.

appreciate the insight, thank you both!