An AR-15 is no more dangerous than a 9 millimeter handgun

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

No gun for fun wrote:

Please do not tell us about shootings in Chicago.

That's just another weak excuse.

Well, no one wants to discuss the shootings in Chicago. Particularly because its a democratically controlled city with some of the most restrictive gun laws in the country. Not to mention its inner city gangs killing one another, along with a smattering of innocents. No self respecting democrat wants to discuss that. Shows the utter fallacy of their arguments and their disregard for the youth in the inner city.

Is it your view that guns cannot be bought elswhere and driven into Chicago?

I'm curious to hear why you think Chicago's gun laws are relevant to the discussion given the existence of you know roads and cars.

The solution to Chicago style violence is making handguns very very very hard to get nationally.

agip wrote:

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

Well, no one wants to discuss the shootings in Chicago. Particularly because its a democratically controlled city with some of the most restrictive gun laws in the country. Not to mention its inner city gangs killing one another, along with a smattering of innocents. No self respecting democrat wants to discuss that. Shows the utter fallacy of their arguments and their disregard for the youth in the inner city.

Is it your view that guns cannot be bought elswhere and driven into Chicago?

I'm curious to hear why you think Chicago's gun laws are relevant to the discussion given the existence of you know roads and cars.

The solution to Chicago style violence is making handguns very very very hard to get nationally.

There are over 300 million firearms in circulation. Any criminal can obtain a firearm on the black market or steal them from other criminals. They do not go into gun shops to obtain a firearm, whether in or out of state. They can transport them anywhere. Criminals don't obey the law. Chicago (and many other cities) routinely let criminals that commit firearms crimes to plea bargain the charge down, and allow them back on the streets. Chicago makes it next to impossible for law abiding citizens to obtain a forearm for self defense or any other purpose. So in reality, the only effect of the Chicago gun laws is to penalize law abiding gun owners. The solution to Chicago style violence, is:

1.) Commit crime #1 with a firearm - 10 years minimum. no plea bargain, no parole.

2.) Crime # 2 with a firearm - 20 years minimum, no plea bargain, no parole.

3.) Crime # 3, or first offense with injury to another person - 30 years, no plea bargain, no parole.

You get the drift.

Can anyone name a single logical reason as to why an individual needs a semi automatic rifle?

Automatic rifles have been banned because someone felt that 700rpm was unnecessary (restricted your right to bear arms...??).

Please just name one reason that a semi-automatic rifle is needed by the general public. Especially one that fires a 5.56mm or larger. I don't get it

the '300 million firearms in circulation' is a bogus stat for several reasons.

Something like 50% of guns are owned by just 3% of the population. A hunting rifle in a safe is not 'in circulation.' A crazed right wing gun collector with 25 guns is not going to sell them to Chicago gang members.

A very very tiny fraction of guns in the country can be bought by chicago gang members. Tiny.

Cut off that supply as much as possible. Make handguns nationally very hard to buy. Require training, require long wait periods. It will make a difference. But it has to be national - otherwise people buy guns elsewhere and drive them in.

ex-runner wrote:

Can anyone name a single logical reason as to why an individual needs a semi automatic rifle?

Automatic rifles have been banned because someone felt that 700rpm was unnecessary (restricted your right to bear arms...??).

Please just name one reason that a semi-automatic rifle is needed by the general public. Especially one that fires a 5.56mm or larger. I don't get it

self defense. Home defense. That's pretty easy.

sure other guns work, but semi automatic works really well for home defense.

and either prove it is 'next to impossible' to buy a gun in Chicago or stop repeating russian propaganda points. Stay with the facts. 5 minutes of research proved to me that it's not at all next to impossible for Chicagoans to buy guns.

ex-runner wrote:

Can anyone name a single logical reason as to why an individual needs a semi automatic rifle?

Automatic rifles have been banned because someone felt that 700 rpm was unnecessary (restricted your right to bear arms...??).

Please just name one reason that a semi-automatic rifle is needed by the general public. Especially one that fires a 5.56mm or larger. I don't get it

You mean the general law abiding public yes? I personally like a semi auto (or my Remington pump) when I'm bird hunting with my shotgun, my .22 rifle when I'm plinking tin cans, my .223 AR when I'm hunting hogs in Florida (they can be nasty buggers, can shred you in a heartbeat if on a charge), my semi auto pistols when I'm target shooting. I also like to hunt deer with my muzzle loader, which is .50 caliber. And also like to target shoot with my .357 revolver. Its not a semi auto but still one shot/trigger pull, max 6 in the wheel. 5.56 BTW is .22 caliber (.223 to be exact).

Russian propaganda points? Are you that much of a fking idiot? Wait................I'll answer my own question. yes. Bye bye.

ex-runner wrote:

Can anyone name a single logical reason as to why an individual needs a semi automatic rifle?

Automatic rifles have been banned because someone felt that 700rpm was unnecessary (restricted your right to bear arms...??).

Please just name one reason that a semi-automatic rifle is needed by the general public. Especially one that fires a 5.56mm or larger. I don't get it

There is no real need. There is only want.

Some people just have fantasies about going full Bruce Willis to save their house as if they live in a war zone. It is more of a want than a need.

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

agip wrote:

and either prove it is 'next to impossible' to buy a gun in Chicago or stop repeating russian propaganda points. Stay with the facts. 5 minutes of research proved to me that it's not at all next to impossible for Chicagoans to buy guns.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-met-chicago-gun-laws-explainer-20171006-story.html

Russian propaganda points? Are you that much of a fking idiot? Wait................I'll answer my own question. yes. Bye bye.

hey, another right winger wrong on the facts, afraid of the facts, and spewing nonsense bilge because Trump tells him to. What a f'ing surprise.

I think you are on to something. Minimum sentencing really stopped the illicit drug trade in the US cold in its tracks in the 1990s and had no unintended consequences. I haven't seen the next season of Narcos, but I hear it shows all the cartels giving up and investing in Curves franchises.

But we do need to add prayer in schools and spank our children more as measures to stop gun violence to make sure that we throw all the old bad ideas at the problem and ignore the fact that strict gun control limits have been proven in many

countries to be effective at controlling gun crime.

If we had strict gun control laws, gun violence might go down but overal violence can go up and then it would be harder for law abiding citizens to protect themselves.

3/173 wrote:

lol KAGA wrote:

ah yes, this is why our military only uses handguns.

Our military primarily uses rifles because they need to be able to engage the enemy at hundreds of yards outdoors. Don’t be obtuse.

ah yes, this is why soldiers automatically whip out their 9mm handguns in urban environments

lol KAGA wrote:

3/173 wrote:

Our military primarily uses rifles because they need to be able to engage the enemy at hundreds of yards outdoors. Don’t be obtuse.

ah yes, this is why soldiers automatically whip out their 9mm handguns in urban environments

And in urban warfare you're typically less than 100m from your target. If you're clearing buildings, etc, then very up close and personal. Which is why they went to short barreled M4s and short barreled SAWs.

Alan

agip wrote:

ex-runner wrote:

Can anyone name a single logical reason as to why an individual needs a semi automatic rifle?

Automatic rifles have been banned because someone felt that 700rpm was unnecessary (restricted your right to bear arms...??).

Please just name one reason that a semi-automatic rifle is needed by the general public. Especially one that fires a 5.56mm or larger. I don't get it

self defense. Home defense. That's pretty easy.

sure other guns work, but semi automatic works really well for home defense.

But aren't semi automatic rifles designed to work at ranges of around 50-500m?

If you fire a .223 at 5 feet and miss you'll kill your kids in the next room or a neighbor. Even if you hit, the bullet might pass through without stopping in the assailant and still kill your wife in her bed.

Shotguns I understand. A shotgun is excellent for home defense. If you miss the pellets won't over penetrate. An AR-15? I don't think so. Even special forces use pistol rounds for close quarters.

I think revolvers and shotguns and bolt-action rifles are fine. Nobody needs semi-automatic rifles designed for Vietnam and Afghanistan in their home.

Plinking can be enjoyed with a bolt action .22lr (actually more fun).

Hunting is an edge case that very few people actually do. Even then bolt action is more accurate and more commonly used for hunting rather than AR type weapons. I've seen people hunt hogs effectively with a bow even.

If you shoot and miss an animal they disappear, how likely is it that firing again will hit? Just spraying bullets?

I really don't get why anyone needs an AR-15/AK-47 or whatever

In the hands of the average law-abiding, mentally stable person who has been taught safe handling of firearms and respect for life, no firearm is more dangerous than any other. Now, if you wanted to rephrase your question as to which firearm causes more wound trauma and potential for over-penetration, the .223 round wins hands-down.

I'm all for stricter gun laws but hunting is very popular in rural areas, with vets, and the military population.

The gun industry has turned the AR15 at its cousin the AR10 into popular hunting rifles by changing the makeup of the rounds being used. Why? Because money.

Alan

Semi-automatic rifles have been around for over 100 years. Mass shootings have been around since common use of pot. Most mass shooters use pot.