Mike Woods set to become first ever sub-4 miler and Tour de France finisher... How would today’s distance stars fair?

If Andrew Wheating couldn't figure out how to position himself in a pack of 10 runners, he'd never figure out how to position himself in a pack of 200 cyclists.

The thing is, a good runner, or even a 31 minute runner can become a TDF racer and do well. It has happened a few times. No pro cyclist ever became a good runner. The doped to the gills LA was about a 2:50 marathoner, and even before he became a doping cheater was slower than a 5 minute miler in high school. The very best a cyclist has ever done is about 2:40. No matter what all you self-haters want to believe, it is easier to learn bike handling and pack riding than it is to run with the efficiency to break 15 or 31. This has been proven. A runner can and has gained the power and skills to ride fast, but a cyclist can't gain the aerobic output and stride efficiency to run fast.

Running fast is harder than the TDF wrote:

The thing is, a good runner, or even a 31 minute runner can become a TDF racer and do well. It has happened a few times. No pro cyclist ever became a good runner. The doped to the gills LA was about a 2:50 marathoner, and even before he became a doping cheater was slower than a 5 minute miler in high school. The very best a cyclist has ever done is about 2:40. No matter what all you self-haters want to believe, it is easier to learn bike handling and pack riding than it is to run with the efficiency to break 15 or 31. This has been proven. A runner can and has gained the power and skills to ride fast, but a cyclist can't gain the aerobic output and stride efficiency to run fast.

This has not been proven, if anything, elite triathletes prove that is is probably possible, but no one does so. Take folks like Alastair Brownlee or Alex Yee. Both have run competitive track 10000s while being triathletes (low 28s) while also having the ability to ride fast on the bike. Sure, they are Olympic distance guys so not like they are ready for the Tour "right now", but I think it shows if they decided to go either way, pro runner or pro cyclist, they probably could.

Jan Frodeno ran a 2:40 marathon after averaging 27mph for 112 miles in an Ironman. He clearly has the ability to at least be a domestique, and maybe he could never run 2:10, had he chosen a life of running instead, he undoubtedly could have been down in that area.

To summarize, I'm not suggesting every cyclist is capable of being a great runner, or every runner able to be a pro cyclist, but there are folks that could have went either way.

The biggest thing being overlooked here is the vastly different type of effort in these races.

Running races are, for the most part, paced steadily within a very small band, say 90-110% of max pace possible for the distance. A marathon at 5:00/mile pace will rarely get much outside 4:45-5:15/mile pace.

Cycling races are much more dynamic in pace, the majority of the race being in the draft going ~50%, and then big accelerations well over 100% of max possible pace. Wattage output is better measurement here, and you'll see guys tooling along at 250-300 watts, then blasting well over 1000 on accelerations, only to average 400ish for the day.

In running you can by and large just run faster until those around you can't keep up, but on a bike the guy behind is saving ~30% by drafting, so as you keep steadily accelerating you really are just giving him a free ride.

Running fast is harder than the TDF wrote:

The very best a cyclist has ever done is about 2:40.

You have no idea what you are talking about

Seriouslee? wrote:

strong legs wrote:

No chance.

Seriously? Kipchoge's aerobic engine, mental toughness, and life at high altitude would definitely translate to the bike. A year of training would be enough time to learn the aerodynamics/descending skills needed to contend.

Rupp's a little harder to predict. But if Alberto put his mind together with the best coaches in cycling I'd predict a top-50 finish at the very least.

One year is laughable.

Good distance runners can't even compete in ultras after one year and it's basically same sport. You don't understand what you're talking about. Gwen Jorgenson thought she could do the opposite too, fwiw

I guarantee you Rupp is more athletic than Kipchoge in terms of coordination and other sports. He was a good soccer player and grew up playing sports.

He's coordinated and would probably do on a bike. He probably even rides sometimes for cross training.

I bet he's more coordinated than 90% of the people who visit this forum.

shut up fool wrote:

Running fast is harder than the TDF wrote:

The very best a cyclist has ever done is about 2:40.

You have no idea what you are talking about

Name one who is faster than that. Never happened. Won't ever happen. High school girls have run faster marathons than any pro cyclist ever will.

Fast runners and sub-elite runners and local elite runners have transitioned and raced in the Tour. No Tour rider who wasn't a runner before has ever run even a 31 10K. Those are facts.

Running fast is harder than the TDF wrote:

shut up fool wrote:

You have no idea what you are talking about

Name one who is faster than that. Never happened. Won't ever happen. High school girls have run faster marathons than any pro cyclist ever will.

So I'm 10 minutes faster than the best a cyclist can run for a marathon? Don't think so.

And the marathon wasn't even my best event.

Yes it takes year to convert from one to the other, but it can be done.

Put in the reverse - how many TDF guys (even Lance) are kicking ass in the 1500-marathons at all let alone 1 year?

Mike is exceptional. That's a guy who should be #1 on the fittest athletes of all time.

Ben True

How many people have competed in the TDF? 10,000? Cycling is a relatively small sport, numbers wise.

How many people have run a sub 4 mile out of the millions of competitive runners? 1000?

It is much more likely that a person will ride the Tour than run a sub 4 mile.

shut up fool wrote:

Running fast is harder than the TDF wrote:

Name one who is faster than that. Never happened. Won't ever happen. High school girls have run faster marathons than any pro cyclist ever will.

So I'm 10 minutes faster than the best a cyclist can run for a marathon? Don't think so.

And the marathon wasn't even my best event.

Yes it takes year to convert from one to the other, but it can be done.

If you ran a 2:30, then you are 10 minutes faster than a pro cyclist has ever run for the marathon. Maybe someday one of them will run faster than you, but it hasn't happened yet. And if it could have been done, you'd think that it would have been done by now. These sports have been around over a hundred years. Fast runners have become fast cyclists, but no fast cyclist has ever become a fast runner. If they haven't even ever run 2:40, then 2:15 or even 2:20 doesn't seem likely to ever happen.

Looked it up. The fastest a Tour rider has ever run for the marathon is........2:39:19 Abraham Olano.

Geir Kvernmo, the great Norwegian nordic skier ran a 2:10:17 at London.

Woods probably could run 2:20 if he trained for several months, but he was a runner who went to biking, not the other way around. There is just a lot more genetic ability required to run fast than to bike for hours a day. You can train up to ride, but you have to have tons of natural aerobic ability and biomechanics to run a fast mile or a fast marathon.

Confused about all the people saying the elite 10k guys wouldn't translate well.

Look at the frames of Froome and Bernal, etc? Are those guys really more like a 1500m runner? They are optimized to put out big efforts for 30min-1hr. Much like a 10k+ guy.

For a GC contender you'd have to think there's some alignment.

Sure, for grabbing podiums at your local crit 800-1500m seems like a better domain.

Not saying they'd compete, just saying it's analogous.

Doo wrote:

If Andrew Wheating couldn't figure out how to position himself in a pack of 10 runners, he'd never figure out how to position himself in a pack of 200 cyclists.

I LOL'd

Daniel Atienza.

Pro Cyclist:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Atienza

Sub 2:30 marathoner (Zurich 2013)

https://www.athlinks.com/Race/Event?raceID=269038

I agree with the basic premise that there are very few pro cyclists that could transition to running fast, and even fewer that actually have, but there are always exceptions.

Emma Pooley (Olympic silver as a cyclist) later ran a 2:44 marathon. That's got to be equivalent to somewhere in the 2:20's for men.

Its not about just finishing the TDF.

Many cyclists can finish it.

Its finishing it within the time limit each day. Its basically 21 days of stage races. If you don't finish within a certain time percentage of the winner each day, you get booted.

Cyclists are way more tough than track and field guys. There are riders who have finished with broken arms, collar bones, ribs, vertebrae etc. About the only thing the guys mentioned her can do equally well, is take a dump on the side of the rode.