Official Sunset Tour Discussion 07/09

graced wrote:

I'm surprised Grace can beat Houlihan at 800. Shouldn't be because she was an Olympic finalists but Houlihan is so much faster at 800 and Grace doesn't look that fast. I'd assume Houlihan has better 400 speed but must be wrong.

Um, Kate was one second slower than her PR tonight as she walked down Houlihan who PR'd by over a second. Kate would almost certainly be faster over 400.

It's $12.99. And, as an authority on the sport, I'd think you'd want to pay the extra money to be in the know. You can write it off, ya know.

Hunter didn't look too good, guess he gonna have to go for the 5k at USA's

Grace held Houlihan off down the homestretch. It looked like Houlihan would reel her in but Grace stayed strong the last 30-40m.

Grace is finally starting to adapt to Jerry’s training. I think that she’ll have a breakthrough this year.

Big run for Sinclaire Johnson as well.

Centro’s 1:46 off only a few weeks of training was a great result. He’ll be fine for USA’s but Engels will beat him.

Brazier was impressive.

The men’s 5k was very disappointing. Fisher will not make that worlds team. Chelimo is a lock. Then you’ll have Lomong, Kincaid, Fisher, Mead, Jenkins, Erassa and Hunter fighting for two spots.

The BTC babes in the 5k were also very impressive.

rojo wrote:

Confession. I didn't watch the meet. I saved $30 and finally watched Icarus instead.

Here are my thoughts.

1) ARE YOU CRAZY? You are worried about Murphy. Why? Yes, he's not looking like an Olympic bronze medallist but he's looking way better than Harris. He ran 1::44.47 this week. Harris' PB is 1:44.42 and he's missed a lot of time. He's only run 1:46 this year. I'd be stunned if Harris PRs at USAS.

3) Can we stop the crap about Hunter being a 1500 guy? Tinman said he was like Virgin in HS and tonight shoudl have been a reminder of that. He lost to Brazier. As for Brazier, do we need to admit my buddy was right when he said 4 years ago that Fisher wasn't the best guy in HS in Michigan? That Brazier was better? Right now, that's clearly the case.

Murphy is in great shape right now, but comparing his season to any of his past few, I thought he’d be looking much sharper right now. He’s a had a full year of training with the best partners he’s ever had, but still looks like he’s struggling while closing some of these races.

Harris is just a personal bias. I like an underdog story and he’s always been good with rounds. He’ll be the most fresh so anything is possible.

About Hunter and Brazier, yes. You were right Rojo. I think Hunter could develop into a 3:32 guy, but really his best event is the 3k. Brazier is a modern Jim Ryun.

Brazier a modern Jim Ryun? In what way? Ryun was a miler. Brazier is a sprint oriented 800 runner.

Hejdfhddj wrote:

Brazier a modern Jim Ryun? In what way? Ryun was a miler. Brazier is a sprint oriented 800 runner.

Its pretty clear now that if Brazier actually focused on the mile and increased his mileage, he would be one of the best in the country and possibly the world. A modest increase in strength is already great dividends. I don't think the Ryun comparison is crazy at all. His upside in the 1500/mile is ridiculous.

*** yielding great dividends

No speed yet wrote:

Hejdfhddj wrote:

Brazier a modern Jim Ryun? In what way? Ryun was a miler. Brazier is a sprint oriented 800 runner.

Its pretty clear now that if Brazier actually focused on the mile and increased his mileage, he would be one of the best in the country and possibly the world. A modest increase in strength is already great dividends. I don't think the Ryun comparison is crazy at all. His upside in the 1500/mile is ridiculous.

I do recall Brazier almost outkicking grant fisher in HS in the mile around the time fisher ran like 4:03 stumbling on the rail. I remember hearing that he was not really a distance guy then too.

With his front running 800 speed I believe if he wanted he could definitely go low 3:30's. Maybe even 3:30? I know thats a bold claim but he reminds me of a andrew wheating that front runs. He is arguably our best distance guy right now too.

Iowa800 wrote:

Centro in 1:46.32. Called 1:46.5.

So you were wrong.

Rotich, are you daft? A 3:32 guy for Hunter!? Have you not seen him run in person with that limited form? His upside over 1500m is very limited. Jim Ryun's PR is 3:33 and Steve Scott 3:31.76. Hunter is not in this class. He's more of a 3:34-3:36 talent.

Rotich the Rotich wrote:

About Hunter and Brazier, yes. You were right Rojo. I think Hunter could develop into a 3:32 guy, but really his best event is the 3k. Brazier is a modern Jim Ryun.

What is up with some of the goofy lap splits in the results?

Some sub-10 second laps in the men's 5000, compensated by some 2+ minute laps. A bit bizarre.

westsouthrunner wrote:

No speed yet wrote:

Its pretty clear now that if Brazier actually focused on the mile and increased his mileage, he would be one of the best in the country and possibly the world. A modest increase in strength is already great dividends. I don't think the Ryun comparison is crazy at all. His upside in the 1500/mile is ridiculous.

I do recall Brazier almost outkicking grant fisher in HS in the mile around the time fisher ran like 4:03 stumbling on the rail. I remember hearing that he was not really a distance guy then too.

With his front running 800 speed I believe if he wanted he could definitely go low 3:30's. Maybe even 3:30? I know thats a bold claim but he reminds me of a andrew wheating that front runs. He is arguably our best distance guy right now too.

I'm a coach in Michigan. When Fisher and Brazier we're both competing, it was fairly obvious Brazier was going to have more upside as a pro. Both of them were low mileage runners, but watching Brazier negative split 1:48s made you think that once he found a true 800 coach he could for sure run much faster. I remember hoping at the state meet that they would both run the mile, but Brazier chose the 800 and Fisher chose the 1600/3200. Donavan ran 4:07 winning by nearly 10 seconds and I think could have run around 4:03 if he went for it.

Brazier was also solid at XC on about 25 miles per week. I think he ran 15:20s on a very fast course. I think he was 6th at the state finals in XC.

Is Watson really a pro? 2:03 is decent but not going to cut it.

And the dispute was essentially settled by the time Brazier finished his freshman year of college, smashing Jim Ryun's 800m record down to 1:43.55. If you compare Brazier to Ryun and Murphy, you'll see that each one of them is or was a very fast 400m runner even by the standards of half-milers.

Ryun's best 400m capacity is much disputed but he was at worst a low 46 guy on a muddy track after running sub 4 earlier on the same day. He didn't run enough hard 800/880 races to drop the world record down to 1:42-43, but he clearly had that capacity through 1967.

Brazier and Murphy both have sub 46 splits.

Huh??? wrote:

It's $12.99. And, as an authority on the sport, I'd think you'd want to pay the extra money to be in the know. You can write it off, ya know.

No, it's not $12.99 and you would know that if you actually subscribed and were in the know. It's $29.99 month to month. The $12.99 comes into play if you pay for a full year up front ($155.88) and that's what it averages out to.

Huh??? wrote:

It's $12.99. And, as an authority on the sport, I'd think you'd want to pay the extra money to be in the know. You can write it off, ya know.

Write it off what?