27 years old, can I improve from 17:13 5k to sub-16 (or 15, eventually)?

No. You are likely to level off for a few years and then go backwards.

Depends on how long you've been a runner for, if you've been going strong since you were 14 then probably not but if you just started a year or two ago and you don't run much then you might get it with some better training and higher mileage.

depnds wrote:

Depends on how long you've been a runner for, if you've been going strong since you were 14 then probably not but if you just started a year or two ago and you don't run much then you might get it with some better training and higher mileage.

ask me in 3 years, I'm in the same boat. ran some mid 27 8k's in/after college, and in half-assedly training since then I've been low to mid 17 for 5k. think if I can just string together a solid 6 months of training I could get close to 16-flat but my motivation is waning and life is just getting busier.

You are only 27. If you focused on training, longevity, health, diet and all factors associated with regular, constant, break free running, I can see no problems here.

Periodisation and programming becomes a big issue and real base endurance too. You must learn how to do so and not listen to coaches pushing you on track sessions.

Here are some books to look at:

Tudor Bompa: Periodization - Theory and Methodology of Training

Kelly Starrett - Ready to run / Becoming a supple leopard

Phil Maffetone - Endurance handbook / Big book of endurance training and racing

All Lydiard Books

This would give you a very solid understanding of what base is !

Than you can go ahead and get over Daniel's Hudson's and Hanson's book if wanted to see some pace and workout recommendations. However don't feel that 3 hard workouts a week is necessary all the time and that you have to push push push.

Longevity, efficacy and constant improvement is way different than having a short term goal and not thinking behind that !

Martin Rees ran 16:06 at the age of 60 ! 15:31 @ 55years old !

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_masters_world_records_in_road_running

Thanks for the book references - I just got David E Martin's Better Training for Distance Runners, and I'll be ordering these three as well. And thanks for the advice/encouragement.

If you go and train at high altitude with a serious coach unde a structured training regimen, I can see a very high 15's, nothing lower than that. But, as another poster pointed out, it depends how long you've been running. If it's been for a long time, probably will never happen other than mid 16's to high 16's

Good luck

Brad Hudson's book is pretty good in that he really emphasizes on listening to your body and on a week to week basis he's very flexible on moving the workouts around depending on how you feel. It's also very affordable on amazon.

I started running as a 10th grader (16 years old for my 10th grade PR). Here is my progression.

Age 16 - 17:08

Age 17 - 16:38

Age 18 - 16:41

Ages 19, 20, 21 - no running

Age 22 - 18:24

Age 23 - no 5k races, 1:04:56 10 mile, 3:21 marathon

Age 24 - 17:27, 3:00:27

**increased mileage from 30-40 range up to 60-70 range**

Age 25 - 16:10, 2:44:16

Age 26 - 16:07, 2:39:49

Age 27 - no races, got married, started new career, bought house, limited running

Age 28 - 16:11, 2:41:14

**hired coach, increased mileage from 60-70 up to 75-85**

Age 29 - 15:23, 2:30:39

Age 30 - 15:24, no marathon

**increased mileage to 100+**

Age 31 (current age) - 14:53, 2:25:17

Yes you can. You just a world class coach that knows your EXACT individual aerobic paces.

Of corse you can . you just need my DOOKIECAN system to train proper . 21x400 with individual rest down to 119 bpm. Mor work and more rest than that fakker JS from nederland. I internalized many kenyon runners to 10kM pb. One ran 24:27 this spring . MAJIK !

GBohannon wrote:

I started running as a 10th grader (16 years old for my 10th grade PR). Here is my progression.

Age 16 - 17:08

Age 17 - 16:38

Age 18 - 16:41

Ages 19, 20, 21 - no running

Age 22 - 18:24

Age 23 - no 5k races, 1:04:56 10 mile, 3:21 marathon

Age 24 - 17:27, 3:00:27

**increased mileage from 30-40 range up to 60-70 range**

Age 25 - 16:10, 2:44:16

Age 26 - 16:07, 2:39:49

Age 27 - no races, got married, started new career, bought house, limited running

Age 28 - 16:11, 2:41:14

**hired coach, increased mileage from 60-70 up to 75-85**

Age 29 - 15:23, 2:30:39

Age 30 - 15:24, no marathon

**increased mileage to 100+**

Age 31 (current age) - 14:53, 2:25:17

This is fantastic!

Just wanted to follow up here:

I worked my way up to 90 miles/week starting in January, and I've already raced a 35:04 10k and a 4:50 mile only on that base mileage (no real workouts). I believe my next 5k will be mid-16, or at least sub 17. It's a good start.

Thanks to all who posted with info and encouragement - I'll update again in 2 weeks for my first 5k of the year (alone, of course).

Particularly to GBohannon- your progression is pretty damned inspiring.

still_nowornever wrote:

Just wanted to follow up here:

I worked my way up to 90 miles/week starting in January, and I've already raced a 35:04 10k and a 4:50 mile only on that base mileage (no real workouts). I believe my next 5k will be mid-16, or at least sub 17. It's a good start.

Thanks to all who posted with info and encouragement - I'll update again in 2 weeks for my first 5k of the year (alone, of course).

Particularly to GBohannon- your progression is pretty damned inspiring.

You're gonna smash it! Good luck!

For real, GBohannon's post inspired me to dream even bigger....

What mileage for grades 10, 11, and 12? Other than that I see a lot of dedication that payed off in the end.

Absolutely. One of my friends actually ran all of his pbs in his mid 30s. Low 14s at altitude and sub 29 10k although he thinks he was best at middle distances but the roads is where you make money.

If you're not competing professionally, anything is possible with EPO...

ElGuerroujFan wrote:

What mileage for grades 10, 11, and 12? Other than that I see a lot of dedication that payed off in the end.

**Paid**

I'm the OG poster (just made a registered account).

The promised update -

Ran a 17:03 5k today, with a moderate (5mph) headwind the whole way.

I wanted to get under 17, but it's going the right direction, at least (and a PR). And, it is in the middle of what will end up being a 100 mile week.

I figure, if I keep setting the right goals, I can be another one of the stories to inspire whatever future person wants to break their own expectations. Alright, back to work! (actually, just staying home or running)