High School Coaches: Do you treat your cross country team as a no-cut sport? Why or why not?

You are a sad man

“Grown-ups are certainly quite extraordinary’ was all he said to himself as he continued on his journey.”

“Here is my secret. it’s quite simple: One sees clearly only with the heart. Anything essential is invisible to the eyes.”

This is the best post on this thread. Cutting kids is about preserving an environment. Anyone who contributes positively to the environment can stay. Kids who are not interested in improving, not interesting in helping their teammates improve do not have a place in that environment. Coaches are educators - they need to give opportunities for growth. But after awhile if you have kids who aren’t contributing and not showing growth, you have to do what’s best for the group.

Even some colleges have a no cut policy. Most just don't make the travel squad, and only run in JV heats until their Jr. year is over. Then, they can practice with the team and nothing else, or just help out etc.

There are over 200 boys and girls in each of the track and cc programs at our local Pa. high school. There should be at least 2 high schools or at least an A team and a B team that compete against other schools. The head coach actually does a great job with a tough situation.

There have been cuts in track this year. There are evidently not enough staff willing to be assistant coaches and why should there be?

A union member in his/her early thirties makes 6 figures. A few extra thousands for coaching is not much of an inducement.

Pathetic.

I'm a parent of an nxr but not nxn kid who runs with the hunters. We knew zero about running before high school. I've a few observations for yall

- the hunters program gets TEN percent of the high school running. The non top 14 still are fully engaged, even as they realize that they'll likely not crack the top 14

- instead of cutting, they added coaches. How cool. I'd presume it's easy for the AD to free budget for nxn winners!

- unlike this poster I quoted says, the hunters hold kids back if they're not ready. Yes they require full attendance, but specifically to ensure kids don't hurt themselves. That includes freelance 5ks in season

- they're year round, but start xc after school in June,attendance optional, and mandatory practice Aug 1

- the faster kids go to the invitationals, the majority run in Loudoun County

I'm confident that most all kids learn to love running for life. The year end banquet jams the cafeteria at valley. With all those kids who weren't cut. Damn, but what a legacy they're leaving.

Cutslikeaknife wrote:

- instead of cutting, they added coaches. How cool. I'd presume it's easy for the AD to free budget for nxn winners!

It's possible the school is paying for those extra coaches, but I wouldn't count on any AD in the entire country to free up some budget just because a team won NXN. At least in our district that is not at all how it works. It's not even up to the AD. The school district as a whole decides what each sport gets for paid stipends and they don't care AT ALL how good or bad the team is.

greenliner wrote:

I don't know what Coach Kern does at York now, but when Coach Newton was coach the team was well over 100 runners each year, and with very specific rules- open to all, but you cannot miss practice. Ever. Not for a family vacation, not for anything except a funeral or doctor-proven illness. Further, you had to keep above a C average on a weekly basis, not term basis. In fact, you could not be late for practice. And it worked very well; everyone knew the rules.

As a physician myself, doctor's note policies by employers, schools, and coaches have always baffled me. For the vast majority of illnesses that necessitate missing a workout, the absolute best course of action would be to stay home and rest. There is rarely any value in forcing a kid to get out of bed and go to the doctor's office for a 24-hour illness. Whether or not you go to the doctor should be dictated by the severity and duration of the illness, not by the need for documentation.

I personally get migraines on occasion. Luckily, they only occur 1X per year or so, but I'm completely nonfunctional when one hits. It's not a matter of toughing it out and pushing through. My language centers are affected and I lose the ability to read and everything I try to say just ends up coming out as a string of random words. I truly just can't work in that condition. All I want to do when I have a migraine is to lay down in a place with no sound or light at all and do nothing until it passes. I don't care what HR's policy says, I am simply not going to leave my home when I have a migraine just so that I can have someone write a note that says "yep, this guy who says he has a migraine does, in fact, have a migraine." Doing so would make me miserable, and would be of benefit to absolutely no one. I can't understand why a coach would want a note when all I really need is to spend a good 8 hours in the dark doing nothing.

Sounds like your coach did you a favor when he cut you then. Win-win.

In an interview with the Hunters a few years ago that was posted here, they stated that they got above 50 boys and were contemplating how they would manage the size of the group. They announced to the team that they might end up cutting. The next day 10-15 kids just didn’t come back.

So no they didn’t cut but the kids “cut themselves” as many coaches are saying in this thread.

Joe Newton- and now Coach Charlie Kern- always had XC teams of 130+ runners, year after year. But that took time to build. And Newton's way may no longer be the model any more, but the fact remains, XC at York is no cut. My son ran at York and now coaches at Hinsdale Central, in the same conference. His rules when he was head coach were not as rigid as Newton's. But the thing is, people in Elmhurst bought in to the Newton approach, since he was such a role model. The expectations were set early and known by all. And it remains a meritocracy; you need to perform in order to make top 7, and if you slack, there is always someone willing to work harder than you to take your place.

But then, tell me: how many of you who coach could get up in front of a crowd and tell that crowd a runner's initial time as a freshman, and his (or her) final times as a senior- and do it for the 100 people who showed up for that meeting, whom you could not know who were coming, and get it all right? Which Newton did, year after year. Every Labor Day, he would hold a team meet, with a meet included for alumni- and maybe 80 alumni might show up and he could do that for every single person there. From memory. Man could not keep track of his car keys, but he kept track of times like no one I've ever seen. The message to his runners was what was important- you matter, I care, and no matter how far down the totem pole you were, where you ranked out of 130 runners, I kept my eye on you because of that. I say keep XC no-cut, since it still teaches life lessons. But you have to follow the team rules, because if you do not, you still learn some life lessons. I guess I am just old school on this.

The thread is becoming repetitious but I don't think anyone on here thinks athletes should be allowed to just show up whenever and have no rules.

I do think it's reasonable to question the logic, and what lesson is learned when you have simple minded black and white rules like being booted off the team for missing 1 practice.

Remember, compassion, understanding, and empathy are lessons that can be taught just like discipline and dedication.

I don't cut kids from the team, but I do have performance standards for meet attendance. Typically, the standard for XC is that they must be able to complete the distance without walking. If they walk in a meet, they don't go to the next one. As for track, I have liberal standards that cut the riffraff, the only exception is that freshmen do not have to make the standards, as they are learning how to race. I think the standards have only "cut" two or three athletes since I started the policy, but they were all athletes who carried a lot of baggage, as well. Cancer on the team types.

Kickapoo wrote:

I have kicked kids off teams for bad behavior. But never for performance. If I coached again I would be

a little more understanding of many things. You want kids to love running. That is your main goal.

Winning is important but that's something they should already want to do. Make it a team sport and

push healthy living. Have fun and enjoy your team!

^^This!