Training advice for sub 17:00 5km

MSmith_Runner wrote:

3 x 2000m (All at 5:40-5:50/mile pace). all with 200m jog recovery in 60-65 seconds

6 mile (All at around 6:00/mile pace)

If you are actually completing these sessions than you are well under 17 minute 5000m shape.

I’m hitting 5:53/mile pace for the 3 x 2000m and the 6 mile tempo were 6:05/mile give or take a couple of seconds.

The 17:24 5K I ran does end on a hill that adds 20-30 seconds, so on a flatter finish and course you’re probably right in thinking I’d be well under 17:00 to be fair.

You are going about this right, which is why you are seeing such improvement. Only thing I have to add is you need to maybe substitute some shorter, faster intervals on Tuesday. Do some 400's, 600's instead. And be sure to do some striders after your runs if you aren't too tired. Maybe move your long run to 12 miles from 10.

I think you are going to be at 16:30 pretty quickly.

Here's a few workouts I did before and shortly after running 16:58 (I ended up running 16:44 that season), all workouts were either on an xc course and/or gravel/dirt backroads:

7x1000, 2:00 rest

3:23, 3:23, 3:30, 3:26, 3:29, 3:26, 3:24

4 mi tempo

5:55/6:06/6:15/6:20

5k, 2:30 rest, mile

18:16, 5:28

5x1200, 3:00 rest

4:10, 4:01, 4:05, 4:08, 4:07

4 mi tempo

5:48, 5:54, 5:53, 5:26

This one was on the track and was probably the best workout I had that season:

1x1600, 4:00 rest, 4x1000 w/ 3:30 rest

5:00, 3:09, 3:12, 3:13, 3:10

As long as you aren't killing yourself on those workouts, you should be able to get under 17 right now. Adding 4-6 miles on those off days will go a long way in 2-3 months as well.

Which Nike + workouts are you doing?

I'll use 2 workouts on each of my workout sessions...

For core workouts mix between two of:

Super Twist Core Series

Core Burner 2.0

Ab Burner

and finish off with 5 min plank finisher

For upper body I'll use both:

Tank Top Arms

Back & Biceps Burnout

For legs I'll use any two of:

Glute & Hip Strength

Runners Strength & Balance

Quick Hit Lower Body

Runner Stability

On occasions I'll look at different workouts to try, but these have been my go to for a few months now.

good job and nice progression. you will make it soon. replace a tempo session with an interval as the coach above mentioned.

you started in 2016 and you train that smart? i am impressed.

The overall idea you have is good.

Some minor adjustments i would consider assuming this is a long term approach rather than an immediate summer goal would be:

Building your Monday to 8-10 miles easy running.

Increasing the work volume of your Tuesday up to 8000m worth of work of intervals, i.e 8 x 1000 off 90s (Aim for 10k pace and progress down), 4 x 2000m off 90s.

Move your tempo to Friday if not racing, up your general easy running mileage to incorporate 6-8 miles easy on the Weds/Thurs.

Also consider rotating your tempo to include a longer gradual effort, in the base phase i did the following cycle for 8/9 weeks

Week 1 - 45 mins @ 6:40s

Wee k 2 - 55 mins @ 6:40s

Week 3- 65 mins @ 6:40s

Before dropping back to 45mins and bringing to pace to 6:30s and starting cycle again. By week 9 i got to 65 mins @ 6:10s feeling comfortable and got my 30 min tempo from 5:50s down to 5:30s.

If its an immediate summer goal i would focus more on the intensity with a slight increase in mileage before resetting this autumn/winter and following that cycle.

MSmith_Runner wrote:

I'll use 2 workouts on each of my workout sessions...

For core workouts mix between two of:

Super Twist Core Series

Core Burner 2.0

Ab Burner

and finish off with 5 min plank finisher

For upper body I'll use both:

Tank Top Arms

Back & Biceps Burnout

For legs I'll use any two of:

Glute & Hip Strength

Runners Strength & Balance

Quick Hit Lower Body

Runner Stability

On occasions I'll look at different workouts to try, but these have been my go to for a few months now.

Skip all of this and save your energy and recovery for actual running workouts.

Some good quality advice here... Will sit and gather it all to come up with immediate and long term plans.

As for skipping the S&C workouts... It all helps prevents injuries and to become a stronger runner. My form and strength have come on massively since adding S&C into my weekly plan. I knock it on the head as I reach 1-2 weeks out from any goal race.

You need some speed work-outs in there, like 2x5x200m.

Plus your intervals need to quicken up a bit. Do 800-1200 for intervals, you can do a bit longer of jog recoveries (2:00). You need to get these a bit faster. 5:47/mile is 18:00 5K, so right now you are racing your 5K at a pace you have almost zero experience in.

Good luck :)

We have a very similar progression.

I also started running in 2016 and got my 5km down from 23:30 to 17:53.

Your last 5km was a PB and you're on a positive progression. Change it up when you hit a brick wall :)

I would assume you're due for a big half PR. 17:00 for 5k would equate to 6:00 pace or so for the half. It's interesting that your training is a lot of strength type intervals. Like others have said I wouldn't do two tempo workouts a week. One workout should be 5k specific -- 4 x mile @ 5k or working down to 5k, 6-7 x 1km, 7-8 x 800, 5 x 1200. Tack on some 200s/400s. For the tempos you can do things like 2-3 x 2 miles, 2 x 3 miles, 4 miles, etc., but don't be afraid to put a longer tempo in with your long run. Build some endurance -- get some long runs with 6-10 miles @ marathon pace.

Good luck!

I ran 4x1600 in 5:24/5ish W/2:00 before running 16:54 in the 5K. This workout was fairly comfortable. If you can do it and feel alright, then you’ll crack it.

Have you raced your 5k yet? Just curious as I’m similar to you in goal & fitness.

Hmm want opinions? I'd change Tuesdays intervals to the same distance. Never have understood ladder type workouts unless it was to add short speed at the end. That's a huge workout also. I'd probably cut it down to 5-8x1k. Then add in 4-6x200s or 400s. I might manipulate the rest period too. Maybe run the 1ks slightly quicker and give myself 90seconds rest. Then the next week the 1ks at same pace but 75 seconds rest. A couple weeks later back down to 60seconds rest.

Could also switch every other week between miles and 1ks. Keep the workouts around the same length though. Something like 3x1k=2xmile.

The only other thing, why 2 days off? You might be better off running Wednesday. Maybe a 4-8 miles very easy-easy. It might help your legs turn around from the workout quicker than being off. Might also do a fast finish or some easy strides after the easy run just to loosen up anything.

Wow. Two tempo workouts a week and one of them is a six mile run at 6 flat pace? Honestly, that would drain me. Thatz almost a 10 k race. Thats a serious sempo run for a 17 min guy.

My advice is to keep one tempo run per week, but add some 1200s repeats on the track at 5k pace or slightly faster with 1:1 rest. Give yourself 2 days rest after your tempo day, though, not just one. So like tempo on Tues, repeats on Frid, long run on Sun. That's your basic bread and butter. All other runs should be easy runs.

Oh, and if you bump your mileage a bit it will help, to. Just be sure to give yourself enough rest. No shame in taking an extra day off or down wek to let yourself recover.