Road Racing and Training Thread - Week Ending 4/14/19 (Boston Edition)

I want to write this down on a paper and post it above my bed. Golden words, Stone. Golden words.

To the ones who achieved your goals, I say eat and drink.

To the ones who had a bump in the road today, give yourselves time to feel bad. But just enough so that you feel really eager to jump on another race.

You all inspire me to do better in this sport. And the beauty of it is that sometimes it is not fair. But we just keep here hammering miles and doing the best we can!

Off to bed now...

Coach Jeff ROC wrote:

cocoon: Coming out tonight? I'd sure love to shake ur hand. Coming to Fenway? Email me.

Sorry Coach - flying out tonight. We will keep meeting virtually until some day I fly to Taipei or you come to the Bay Area.

RRR - Glad to have met you at the expo. I don’t know if I even shared my name. That was a miss from my side. I had a facepalm moment about that when I got back to the hotel. I will send you an email

Everyone else that raced today and met your goals, congratulations to all of you. And commiserations to folks that missed your goals.

Even though I had a bad race, It was a dream-come-true moment for me. I started running in Jan 2013, saw the bombing happen at Boston marathon in April 2013, and decided that I wanted to run the race. Then, while researching for entry, realized that I needed to get way faster - my half PR was 2:11 at that time. I am not the emotional or the verbose type, but had an amazing sense of satisfaction as I turned into Boylston street.

Just after mile 2, I knew that sub 3 was not going to happen. I was running at a much elevated effort to maintain 6:52 pace on the downhill. Readjusted my goal to 3:05, ran the half in close to 1:32:xx. Then as soon as I hit the hills from 16 miles, I knew that walking would be the way to get through this race. Run-walk method got me to a 3:19:59. One of my slowest marathons. I am content, but I intend to run way better in 2020 if I get in.

Cocoon - email me anytime! I just assume your name contains many letters! Glad to meet you as well.

May I got offered a voucher to bounce my flight to tomorrow and I shoulda took it. Will be an epic throw down w coach and stones and OR and sub 6 etc. plus I need to buy sub 6 a beer for closing that thing out like a MFer. Was good seeing everyone. I’m sure there will be many more to come.

(But I’m also glad I came home. R3 likes his routine and misses home)

Congrats on everybody who ran today! That was tough!

My PR going into this race was 2:57 from a year ago. I was in better shape back then; a combination of work and other stuff meant I was running only about 30mpw for much of the buildup until 8 weeks out of the race, when I ramped the training up to 50mpw and did as much as I could in this short time frame. I thought I had a shot at sub 3 in good conditions as today. Enjoyed the bus ride and the start. Went through the half in 1:29:20, pretty much perfect I'd say. Felt good. But I started feeling my quads pretty soon after the halfway point. I knew that was too early with the hills awaiting me. Still maintained a solid pace until Boston College at very high effort admittedly, on 3:00 pace till km30 and 1minute behind at km35. Tried pushing the downhill following Heartbreak Hill, but it was soon clear my quads were way too fried to make up time. Classic Boston I guess! Lesson learned as a rookie. In fact, I had to slow down steadily from 6:50 to 7, to 7:30, to 8min pace at the end. It was getting warm as well but I had to slow down because of my quads. I was glad I could finish without having to walk, came in just below 3:04. Mostly happy, I think I was really lacking the mileage for sub 3 in Boston. It's interesting that on Strava Boston is pretty fast; GAP is equal to pace. But my feeling is that for average Joes like me (pun intended), Boston is slower than other courses, because the hilly course, albeit downhill, just punishes you for not training enough.

I'm already back in CT -- so glad I didn't have to drive myself, that would have been near impossible with my legs. Enjoy the beers in Boston!

Man, some amazing racing and valiant efforts out in Boston today. To those that hit goals, a hearty congrats! To those that had misses, that's what keeps us coming back for more, what keeps us pushing harder, smarter, finding new ways to get better.

My week, though seems to pale in comparison to all those that pushed themselves to the limit today.

Traveled this week, so was just trying to keep my mileage up while not skipping days.

M: 10 miles @ 7:33/mile - Legs felt heavy

Tu: 7.1 miles @ 7:14/mile - Felt a lot better

W: 6 miles @ 7:31/mile - Early AM run b/c was in meetings and dinner all day

Th: 8 miles @ 6:56/mile - Little progression then CD mile - 7:20, 7:31, 7:20, 6:58, 6;37, 6:26, 6:06, 7:08

F: 2 mile WU, 5x1000 with 2:30 active rest, 2.1 CD - 1000's were 3:22, 3:20, 3:20, 3:20, 3:18

Sa: 6.2 miles @ 7:28/mile

Su: 12.2 miles @ 7:37/mile

Week: 58 miles total

Overall a good week considering I was in a hotel for 3 days/nights. Running in Charlotte (which is where I was this week) is pretty nice, they have some nice neighborhoods close to downtown and a nice greenway nearby. Also, NODA neighborhood has some excellent breweries which helps "recovery" in the evenings.

+1. OR - don’t sweat it dude. Boston is really tough to get right the first time. The course. The logistics. The hype. The weird mid-day start. I know few people who have done well at Boston in the first attempt. As you may recall from the Disappointed at NYC Thread, I bombed my first Boston in a big way. I was also using Daniels for the first time, and had high expectations. It was pretty devastating but I regrouped, refocused, and learned from my mistakes. I am certain under stone’s tutelage you will do the same. So keep you chin up and keep moving.

...and remember, BACK-TO-BACK is always an option with wheels like yours.

angryjohnny wrote:

...and remember, BACK-TO-BACK is always an option with wheels like yours.

ESPECIALLY since he was smart enough to stop at 13 or so. But there probably aren't many practical spring marathon choices. Grandma's and Ottawa, but travel challenges, and probably sold out. Any others?

Hm could be an option as well? And yes he was smart to stop.. me toughing it out the last 2 miles of that 15k has me on the DL for a long time now. Should have dropped. FML

No shame in a DNF. I've been there-done that a couple times myself (and in races 50 times shorter than a marathon).

On the general topic of not achieving your goals, my 5k PR is from 2011 and I'm still out here believing I can do better. Can I do it, maybe, but I'm having a lot of fun trying.

Hey everyone.

Won't bore you all with too many details, but a general "race performance" debriefing is in order.

I felt fine through the half, finally breaking 90 (woohoo) and aside from the slightest sense that my quads were a bit more tender than usual at this point in a race, I felt I was ready to take on the second half. As the course gradually rolled through Wellsley, I was giving a bit back on the uphills, but taking it back on the downhills...just not all the way back. And I was working haad to get it back. Going back and looking at the numbers post-race, I ran at an overall HRavg of 184, averaging 187 for the second half and 196 at the finish. So I was definitely working haaaad. By 30km, I was still sub 3, but I did not have anything left to work with on the Newton Hills. It was warm out there when I was in Newton (I expect people in wave one had a better day than people in wave 2... maybe someone like Smoove with several athletes running might have some insight... Wave 1 leaving 25 minutes earlier got farther into the race before the sun came out... Wave 3-4 finished in the RAIN!) I was already redlining and the added stress of the rising temperature was not working in my favor. The last 8km was just trying to hang on for dear life. I confess to not being able to enjoy the wonderful crowd support because I was suffering, my HR at 95% of max for those last miles. It was the hardest I've ever worked at the end of a marathon, and about the worst I can remember feeling at the end of a race. Thank goodness I still had a PR on the table or else I don't know what would have become of that last 3k. Despite the suffering, I did try to enjoy Boylston St., but it was in that kind of "enjoy the pain" mode, not in the "covering your ass with glory" mode. But I took it in, and I did PR, and I have had a truly incredible, memorable, 100% wonderful (no, that's a lie... 95%... I wanted the sub 3) weekend. I'm staying on in Boston for a few more days before heading back to the Asia.

My heartfelt thanks to all of you who shared this cycle with me. Your support, advice and encouragement is so very much appreciated.

Glad I got to hoist a few with a few and sorry that I didn't get to meet even more of the crew.

OK, it's laundry day. See ya.

Some details owed:

Goals: A - 2:40, B - 2:42, C - 2:45

Result: 2:46:07 (50 second PR)

Official splits:

5K - 18:57

10K - no split, est 37:53

15K - 56:45

20K - 1:15:50

Half - 1:19:59

25K - 1:35:56

30K - 1:56:01

20M - 2:05:04

21M - 2:12:02

35K - 2:16:48

40K - 2:37:18

25.2M - 2:39:42

Finish - 2:46:07

Per mile:

6:18, 6:01, 5:59, 6:00, 6:07

6:00, 6:02, 6:09, 6:07, 6:08

6:12, 6:07, 6:07, 6:08, 7:14

6:01, 6:29, 6:36, 6:26, 6:45

6:59, 6:27, 6:41, 6:37, 6:34

6:36, 5:34 (0.2)

Report:

In summary, I was on 2:40 pace for around 14 miles, splitting halfway at exactly 1:19:59. Had stomach problems the whole race, having to have a bad bathroom stop at mile 15. From there, the splits went downhill and I barely scraped by with a 50 second PR.

Miles 1-10

6:18, 6:01, 5:59, 6:00, 6:07, 6:00, 6:02, 6:09, 6:07, 6:08

The first mile was as congested as folks warned, couldn’t really pick up the pace but all in all it wasn’t that bad. Wasted a bit of energy trying not to trip over people. From there, everything up to mile 10 was a blur, and I was feeling pretty strong. Seeing I was on pace for my A goal at mile 10 had me pretty optimistic! Felt like I had to use the bathroom the whole time but I pressed on figuring I could just ignore it till the end like I’ve done in some races past.

Miles 11-16

6:12, 6:07, 6:07, 6:08, 7:14, 6:01

Once I was at around mile 11 the stomach issues really started kicking in hard. I realized I would have to make a pit stop or there was no way I could keep on pace. Spent over a minute at mile 15 doing a gnarly number in the porta-pottie and then continued. Mile 16 was a breezy 6:01 after I was relieved at the stop, but that was the last good mile..

Miles 17-21

6:29, 6:36, 6:26, 6:45, 6:59

Unfortunately, once I hit Newton, I was definitely not feeling good and my legs were not up to the challenge. I’m guessing it was a combination of: stomach issues making my first half effort more than it should have been, taking the first half too quick in general and not respecting the downhill pounding, weather (? not sure here personally but other runners report the heat and humidity being tough). Overall just a slog at this point, my heart rate was dropping but my legs could not go any faster.

Miles 22-26.2

6:27, 6:41, 6:37, 6:34, 6:36, 5:34 (0.2)

Even though the last 10K is nice and downhill into Boston, I had no gas to fuel that fantastic setup. Definitely the toughest race finish I’ve ever had next to my first marathon. Missed all of my goals, but still squeezed in a 50 second PR over my 2018 Chicago time. Nothing to do now but get back in it and hope for a better day in the next race.

I was hoping I'd at least qualify for the Tokyo marathon next year so now I'm juggling a bit with whether to seek another marathon by June, since my next registered is NYC all the way in November.

Shout outs to every single person who took on Boston yesterday, no matter the result! Driven every single day by you awesome people who put in the work and race your hearts out.

Probably scratch that on finding another race to qualify for Tokyo, don't see any easily accessible options on their list of certified races..

Allen1959 wrote:

angryjohnny wrote:

...and remember, BACK-TO-BACK is always an option with wheels like yours.

ESPECIALLY since he was smart enough to stop at 13 or so. But there probably aren't many practical spring marathon choices. Grandma's and Ottawa, but travel challenges, and probably sold out. Any others?

There's New Jersey in 2 weeks, or Pittsburgh in 3. Both are still open (as is Grandma's). Both NJ and Pittsburgh should be easy trips for Outside Runner.

Grandma's is still open, but I think it would be better to take try 2 soon, since you can only stretch out a cycle so long.

Congratulations to everyone who ran the Boston Marathon yesterday! Epic efforts by everyone involved...

44 year old guy, 5'6, 124

PR's (all from 2018) 5K 17:05, 10K 34:52, Half 1:13(downhill)/1:16, Full 2:42 (2018 NYC)

My week of training/racing:

74 miles total

Monday: Treadmill HIIT 4.7@5:34 + Strength/Core/Rowing, Treadmill Easy 6.3@6:49

Tuesday: AM Treadmill HIIT 4.1@5:21 + Strength/Core/Rowing, PM Treadmill Easy 6.2@7:16

Wednesday: Track Workout/Time Trial: WU 2@6:36, 2x5000(16:51, 16:31) with 1600 Rec between(7:19), Recovery 2@8:07 --> 16:31 is my PR for 5000 on the track

Thursday: AM Treadmill HIIT Run 4.9@5:34 + Strength/Core/Rowing, PM Treadmill Easy with Strides 6.3@6:59 (4x20 second strides @ 13, 13.1, 13.2, 13.5 mph)

Friday: AM Treadmill Easy 3.1@7:12, PM Easy/Moderate Trail 6.2@6:59

Saturday: Easy Trail/Road 10@7:28

Sunday: Local 10K Race (only 101 total runners) Epic Fail

I woke up late and had GI issues so I got to the race late and picked up my bib with less than 10 minutes before the start of the race. I got in a very short 0.6 mile warmup @6:52 without any strides. I then realized I forgot to bring my racing shoes (Vaporfly 4%) and had to wear my old, worn out Pegasus 35 trainers(btw these feel really heavy and slow for racing). To add to my problems, I missed the 10K turnaround and ran an extra 0.1 miles before I realized something was wrong and turned around. Despite all of these mishaps, I was leading for nearly the entire race until I got outkicked in the last quarter mile by a younger runner. I ran a 38:15 for 6.4 miles (5:59 overall pace) which was far off my 10K PR of 34:52 and a slower average pace than my last 2 half marathons

Mile splits for the 10K: 5:58, 5:46, 5:57, 6:04, 6:00, 6:09 (5:48 avg pace for last 0.4)

I think if I didn't make any of these dumb mistakes I may have PR'd. Even so, I should have won this race handily if I didn't miss the turnaround or if I ran in the right shoes. Disappointed in myself for failing so hard but I will learn from these mistakes and bounce back in future races.

3.1 miles CD@8:23

darkwave wrote:

Allen1959 wrote:

ESPECIALLY since he was smart enough to stop at 13 or so. But there probably aren't many practical spring marathon choices. Grandma's and Ottawa, but travel challenges, and probably sold out. Any others?

There's New Jersey in 2 weeks, or Pittsburgh in 3. Both are still open (as is Grandma's). Both NJ and Pittsburgh should be easy trips for Outside Runner.

Grandma's is still open, but I think it would be better to take try 2 soon, since you can only stretch out a cycle so long.

Adding in, I thought NJ was a fantastic course! Weather was great, decent crowd support, very flat and fast. I believe they also do bib mailing so you won't have to worry logistics for the expo.

Jot quill: Yes.. Tokyo "Run As One" Semi-Elite Program Qualifying (sub-2:45 for guys regardless of age) requires an IAAF Label marathon (of which there are only a few in America) basically. I got into Tokyo via lottery originally. Although I ran a Tokyo qualifying time at NYC in November, it was too late to apply for Run as One status (which gets you in the A corral) because the Run as One application period ends in early September. I contacted the Tokyo Marathon but they said they could not upgrade me into the Run as One corral as I ran the qualifying time too late. I think getting into the A corral is definitely of benefit as I was the 2000th runner crossing the starting line from the B corral and had to weave through a lot of runners in the first few miles.

Bruin1996 wrote:

Jot quill: Yes.. Tokyo "Run As One" Semi-Elite Program Qualifying (sub-2:45 for guys regardless of age) requires an IAAF Label marathon (of which there are only a few in America) basically. I got into Tokyo via lottery originally. Although I ran a Tokyo qualifying time at NYC in November, it was too late to apply for Run as One status (which gets you in the A corral) because the Run as One application period ends in early September. I contacted the Tokyo Marathon but they said they could not upgrade me into the Run as One corral as I ran the qualifying time too late. I think getting into the A corral is definitely of benefit as I was the 2000th runner crossing the starting line from the B corral and had to weave through a lot of runners in the first few miles.

Ahhh I see! Thanks for the info! Really useful tips. I guess I'll just hold out until I can do Run as One in 2021. I think my only potential option is the Ottawa Marathon in Canada on May 26th, which is actually a little tempting... Only about a 1-2 hour flight from NYC for me. I'll think it over, looks like registration for that is still open for a while.