Sub 4:20 mile?

Dude first of all listen to your coach. I have an athlete similar to you who ran 1:53/4:14 and he probs can just break 52. We do lots on grass, alternations, 3k pace efforts and short fast 150's and 200's. We actually only did 800's as alternations ie fast/float efforts. Run fast 800m in 156/157 then you will know if you can break 4:20. The above runner is a junior his team mate ran 152/407 this season so yea we have a good group.

This is my coaches first year, and he’s asking for workouts. We have not done tempos since XC. He told me that not enough people know what pace to go, so we can’t do it. I’m trying to convince him they are necessary.

Also, I was thrown in an 800 in a last second meet today, and ran 1:59.

57, 62

Good stuff with 800m. Yep you should do threshold work. Before important 6x300 m hill session we always do 1500m threshold first. Your threshold is probably around 3:30 per kilometre or 540-45 per mile. Good luck sorry you have a coach that is new to the sport. The athletes that I mentioned have been working with me 3 and 9 years. No school programs here just private coaching.

Today, I ran the 1600 in 4:38.

My splits were:

1:04

1:07

1:12

1:15

It’s frustrating that my coach is refusing to do any lactate threshold workouts.

I can break 2:00 in the 800 but not 4:35 in the 1600.

Your training is probably missing high end aerobic work. A good session we like to do is either 6x3 min or 6x1k at 320k pace...ie 520 1600m pace with 90 seconds rest or on 5 min cycle. Finish w/5x100 and you should feel good.You started off too fast for your current fitness. Next 1600 try to negative split. A 420 1600m is very good running but don't stress enjoy your training.

Others are saying basically the same thing. You are aerobically weak with fantastic speed. All training requires "support" from both the speed side of race pace and the endurance side. You have so much room to improve on the endurance side that it hardly matters what you do--everything should produce results. What matters is that your key workouts should be on the endurance side. You should stay in touch with your speed, but make those workouts no harder that "moderate," so that you're fresh for other, endurance-focused workouts.

My advice would be to forget about sustained LT runs. I'd do repeats at a pace slightly faster than VT (basically when your breathing gets labored, and very close to LT). 1 mile or even 1k repeats at VT with a 200/400 float recovery (not a jog, but backing off enough that you start to feel good again). I'd also do some of my "easy" runs at just slower than VT.

You can add some speed work at the end of these workouts to practice recruiting fast twitch fibers while tired.

Progressions are also a good tool. For milers, I like the progression to be shorter and steeper. Whereas a marathoner might start as 6 minute pace and work down to 5:40 over the course of 18 miles, you might do 5 miles with 2 at a jog, 1 at a steady pace, and then spend the last two cutting it down to almost mile pace for the last 400.

Your coach is right that 5k/10k pace isn't meaningful for runners at your level because you don't know what those paces really are and because they don't necessarily correspond to the physiological stimuli that more experienced runners get by targeting those paces.

Very hard to say if it'll happen this year with so little time left. People respond at different rates to aerobic training. The summer and next 9 months are a big opportunity.

runner dude larry wrote:

I did a 20min tempo run today.

I attempted to go at 5:45-6:00 but ended up at 6:19.

This sums up your issues with anything over 1K. I was a 4:16 HSer who had similar speed (52/1:57), but was more strength based. Unless your tempo was hilly or on uneven terrain, you should be at or around 5:30-5:45 pace for a 20 minute go. Another good indicator for me was 10 miles in 60 minutes. A hard effort for sure, but always in control and never red-lined. I also raced a lot of 3200s and 3Ks early on in the track season.

I agree with the other posters that there is no need to rush this. You've got the most important component of a fast mile; speed. See to your strength and be patient.

You also may want to take a few legit cracks @ some fast 800 races. I see 1:55 or faster potential with your speed and this may be your best event. Regardless, working both ends of it will only help you over 4 laps.

Thanks for responding everyone.

About the 800s, I’ll see about taking a shot at them, it’s originally what I wanted to do but I was told I should be a miler.

Today I did 6x1k with 90 sec rest

3:24

3:28

3:27

3:29

3:26

3:22

Then I did 5x50m striders

These were on the track, and it was a lot nicer weather today. Felt real good. Breathing but not dying.

Thank you all for your input, I appreciate it!!

My coach finally decided to give us some of those 1ks and 1600s this week

I ran a 4:35 today. Splits:

1:09

1:09

1:12

1:05

After looking at my mileage, for the past month I was averaging 18ish, so I'm going to bump that up. (The most I have ever done is 40).

You need to 35-40 at the minimum and probably too late in the season. Keep enjoying your running and hopefully you have another season in HS. If not keep running in college. Good luck!

runner dude larry wrote:

I ran a 4:35 today. Splits:

1:09

1:09

1:12

1:05

After looking at my mileage, for the past month I was averaging 18ish, so I'm going to bump that up. (The most I have ever done is 40).

That looks good, closing in 65 indicates you just need to get in a faster race and you can take a crack at sub 430.

How much time do you have left this season? I wouldn't bump up mileage too much if you're in the last month, keep doing the controlled strength workouts though. After the track season is over I would try to build up to 45-50mpw.

My final meet is June 9th. I think I could build on my mileage a little bit and maybe get to 25-30ish.

Today I did 1200m warm up then

4x800 @ 2:13 with 3min rest, about 5 minutes later I paced one of my teammates and got him sub 6, felt strong still.

That is a good session but here is what I would have possibly done a little bit differently if working with someone trying to break 4:20 with about 4-5 weeks left in the season and as your hardest session for the week

3x800 in 2:20-2:23 with 90 seconds rest ie 3k pace

3 min rest

3x400 at goal pace ie 64-66 seconds for you with 1 min rest 1600m pace

3 min rest

4x200 in 29-30 seconds with 1 min rest 800m pace running the last one maybe in 26-27

Keep your mileage up and nothing wrong with a short session of hill repeats in your training.

So after my run yesterday, I noticed the back of my foot was catching with either no pain or dull pain. It just feels off. It very rarely hurts and when it does it’s not bad at all.

It feels to the outside/back of my foot and I don’t know why it’s happening.

I’m seeing the trainer tomorrow, but Id like some feedback from you guys.

What do you think this is? What should I do? It’s making me anxious