Would Houlihan have beaten Klosterhalfen today?

I don't think Hassan is doing any indoor races this season.

Muir will want to defend both her titles. I don't think Klosterhalfen will race both distances at the indoor EC but she is probably the only one with a chance to challenge Muir on her home turf although the latter is probably still the favorite.

It would have been a good race. Despite that Shelby raced US Cross last weekend, her and the Bowerman babes did virtually all of their training together. From Instagram, Grace and Quigley did a few sharpening workouts but not many. Shelby is certainly in better shape than them. How much better shape? We don’t know. But likely sub-4:20

I did not expect such a clear result although considering that it was the first indoor race of the year for Quigley and Grace and the relative PBs etc. of Klosterhalfen and these two, it was actually not all that surprising. Quigley ran a PB of several seconds, she could hardly expect to prevail against a runner in good shape who has a 4 sec. better PB over 1500m.

By similar reasoning Houlihan would have been a favorite and would probably have been a tough race.

Spec wrote:

jhand366 wrote:

Sorry, hope you enjoy your miserable life. Goodbye.

Or you could try and learn English.

It’s try TO learn English, not try AND learn English, dipshit

Klosterhalfen would've destroyed Houlihan. She took the pace herself because the rabbit couldn't run fast enough.

She was not remotely tired at the end of the race. Contrast how she looked with how Kejelcha looked over the last lap and after the finish.

*stipe wrote:

Klosterhalfen would've destroyed Houlihan. She took the pace herself because the rabbit couldn't run fast enough.

She was not remotely tired at the end of the race. Contrast how she looked with how Kejelcha looked over the last lap and after the finish.

I don't know about this. Houlihan looked awfully strong in Tallahassee.

Salazar used to have the ambition to train Americans to win gold. Now, he seems to be trying to train Europeans and Africans to win, at least if he doesn't think he has an American medal contender in the event. Even Rupp asked when Salazar was considering Bekele about whether he'd lost any desire for Americans to win. He's got Hassan and Klosterhalfen now and the latter will improve as surely as the former did, maybe even outdoing Houlihan eventually. I do not think the basic speed will ever be there, but the "strength" will be augmented enough to be tough to stick with after a year of this training.

I don't know, but she could have broken her in two!

*stipe wrote:

Klosterhalfen would've destroyed Houlihan. She took the pace herself because the rabbit couldn't run fast enough.

I think in a year or two, perhaps that will be possible. I think Houlihan is still stronger AND faster overall at the moment.

A couple of years of maturing for Klosterhalfen can change that.

Pot calling kettle black wrote:

Spec wrote:

Or you could try and learn English.

It’s try TO learn English, not try AND learn English, dipshit

Actually, both are correct and mean different things.

Your version means "you could try to learn English."

My version means "you could (at least) try and (could) learn English."

zxcvzxcv wrote:

Salazar used to have the ambition to train Americans to win gold. Now, he seems to be trying to train Europeans and Africans to win, at least if he doesn't think he has an American medal contender in the event. Even Rupp asked when Salazar was considering Bekele about whether he'd lost any desire for Americans to win. He's got Hassan and Klosterhalfen now and the latter will improve as surely as the former did, maybe even outdoing Houlihan eventually. I do not think the basic speed will ever be there, but the "strength" will be augmented enough to be tough to stick with after a year of this training.

Does anyone have a serious, non stand up routine answer for this? Mo Farah was one thing but why all of the foreign runners in NOP? If you go to the NOP site it still says the following on Al Sal's page:

"In witnessing the decline of American distance running, employed at Nike, Salazar made it his mission to resuscitate a dying presence. Thus, the Oregon Project was born and with it the return of American distance running."

Would have been a great race. I like Houlihan if she's within striking distance on the last lap, and I think it's likely she would be. It is possible that KK would have just run away from her, though.

I'd say SH beats KK 7/10 times right now.

wtfbbq wrote:

*stipe wrote:

Klosterhalfen would've destroyed Houlihan. She took the pace herself because the rabbit couldn't run fast enough.

I think in a year or two, perhaps that will be possible. I think Houlihan is still stronger AND faster overall at the moment.

A couple of years of maturing for Klosterhalfen can change that.

In a slower race, I like Houlihan's odds a lot more. The power she puts down is amazing.

But in a fast race, I think Klosterhalfen can go 4:15-4:16. Maybe Houlihan can right now?

Slow Bro wrote:

Would have been a great race. I like Houlihan if she's within striking distance on the last lap, and I think it's likely she would be. It is possible that KK would have just run away from her, though.

I'd say SH beats KK 7/10 times right now.

Sounds reasonable. I think they have only once raced against each other (Berlin ISTAF 2017) but this was before Houlihan became really good. Last summer Koko would not have had a chance after her injury.

Jerry's master plan wrote:

"You can't lose if you don't race" -the BTC motto

POTD

zxcvzxcv wrote:

Shelby's 800m pr is from when? It's irrelevant to the kick, but she'll run 1:58 or better this year if she tries.

We're talking about the kick and Houlihan's 12-13 finish at USA's was far, far beyond any kick Klosterhalfen has ever been capable of doing.

Completely irrelevant and meaningless. You start by boosting her 800 pr, just to justify your argument. You have already devalued her endurance by saying she'd sit on her and out kick her.

If she could have she would have. But has she?

Jo72 wrote:

Sounds reasonable. I think they have only once raced against each other (Berlin ISTAF 2017) but this was before Houlihan became really good. Last summer Koko would not have had a chance after her injury.

Both raced the 3000m at 2018 World Indoors too where Klosterhalfen payed for staying with the leaders and therefore was overtaken by Houlihan in the last part of the race.

Personally I don't think Klosterhalfen stands a chance against Houlihan right now. Koko's performance certainly was impressive, but there is no reason to think Houlihan couldn't hold 4:20-pace, so she probably would have easily outkicked her with a sub30s last lap as Koko never ever won a sprint.

jhand366 wrote:

I can’t help but wonder what woulda happened if Houlihan had been in the Wanamaker mile today. Would she of beat Klosterhalfen? Klosterhalfen looks insane right now. After what she did to Jenny in the 5000m and now what she did today, she seems to be on the same level as Houlihan. Am I wrong?

The other question is, would Klosterhalfen have run as well if she was being dogged by Houlihan. As someone - I think maybe Frank Horwill - said "no one is happier than a front-runner who has broken away." If you are a runner like Klosterhalfen, you gain strength from the feeling that you have broken the field, and it's likely that you run a lot better than if you are still being hunted with 200m to go (and Klosterhalfen, nor any other woman at the moment, is good enough to drop Houlihan without running a pace that is not going to make them fold too). Think about Dave Bedford, who was magnificent when he was running solo, having broken the field, but was never anywhere near as effective if the competition hung on to him.

With a similar way of arguing one could claim that Klosterhalfen would have pushed harder in the second half with someone tailing her. While it is true that she seems to prefer frontrunning she has done quite well in races where she could not gap the field, especially in 2017 in the DL 3000m in Birmingham, also in her first sub 4 1500 in Rome.