Increasing of the amount of people quiting veganism: (formerly the vegan runner on YouTube has quit veganism)

YMMV wrote:

To the supposed healthy old guy: you have no idea what it is to be injury-free until you eat adequate amounts of meat, eggs and fish and ditch the grains, soy, potatoes and vegetable oils. It is almost impossible to get sore from workouts anymore (and I am running hard anaerobic track sessions in spikes, age 62). As a high-carb athlete I was always one step from the next injury setback. My ankles were chronically puffy due to inflammation, a sign that the circulatory system is under seige. This was all eating "whole grains" and fruits and vegetables only. All that is gone with the methane-scented wind.

Hilarious. 99% of world class athletes eat a high carb diet with many of the foods you say are basically poison. Stop, just stop.

And for every self-obsessed dude like you (oh, I am a SUPER man now!) who claims it's all because of his high meat/low carb diet, there are others that say the *same exact things* about their switch to vegetarian diet from a high meat/high fat diet: it changed their life, they never get sick, they set all new pr's, they last all night in bed, they've gotten taller, their teeth are pure white, their penis is bigger, they can time travel now.

You are insane.

Vegan restaurants, shops, and cafes are springing up everywhere, even in Eastern Europe, even in the Ukraine. There must be a huge market for it, even if most of the customers are probably not strict vegans but simply trying something 'healthy' occasionally.

Veganism is a cult. As far as animal welfare is concerned, there is no need to be vegan so long as you purchase free-range eggs etc.

I've been a vegetarian since the age of five. Now I'm nearly 50 and have a physique better than probably 99.99% of non-trt/roided dudes my age. I took up hobby jogging at the start of the year and despite a number of injuries am close to breaking 60 seconds for 400m and 6 minutes for the mile. Vegetarianism is certainly healthy, veganism is not.

Tyrone ReXXXing wrote:

(full page of dog vomit)

[quote]

Looks like the Head Poo-Flinger just woke up. Thanks for bringing nothing but your ad hominem effluvium to the table. Enjoy your descent into irrelevance.

YMMV wrote:

Humans are not made to eat carbs even every day...

What a ludicrous statements. All of the longest lived humans on the planet "eat carbs every day." 99.9% of the best athletes in the world, "eat carbs every day." 99.9% of the most jacked body builders you've ever seen..."eat carbs every day." But sure, the idiot YMMV tells humans were "not made" (whatever that means) to do this. Hilarious.

Here is a steak eater (in fact, prior to this specific fight, he was beefing up on....BEEF...."steak for breakfast" as his coach put it, because he was moving up 2 weight classes) tapping out to a....wait for it... long time vegan !!. Watch it and weep......with laughter. (and picture, at the same time, YMMV tapping out to me in this debate, or a real fight, or a race, or all of the above)

Coevett wrote:

Vegan restaurants, shops, and cafes are springing up everywhere, even in Eastern Europe, even in the Ukraine. There must be a huge market for it, even if most of the customers are probably not strict vegans but simply trying something 'healthy' occasionally.

Veganism is a cult. As far as animal welfare is concerned, there is no need to be vegan so long as you purchase free-range eggs etc.

I've been a vegetarian since the age of five. Now I'm nearly 50 and have a physique better than probably 99.99% of non-trt/roided dudes my age. I took up hobby jogging at the start of the year and despite a number of injuries am close to breaking 60 seconds for 400m and 6 minutes for the mile. Vegetarianism is certainly healthy, veganism is not.

The fact that the free market has begun catering to people of ALL DIETS and LIFESTYLE doesn't mean that the media promotes veganism. It means that there is a new market that can be tapped into. Simple economics. The government certainly isn't on board with a vegan diet. By the same logic: there is a market for Japanese business men to buy old underwear, does that mean that the media promotes it or that it is accepted by society? It certainly does not.

Big claim there about vegetarian diets being healthier than vegan ones. Got any proof? I'm genuinely curious which studies you could possibly be referring to besides your personal experience of n=1.

YMMV wrote:

Looks like the Head Poo-Flinger just woke up. Thanks for bringing nothing but your ad hominem effluvium to the table. Enjoy your descent into irrelevance.

Lol!! "ad hominem" is all you've brought at Sage and vegans. I know 100x more about this than you. Trust me.

(unlike you, I am not a diet cultist. I think meat can be a healthy part of diets, and vegans can be extremely healthy. YOU are the EXTREMIST)

I was vegitarian for almost two years and vegan for half of that. Started dating this beautiful girl but was having problems with my little man. One night I couldn't perform and it wasn't after I had came 4 times the day or night before. I just had nothing down there.

I thought about my diet and realized being vegitarian the only thing I was conscious about in my diet was not eating meat, yet I sometimes had to force myself to eat what I now deem junk just to get adequate calories, and even then I still wasn't eating enough. And yes I took a lot of poops.

I went to a Mediterranean grill and ate my first piece of meat in two years the next day. Thought it'd be awful but it was incredibly delicious. Now I'm doing Intermittent Fasting usually eating all my calories in a 4 hour window everyday except Sunday, so I can have one cheat day for peace of mind. Six days a week, my diet is mostly protein but I still eat root vegetables as I'm not convinced on full keto diet and its possible negative impact on testosterone levels.

That girl is now my wife and we have great sex at least three times a day. She loves my meat too.

Tyrone ReXXXing wrote:

YMMV wrote:

Looks like the Head Poo-Flinger just woke up. Thanks for bringing nothing but your ad hominem effluvium to the table. Enjoy your descent into irrelevance.

Lol!! "ad hominem" is all you've brought at Sage and vegans. I know 100x more about this than you. Trust me.

(unlike you, I am not a diet cultist. I think meat can be a healthy part of diets, and vegans can be extremely healthy. YOU are the EXTREMIST)

You are seriously unhinged, your meds are clearly off today.

And by the way, as the all-seeing prophet that you are, what exactly is my "diet cult"?

4/10

Trust the Medical Pros wrote:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(18)32971-4/fulltext

Great resource— thanks for sharing. I don’t think YMMV and others are willing to listen or read, though. They’ve got their high fat doctors, like Mark Hyman, the now de-licensed Shawn Baker, and Atkins to pull poorly designed short term and inaccurate (or none) data from. This thread is just a microcosm of the problem all debates face: no one goes into the debate with an open curiousity about the other side’s points. Thereby, no ones willing to be “wrong” and learn anything new or admit that they learned anything new.

The data does not exist to EXACTLY support a strict vegan diet, but that’s just because the data isn’t widely available yet beyond case studies and other observer blinded ones. However, a look at large epidemiology studies (EPIC, Adventist Health Studies) show that a diet with as little meat as possible (or none) is associated with less chronic disease, lower BMI, and a slew of other positive health markers. The healthier way to go along the spectrum of no meat to only meat is to be as close to no meat as possible.

Furthermore, the staggering amount of randomized trials directly investigating the effect animals, products, fats, have on the human body cannot be ignored when viewed from the context of large population studies that occur over decades. The shift towards less meat is coming. No one can fight it forever.

Hey Captain Poo-Flinger Reexxxing: So now you are posting under multiple names to avoid my question. Keep up the ad hominem, it suits your narcissistic rage.

Actually I’m not him— I’m the guy who started posting research on page 3 with “Very Wrong”. Also “narcissistic rage” is pretty funny. I’m also the same person who dispelled your idea that veganism is promoted by the media lol. See above.

My Own Meat Up wrote:

That girl is now my wife and we have great sex at least three times a day. She loves my meat too.

Suuuure.

YMMV wrote:

It is illegal to eat beef there, despite the vast number of cows. So they might as well all be veg-heads.

It is not illegal to eat beef in all parts of India. I eat it with nearly every meal whenever I am there.

For religious reasons, some states in India do ban or restrict the slaughter of cattle and possession of cow, bull or calf meat. It is generally OK to slaughter buffalo in those states. It is OK to slaughter cattle in some of the southern areas of India.

this guy is what you base your judgement on? He's clearly a moron with no knowledge of nutrition

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7nx4xSPaA0&t=463s

im not surprised he felt sick if that's what he considered to be a healthy diet, and no wonder his teeth are falling apart...

Tyrone ReXXXing: meat destroys your health and veganism is the ideal diet.

Veganism in practice:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFnkWjmvMOA

Just listen to some ex-vegans:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4JzgDhCwfc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkCVIdOGYWo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgYKOJScIUI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAdTjIz7rRc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1djjHLnpPfI

But I guess they all did veganism wrong or something.

The whole health of meat vs non meat diet is predicated on protein and building muscle, although runners tend to be very lean and have less muscle mass than say football players or whatever, the sport we all participate in still requires muscle and plant based proteins are far inferior of the amino acids to build muscle.

That said "the Japanese" comment, incredibly wrong. The Japanese eat tofu, I do as well, but they also eat a SUBSTANTIAL amount of fish which is incredibly efficient source of protein.

However, this conversation has turned against Sage, and are personal attacks against him, which isn't right. He believes in his lifestyle and has ran a 2:19 marathon. I realize this is letsrun and everyone here has ran 2:05 and are competing with Kipchoge, but that's a seriously fantastic time.

I was just putting out the science that I have researched and tested on the meat vs non meat diet nothing more nothing less. If someone wants to be vegan for moral or ethical reasons that's fantastic and way to live and follow your beliefs. Or if they just don't like meat, then let them do that.