3100: Run And Become

This has been discussed quite a bit on other forums.... the best way to measure the caliber of the 3100 course record is with Wolfgang Schwerk. He's ranked 2nd all time for 24 hours with 171 miles. He held the course record for the 3100 miler for 9 years until the Finnish Runner Aalto beat it in 2015. Aalto is legit.

I don't disagree that other pros might do well also, but Schwerk is a monster ... and he demolished the previous 3100 record... until Aalto beat his by a full day in 2015.

Also, arguably the best multiday runner ever, Yannis Kourous set a 1000 mile record (10 days, 10 hours) quite a few decades ago and no one has come close since. That's about 96 miles a day. And he was probably running 21 hours a day. No one has come close to that, again, so the idea of someone doing 100+ miles a day for 30 days is kind of out of the question.

Could someone do 80 miles a day and finish the race in 38-39 days? Yeah, probably. 85 miles a day (36 days). Yeah. But Schwerk had to run the 3100 a couple times before really excelling... So maybe a Mike Wardian or a Tim Olson or Camille Herron could do really well, but Aalto's record is no joke.

It’s fascinating how Aalto was able to surpass Schwerk’s time after several attempts. I always think there is vast, often hidden, talent for running out there. One must praise the organizers for their vision and belief. They change lives, truly.

Another edition recently ended with 7 of 8 finishing. I usually google 3100 mile race.

Once I was one of them. It’s still very touching to read the reports. One guy did 89 miles in a day & the course is only open 18 hours & in the middle of such a constant grind, that’s massive.

Congrats to one & all, but especially the organizers. Someday they will wonder if it really happened.

JoeRunnerz wrote:

Could someone do 80 miles a day and finish the race in 38-39 days? Yeah, probably. 85 miles a day (36 days). Yeah. But Schwerk had to run the 3100 a couple times before really excelling... So maybe a Mike Wardian or a Tim Olson or Camille Herron could do really well, but Aalto's record is no joke.

Camille Herron could never finish this race. She has even trouble finishing a 24 hour race without going into a hospital. She also has the wrong attitude. She would not last a week. That's for sure.

The SCMT 3100 mile race needs a more monk like person to be successful. Big egos will get crushed there on this tough concrete course around the block in the heat of the Summer in Queens, NY.

You clearly haven't seen Camille race. I saw her at Desert Solstice for both of her World Records, and she epitomizes grit. She's a machine.

Aravaipa at Central High wrote:

You clearly haven't seen Camille race. I saw her at Desert Solstice for both of her World Records, and she epitomizes grit. She's a machine.

Desert Solstice was Camille's best 24 hour race. At the Lhotse 24 hour race she ended up in the Hospital in 2018.

She also dropped out of Desert Solstice in 2017 before she reached 100 miles.

If you google images and Camille Herron and Lhotse 24 hours you find a facebook entry.

It reads like this:

U.S. National 24 Hour Running Team

March 17, 2018 ·

Camille Herron always finds a way to smile through life's ups and downs.

We hoped she would be smiling now entering into the 19th hour at the Lhotse 24-Hour Endurance Challenge.

We didn't expect to see Camille smiling tonight from a local hospital.

During today's race she was consulting with her doctor in Oklahoma City. She had bladder problems from the start, wasn't sweating and had pain in her lower back. Her husband and coach, Conor Holt noted a few times she just didn't look like her normal relaxed self while running. Despite this, she was still cranking out consistent sub-8 minute miles for 9 hours. However, Camille, her doctor and Conor decided to call it a day at hour 11.

Conor took her to the ER where she was admitted into the hospital. She had an IV and blood work done, suspecting a kidney issue. Thankfully her kidneys are fine, but the doctors discovered her creatine kinase (CK)* level was high and they want to see it flushed out. Camille will be spending tonight in the hospital. She is expected to make a full recovery.

Hey dumb@ss she set the 12 hr World Record at Desert Solstice in 2017 and other records en route. She stopped after getting the 12 hour record. Way to distort facts. So what if it it takes a few tries for 24 hours? Not sure what you’re trying to prove here. She didn’t just barely complete 24 hours. She broke the World Record and fought hard for it. I was there and it was impressive.

jesseriley wrote: It’s fascinating how Aalto was able to surpass Schwerk’s time after several attempts. I always think there is vast, often hidden, talent for running out there. One must praise the organizers for their vision and belief. They change lives, truly.

It took Aalto more than 10 attempts, and he already had significant multiday experience going into the event before his first 3100 attempt. He just completed the race (winning it in the process) for the 15th time, a staggering achievement in and of itself. To tolerate the summer weather, and not have a single awful day from which you cannot recover is remarkable - to be a back of the packer one must average a minimum of 59.6 miles per day for 52 consecutive days. That is not to say he had no issues; a race this long produces inevitable issues one cannot anticipate. But the fact that Aalto could show up out of shape, run himself into shape, suffer some dehydration (which normally produces several low mileage days after) and other physical ailments, is testament to Aalto, not the ease of the race. It takes extraordinary physical ability, durability, flexibility and mental ease, strong fortitude, and positive disposition to do well. An enormous asset Sri Chinmoy disciples and others who find spirituality in their running who race the 3100 have is finding meaning and purpose through all of the inevitable undulations of the race.

As mentioned before, Schwerk is one of the few over 170 miles for 24 hours (perhaps #2 at the time, but certainly not now). Better stated, he's one of the few over 1000 km for 6 days, and was considered one of Kouros' few credible competitors. Other prominent race competitors included Rimas Jakeleitas, who split 600+ miles for 6 day enroute in a 10 day race in which he was trying to hit 1,000 miles. He came nowhere near Schwerk's mark, and Aalto lowered Schwerk's mark by about 23 hours, producing 40 days 9 hours >> 76.6 miles per day, a staggering feet.

A very recent conversation with the chief Sri Chinmoy statistician and Andy Milroy, both of whom have observed Kouros and the like run, had them agreeing that the limit a runner could likely cover 80 miles per day would be about 1500 miles. When we're discussing distances like these, leg speed matters, but I'm far from convinced that a 2:10 marathoner would do any better than the likes of a Kouros, etc.

The trouble with Aalto is that he really hasn't pursued with any vigor any standard fixed time event, such as 6 days. A few years ago he ran 83X for 10 days (not a standard distance), splitting 53X for 6 days in bad weather and while battling bronchitis. He might pursue it in the future, but it could be argued he's past his physical multiday prime. We honestly don't know - we shall (hopefully) see.

jesseriley wrote: Another edition recently ended with 7 of 8 finishing. I usually google 3100 mile race.

Once I was one of them. It’s still very touching to read the reports. One guy did 89 miles in a day & the course is only open 18 hours & in the middle of such a constant grind, that’s massive.

Congrats to one & all, but especially the organizers. Someday they will wonder if it really happened.

It was a banner year for finishers. A lower number of competitors than usual, but high number of finishers. Some outstanding performances. The sole non-finisher was battling terrible shin splints hobbling around the course for 3.5 weeks with his toes in a sling, and he still nearly ran 2800 miles.

The 89 mile fellow is the sole runner other than Aalto to toe the line 15 times (though he's only finished a fraction of them). Of the group he has unquestionably the best leg speed, but he often pays for it recovering for a few days. So as concerns what a fast runner could do, he is an example what would happen certainly to some of them. They might be able to produce a big mileage day, but then spend days recovering, swinging like a pendulum and ultimately a lot worse off than someone who can produce steady quality mileage.

Aravaipa at Central High wrote: You clearly haven't seen Camille race. I saw her at Desert Solstice for both of her World Records, and she epitomizes grit. She's a machine.

Camille is an extraordinary talent. She's run one 24 hour race - a phenomenal result at that, but still, one race. Any thoughts of how she might do is conjecture until she runs a (ideally several) multiday races (we're talking closer to a week than 72 hours). The body and mind are subject to an entirely different kind and level of stress in multiday races. She's expressed theoretical interest but she has any number of good directions to pursue.

I'm eager to seeing the world 24 hour champs which will hopefully feature her, a healthy Courtney Dauwalter, Patrycja Bereznowksa, and Kati Nagy. We are in a golden age of womens 24 hour racing. Those not tuning in are missing something special, and some incredible strides in womens athletics.

Thanks! Your eyes on these performances yields great insight.

Aravaipa at Central High wrote:

Hey dumb@ss she set the 12 hr World Record at Desert Solstice in 2017 and other records en route. She stopped after getting the 12 hour record. Way to distort facts. So what if it it takes a few tries for 24 hours? Not sure what you’re trying to prove here. She didn’t just barely complete 24 hours. She broke the World Record and fought hard for it. I was there and it was impressive.

Yes her World Record over 24 hour is impressive. Everything else around her not so much.

It will be interesting if she can have an impact at the Worlds in France this year.

I can imagine it will be a no show.

Camille has 2 WCs, Comrades, and a few major WRs, if memory serves. Check her sheet on DUV website. Of course, the many DNFs aren’t listed, but that’s true of anyone.

Reprezentacja Polski skopie tyłek Camille Herron w Albi we Francji.

Disagree. Comments like this are baseless. She radiates joy and has been nothing but gracious, friendly, and supportive of the other runners and volunteers at Desert Solstice. We’ve loved having her. Not out of the realm to predict she wins another World title.

Best of luck, Patricia! May the best woman win.

Aravaipa at Central High wrote:

Disagree. Comments like this are baseless. She radiates joy and has been nothing but gracious, friendly, and supportive of the other runners and volunteers at Desert Solstice. We’ve loved having her. Not out of the realm to predict she wins another World title.

Of course you do.

WR's are great to bump up race fees. Just ask Steve Durbin from Tunnel Hill.

At the end it's all about the $$$.

JoeRunnerz wrote:

Could someone do 80 miles a day and finish the race in 38-39 days? Yeah, probably. 85 miles a day (36 days). Yeah. But Schwerk had to run the 3100 a couple times before really excelling... So maybe a Mike Wardian or a Tim Olson or Camille Herron could do really well, but Aalto's record is no joke.

Wardian, Olson and Herron have ZERO multi day experience.

Predicting that they would do well is like saying a good 1500 meter runner would crush the marathon.