Toni Reavis is upset 2018 Chicago field is loaded. Sounds like he wants to see Mo vs Galen match race

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rojo

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 4:12pm CDT

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Interesting piece is out by our friend Toni Reavis.

Reavis wrote:

Here is a natural rivalry that people might actually want to see, that can be marketed, Galen versus Mo, and then they go lard it up with all these admittedly fast extras who do nothing but steal the spotlight from the one thing that might get people to stop and pay attention. Why? Cause we’ve always done it this way?....

This sport is dying for attention of the right sort. You think anybody cares if Kenneth Kipkemoi runs in Chicago 2018 besides Mrs. Kipkemoi? Remember when the pacer Ben Kimondiu didn’t drop out in Chicago 2001 and kept all-time great Paul Tergat from the Chicago winner’s circle? Sometimes more is less.

https://tonireavis.com/2018/08/10/chicago-2018-too-many-candidates-on-the-ballot/

I don't agree with Toni on this one. The problem with setting up a match race is if one of them pulls a Jordan Hasay and withdraws at the last minute, then you are left with nothing. Same thing if one of them gets sick.
kjjhkjhjks

1 year ago 08/10/2018 4:49pm CDT
re: rojo

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Yeah the marathon is not great for a match race, and even if it were, Toni is implying what, that these guys are the 7th and 8th fastest guys in the world at the moment and they need to be protected from the big guns? People want to see the best in the world race.
coach

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 4:52pm CDT
re: rojo

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I remember looking forward to the great duel in the 2003 wc 5000 between El G and Bekele. The beauty of the sport is the opportunity for someone else like Kipchoge to rise to the occasion. Let Rupp and Mo beat everyone not just each other.
Mo and Galen

1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:05pm CDT
re: rojo

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKJkfE1M9wA
Sand Dunes

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:11pm CDT
re: Mo and Galen

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Mo and Galen wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKJkfE1M9wA

😂😂😂
red glare

1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:11pm CDT
re: rojo

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Toni apparently thinks the WMM should be run like a boxing federation. Thank god it isn't.

red glare

1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:15pm CDT
re: Mo and Galen

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Mo and Galen wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKJkfE1M9wA

That went about as well as Reebok's running shoe sales over the past decade. I don't know how one company can keep coming up with such bad ideas.
thinking about this

1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:22pm CDT
re: coach

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coach wrote:

I remember looking forward to the great duel in the 2003 wc 5000 between El G and Bekele. The beauty of the sport is the opportunity for someone else like Kipchoge to rise to the occasion. Let Rupp and Mo beat everyone not just each other.

For people like us, I agree with this. Someone like Geoffrey Kirui is fascinating to me because he could be the best in the world, but he's a total unknown to anyone who isn't a pretty big fan. And even to someone like me, I know nothing about the guy on a personal level, or even really what he looks like or his racing tactics. Someone like Dickson Chumba takes this to another level. And Chumba is a FANTASTIC runner.

Face it: it's much more exciting if you know who the competitors are, well enough to either root for them or against them. Of elite male marathoners, very few of them would appeal this way to the semi-fan crowd:

Farah
Rupp
Kipchoge (he's the Breaking-2 guy, right?)
Kawauchi

And even for us, who is EXCITING. Who if you imagine them kicking it in to win do you say "whoa, he did it!" or "yes!" or "fvck that guy". Beyond those four, maybe:

Bekele
Kipsang
Kamworor
G. Kirui
Tadesse
Karoki
Choge
Adola

Certainly there are other possibilities (Webb is back, baby!) But of men who actually have a chance to win, very few do we relate to.

We all think the best thing to do is to introduce the runners to fans better. Reavis is suggesting another solution. His is much worse, imo, but ours isn't exactly working...
have to beat the best to be the best

1 year ago 08/10/2018 5:22pm CDT
re: rojo

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Thank goodness this isn’t set up as another race for Galen or Mo to win easy. They aren’t the best unless they actually beat the best. They only do well when the number of Africans they race are limited or not top quality. Now they have competition. Let’s see what they’re made of!
wejo

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 6:48pm CDT
re: have to beat the best to be the best

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I disagree with Toni.

They can still market the sh** out of Mo and Galen.

If you have other people in the race (which is totally needed for the marathon) even better. And other people are often needed when one of the major people has an injury or doesn't run well. I'm surprised Chicago spent as much money on the others but maybe they come cheaper than I thought.
richrod

1 year ago 08/10/2018 6:52pm CDT
re: rojo

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Toni should take over the West Wyoming Marathon and could invite the kind of field he wants to see race.
Maybe blind

1 year ago 08/10/2018 6:57pm CDT
re: rojo

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Anyone know why Rupp is not listed in the elite field that that was released yesterday?

https://assets-chicagomarathon-com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/080818_2018-BACCM-International-Field.pdf

Quincyschmidt

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 7:22pm CDT
re: Maybe blind

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Rupp is not the focus of this most recent press release because he was already announced, a few weeks ago.
Avocado's Number

1 year ago 08/10/2018 8:01pm CDT
re: rojo

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rojo wrote:
I don't agree with Toni on this one. The problem with setting up a match race is if one of them pulls a Jordan Hasay and withdraws at the last minute, then you are left with nothing. Same thing if one of them gets sick.

I thought Toni's response to that objection was pretty funny -- and, I'll admit, refreshingly un-PC-ish:

"Well, that’s why you still have a women’s race and the wheelchair push-rim division to serve as a backup."

Toni may be right about what attracts a broad audience. As he pointed out, Nike’s Breaking2 Project was very successful in attracting a big audience to watch a single, focused story for two hours. Kipchoge came through, more or less. A few purists like me may have considered it a contemptible marketing gimmick, but it basically accomplished what Nike wanted.

I'd much rather see an unpaced race, but I'm glad to see that Chicago has added some depth, even if -- as Toni fears -- it continues to allow "anonymous, interchangeable champions to come and go like ghosts."
kmaclam

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1 year ago 08/10/2018 9:51pm CDT
re: Avocado's Number

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I'm actually with Toni on this one. I don't think he's suggesting that just Mo & Galen are on the start line, but sheesh, when will this egotistical NY vs. Chicago 'my fields deeper than your field' thing ever end. Do we really need Mo & Galen completely obscured for the bulk of the race by 11 other participants in the lead phalanx. Not including how many pacers? Of course Tiger vs. Phil will be a marketing gimmick also, but here gimmick is code for: genius, $$$, eyeballs, ad revenue, viewership, ratings....
Do you think hesaurus?

1 year ago 08/10/2018 10:14pm CDT
re: thinking about this

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thinking about this wrote:

For people like us, I agree with this. Someone like Geoffrey Kirui is fascinating to me because he could be the best in the world, but he's a total unknown to anyone who isn't a pretty big fan. And even to someone like me, I know nothing about the guy on a personal level, or even really what he looks like or his racing tactics.

Part of the reason people have trouble recognizing Kirui in particular is that he looks really different with and without hair. Check out the comparison:

https://media.aws.iaaf.org/media/LargeL/e36b1e2e-bf8f-48c8-bfe9-a1b5e78e250e.jpg?v=2081746854

http://running.competitor.com/files/2017/04/kirui-close-up-632x421.jpg
Carl Spackler

1 year ago 08/10/2018 11:15pm CDT
re: Do you think hesaurus?

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Bump the "Dan and Dave" reference as a potential hazard for setting up a 2-person marathon rivalry.

It seems that track/road racing needs to continue to find out what makes golf, car racing, and similar sports (with multiple participants competing concurrently) spectator friendly and encourage that with how events are staged and broadcast.
NewtotheSouthSide

1 year ago 08/11/2018 7:05am CDT
re: Carl Spackler

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The piece itself isn't awful, although I don't agree with it. I think it's right that it's hard to commentate during a marathon because a dozen bios get thrown at you and the general public has zero attachment to any of them. The mass public doesn't have favorite runners. In golf and tennis, you follow your favorite few but can still appreciate the game no matter who wins. In running, most people follow nobody and don't know a good time versus a bad time. So why should we cater to the general public? Mo and Galen are two of the biggest names in distance running and some folks in the general public do know who they are. If we're trying to build the sport, sure, we should be promoting them in the lead-up to this race. But you can do that and still have an invited runner field. Actual fans of the sport don't want to see two runners with nobody else there in a marathon. The women's race was boring last year when Dibaba broke away. That was eventually a 1 v 1 match-up. Chicago has prize money for the top finishers, and probably time bonuses. When you have a huge marathon like Chicago, they have a duty to build up the sport by getting as much prize money to as many people as possible. Marathon running just isn't popular. The people who follow the sport are way more excited about this year's field vs last year when the field appeared to be a bit watered down. Marathoning is more exciting when you have a ton of good runners competing and people still in it late. A 1 v 1 duel doesn't give you that in a marathon when someone could drop out at halfway. The 1 on 1 stuff is nice for shorter races where you don't need months to recover. Maybe they can try out a 1 v 1 for a half marathon or for an obscure distance like a 12k or 25k. Also, if you can't see the value of bringing Yuki to Chicago, an international city with international runners competing in the mass start, think about it some more. Yeah, he might not win but I'm sure there will be lots of people trying to snap a photo with him race weekend.
Skobuffs

1 year ago 08/11/2018 7:39am CDT
re: NewtotheSouthSide

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NewtotheSouthSide wrote:

The piece itself isn't awful, although I don't agree with it. I think it's right that it's hard to commentate during a marathon because a dozen bios get thrown at you and the general public has zero attachment to any of them. The mass public doesn't have favorite runners. In golf and tennis, you follow your favorite few but can still appreciate the game no matter who wins. In running, most people follow nobody and don't know a good time versus a bad time. So why should we cater to the general public? Mo and Galen are two of the biggest names in distance running and some folks in the general public do know who they are. If we're trying to build the sport, sure, we should be promoting them in the lead-up to this race. But you can do that and still have an invited runner field. Actual fans of the sport don't want to see two runners with nobody else there in a marathon. The women's race was boring last year when Dibaba broke away. That was eventually a 1 v 1 match-up. Chicago has prize money for the top finishers, and probably time bonuses. When you have a huge marathon like Chicago, they have a duty to build up the sport by getting as much prize money to as many people as possible. Marathon running just isn't popular. The people who follow the sport are way more excited about this year's field vs last year when the field appeared to be a bit watered down. Marathoning is more exciting when you have a ton of good runners competing and people still in it late. A 1 v 1 duel doesn't give you that in a marathon when someone could drop out at halfway. The 1 on 1 stuff is nice for shorter races where you don't need months to recover. Maybe they can try out a 1 v 1 for a half marathon or for an obscure distance like a 12k or 25k. Also, if you can't see the value of bringing Yuki to Chicago, an international city with international runners competing in the mass start, think about it some more. Yeah, he might not win but I'm sure there will be lots of people trying to snap a photo with him race weekend.

+1
Its still real to me, man!

1 year ago 08/11/2018 11:04am CDT
re: coach

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https://youtu.be/BvTNyKIGXiI