1500m WR is now 20 years old!

Coevett wrote:

ja wrote:

Best thing about El G is that he would be wasted after his races, on the ground, catching his breath.

You rarely see that now a days.

GOAT

LOL, that was the only time I saw that from El G. In his other record performances he barely looks out of breath. I think his coach probably had a word with him before this Mile race and told him he was making it look all too obvious, so go straight to the floor. He probably could have carried on and broken the 5000m WR.

he wasn't even breathing hard. laying on the track is different than being completely ruined from the effort. he looks fresh when they stand him up

Nips and tatties wrote:

Coevett wrote:

Your liking for filthy handles makes it clear. Somewhat disturbing given that you believe there are children reading.

Filthy... yes... Turnips and potatoes are filthy to you? I wonder what you do with them...

I am not putting up with bullies.

Go away.

Have/Has RUN, not RAN! you imbecile. All written in jest, of course :)

What a jerk! - correcting grammar on an informal discussion forum:

The scientists and study doesn't use the word "jerk".

It baffles me how some say El G was clean yet they say the Russian and Chinese women who own the record books were dirty. El G was as dirty as anyone in history.

sbeefyk2 wrote:

It baffles me how some say El G was clean yet they say the Russian and Chinese women who own the record books were dirty. El G was as dirty as anyone in history.

Yes, I wonder if Chinese runners suddenly started producing Ma's army type times again, whether the likes of ex-Runner and 'Viva La Republica' would be screaming racist at anyone who suspected them to be doping? Somehow doubt it.

I know that if the Chinese suddenly started dominating men's and women's middle-and long distance running, taking all the medals from the Kenyans, the fury of El K would be unimaginable. Probably Canova too, who wouldn't hesitate to call all the Chinese winners blood doping cheats...or maybe he would move home from Kenya and find work in Beijing, claiming Chinese athletes were always naturally superior and that it was simply communism that had been holding them back for so long.

What's up with this? wrote:

Nips and tatties wrote:

Filthy... yes... Turnips and potatoes are filthy to you? I wonder what you do with them...

I am not putting up with bullies.

Go away.

Have/Has RUN, not RAN! you imbecile. All written in jest, of course :)

What a jerk! - correcting grammar on an informal discussion forum:

https://www.sciencealert.com/people-who-pick-up-grammar-mistakes-jerks-scientists-findhttp://www.businessinsider.com/people-who-correct-typos-may-be-jerks-study-finds-2016-3

Deal with it. :)

Coevett wrote:

*Yes, Bernard Lagat was clearly doping then (he actually failed the A sample of a test)

Failed a test that has been scientifically proven to be unreliable and to produce false positives.

Coevett wrote:

*Yes, Bernard Lagat was clearly doping then (he actually failed the A sample of a test), and who knows if he is doping now? Who knows what the long term effects of EPO use are? It's been proven by two studies that EPO use has anti-aging effects.

Lagat clearly loves to run. He doesn't just do it to win. He's happy entering races where he is beaten. He suffers no insecurity that would make him psychologically dependent on doping and he's been tested drug-free for a longer duration than anyone, so if anyone out there is clean, it is him. Being a naturally produced hormone, testing for injected Erythropoietin is just destined to be unreliable some of the time in some individuals, which has been well proven. The fact that he's tested clean for the vast majority of the time for a longer time than anyone tells me he is clean and the fact that he is still so competitive tells me he has incredible talent beyond anyone. To believe that he has some Godly inside knowledge into evading drug tests that nobody else in the field has attained would be the only explanation, which is absurd. If he could get his hands on such knowledge, then so would many others in the field of running, which would include coaches and runners in the USA. If Lagat can get away with doping in the USA for such a lengthy period of time, then all american runners are suspect.

@Coevett, you accusing Lagat, an American citizen, of drugging just shows your racism. You previously justified your accusations against Africans stating that it is the corrupt system they live in. Lagat is not African. He is American and is a part of the American running community and legal system. His dark skin does not make him suddenly more prone to corruption than any other American. Americans are just as prone to cheating, stealing, and lying as any other human being on the planet. If the system in America cannot catch Lagat, than this applies equally to every other American runner, and hence, they are all just as suspect as Lagat, given no evidence against Lagat or any other.

I like watching Lagat run. But I have to confess, given the era, it would truly idiotic not to be suspicious of him

Born 12 Dec 1974

2001 3:26.34 Bruxelles (BEL) 24 AUG 2001

2000 3:28.51 Zürich (SUI) 11 AUG 2000

1999 3:30.56 Zürich (SUI) 11 AUG 1999

1998 3:34.48 Stuttgart (GER) 19 JUL 1998

1997 3:41.19 Palo Alto (USA) 09 MAY 1997

And chances are he may be older than that too. One of the (somewhat jealous) Stanford runners (???) was accusing him of doping back in 2000.

Subway Surfers wrote:

I like watching Lagat run. But I have to confess, given the era, it would truly idiotic not to be suspicious of him

Born 12 Dec 1974

2001 3:26.34 Bruxelles (BEL) 24 AUG 2001

2000 3:28.51 Zürich (SUI) 11 AUG 2000

1999 3:30.56 Zürich (SUI) 11 AUG 1999

1998 3:34.48 Stuttgart (GER) 19 JUL 1998

1997 3:41.19 Palo Alto (USA) 09 MAY 1997

And chances are he may be older than that too. One of the (somewhat jealous) Stanford runners (???) was accusing him of doping back in 2000.

Maybe Canova would have the answer to that? ?

First... that last statement... really gives away the lie. It's a false premise: if there was a level playing field in the 1970s and 1980s, far more elite athletes outside of your Anglophone heroes would have vied for the WR - because they'd actually have better access to training and resources, earlier.

In fact you saw that international parity emerging and paying dividends in the 1970s and early 1980s, in the middle distances, with Filbert Bayi and Henry Rono (who, incidentally, held the 3000, 5000, and 10,000m AND steeplechase records "all the way back in 1982").

Your point is seriously bizzare... on a truly level playing field, "the American, European, British, New Zealand guys" would hold a small fraction of the world records.

Regarding the 1.6% (3.2 second) drop, yes it did happen between 1985 and 1998 (13 years).

That's far less than the 4.7 second drop from Bayi to Cram - between 1975 and 1985 (10 years).

We may never know who doped or not, but the argument that a really fast record is clear evidence of doping cannot be made, when you also believe (more credibly) that doping was widespread. Because if doping was widespread, you'd more likely have a bunch of names clustered at the top, rather than one. I can't prove that El G didn't dope - just like I can't prove you're not a sex deviant - but the evidence certainly supports he was the greatest 1500m of his generation.

sconehead wrote:

Your point is seriously bizzare... on a truly level playing field, "the American, European, British, New Zealand guys" would hold a small fraction of the world records.

Regarding the 1.6% (3.2 second) drop, yes it did happen between 1985 and 1998 (13 years).

That's far less than the 4.7 second drop from Bayi to Cram - between 1975 and 1985 (10 years).

.

Which record are you using 1500m or Mile? This is a very large distortion of the stats, for the mile you are using 3:51 which Walker broke a couple of weeks later, 3:49.4, which was really bringing the mile record into line with the 1974 3:32 times both Bayi & Walker ran. Between 1974 and August 1992 the 1500m record improved by 2.7s then over less than 6 years it dropped 3.46s. As for the mile it dropped 3.1s from Walker until 1993 and then again dropped 3.2s in 6 years. In the first period athletes could have used transfusions, steriods and amphetamines, the second period (the 1990s) epo and hgh were undetectable (as were transfusions & designer steroids).

intenserunner wrote:

@Coevett, you accusing Lagat, an American citizen, of drugging just shows your racism. You previously justified your accusations against Africans stating that it is the corrupt system they live in. Lagat is not African. He is American and is a part of the American running community and legal system. His dark skin does not make him suddenly more prone to corruption than any other American. Americans are just as prone to cheating, stealing, and lying as any other human being on the planet. If the system in America cannot catch Lagat, than this applies equally to every other American runner, and hence, they are all just as suspect as Lagat, given no evidence against Lagat or any other.

Whilst I don't agree on the particular athlete, given that Lagat sort of tested for EPO, your premise is 100% spot on.

Unfortunately you don't have to do much probing to realise that in fact, Coevett does truly believe a black man to be more likely to cheat than a white man. He totally disregards white cheats in cycling and other sports like rugby saying that it doesn't count or something.

vivalarepublica wrote:

Noah da great wrote:

And he left out the fact that the pacemaker was no one other than Noah Ngeny. Second fastest miler ever and Olympic gold medalist.

Coevett is jealous, racist trash.

+1

sbeefyk2 wrote:

It baffles me how some say El G was clean yet they say the Russian and Chinese women who own the record books were dirty. El G was as dirty as anyone in history.

Absolutely FILTHY dirty. Any more obvious, and he'd have to be a 10k average international elite that suddenly starts destroying people with a previously nonexistent kick.

Yezzzzzzzzzz... !! wrote:

sbeefyk2 wrote:

It baffles me how some say El G was clean yet they say the Russian and Chinese women who own the record books were dirty. El G was as dirty as anyone in history.

Absolutely FILTHY dirty. Any more obvious, and he'd have to be a 10k average international elite that suddenly starts destroying people with a previously nonexistent kick.

Good afternoon, Coevett. :)

I think Noah Nguey deserves the credit for Hicham's WRs especially his mile WR. Noah was just a tiny bit slower and still has the 2nd fastest ever mile from pacing that race. Hicham wouldn't run that fast without him. Noah is my favorite 1500m runner ever.