Pretty crummy week for the Metcalf family. First, Roseanne is canceled, and now this. How much can one family take, people?
Pretty crummy week for the Metcalf family. First, Roseanne is canceled, and now this. How much can one family take, people?
I have some of the posts and threads on this topic, and I see both sides. Soft athletes vs. treating people humanely and all the opinions in between. Sorry if the below points repeat others’.
My question is, in general, what is the purpose of having intercollegiate sports? In the case or track/XC, it’s not money. I don’t believe the sport is a revenue generator for most schools, so treating student-athletes poorly doesn’t make sense to me bc you’re not making money off it. The pressure to produce for the sake of revenue isn’t there. And it’s not like many of these athletes will go onto lucrative professional careers.
If it’s for athletics program pride, at what point is it worth the have a bunch of injured athletes and high attrition for a few, spare championship years? The pride is fleeting, and what you get left with is a mess that may not even be worth the effort in a low-profile sport.
If it’s to educate outside the classroom and make them better individuals in the long run (pun not originally intended), then Metcalf’s alleged behavior is unacceptable.
I didn’t participate in sports at a high level, but I learned a lot from tough but respectful coaches in several sports in high school and club levels. I don’t know where you all have worked, but I’ve worked at several Fortune 500 companies and in different sectors and being a jerk — to put nicely — is generally not tolerated. Sure, they exist, and they may stick around a while, but eventually they get what they have coming. So the idea you have to endure abuse to be prepared for life doesn’t hold true, at least for me. Of course, the military works a little differently, maybe. I have no idea.
From my perspective, this all comes back to why do we have college sports. If you’re doing to abuse people or take abuse for running ... well, my sympathies are with those who need the scholarships to attend school. Otherwise, why should anyone tolerate it for sport? And why would anyone defend anyone who would treat humans this way, if the allegations are true?
+1 excellent points in an excellent post.
I agree. As someone on the men's distance team, this hits so close. Dead on.
Probably at least 95% (closer to 100%?) men commenting on this thread, when probably 95% of Metcalf' s bullshit involved women.
Talk to women on the team, or women involved in any way with the distance program, and you'll realize he created a very unhealthy environment.
Ask yourself this, would you have your daughter run for him?
#TimesUp wrote:
Probably at least 95% (closer to 100%?) men commenting on this thread, when probably 95% of Metcalf' s bullshit involved women.
Talk to women on the team, or women involved in any way with the distance program, and you'll realize he created a very unhealthy environment.
Ask yourself this, would you have your daughter run for him?
Yup. To me a big flag was Katie Knight choosing not to finish her career, despite having had success in the program. You'd think the daughter of one of the all-time high school coaches in the state who was a contributing member to both teams would finish out her eligibility unless there was something unhealthy/inappropriate/very toxic going on, going beyond the need to be "tougher" and "suck it up."
Most of what has been alluded to here and on the other thread has been alluded to on these boards in the past and has been whispered about in the PNW running community for years. Not the specifics, but generally the weight stuff and the unprofessional behavior, in addition to the meat grinder atmosphere and Sophomore Sensation results.
spokane xc wrote:
Yup. To me a big flag was Katie Knight choosing not to finish her career, despite having had success in the program. You'd think the daughter of one of the all-time high school coaches in the state who was a contributing member to both teams would finish out her eligibility unless there was something unhealthy/inappropriate/very toxic going on, going beyond the need to be "tougher" and "suck it up."
Most of what has been alluded to here and on the other thread has been alluded to on these boards in the past and has been whispered about in the PNW running community for years. Not the specifics, but generally the weight stuff and the unprofessional behavior, in addition to the meat grinder atmosphere and Sophomore Sensation results.
Correct. Reading through this thread I'm chuckling as there are a lot of "new-to-the-party" reactionary posters who are just here to opine after reading the headlines. There are a group of us who have been around this situation for 10-15yrs and know some of the backstory. Those of you who are making this discussion about 3 student athletes/snowflakes/weak distance runners who "foolishly" opened there mouths and "stupidly" got a bad leader/coach/person-of-trust fired: you're missing the point.
Greg created and maintained an environment that was unhealthy and toxic to many student athletes for a long time. Greg getting shown the door has little to do with what he did yesterday, last year or in 2014. It has to do with the legacy of choosing to run a program from a selfish place and lacking the understanding of how to treat your athletes properly. Maybe it was fine 10, 20, 40+yrs ago, but in today's society, whether you "tough guys" like it or not, his actions within a school environment (and in most of society now...) aren't going to be tolerated.
Important lesson here...if you’re going to be a “tough love” coach who holds your athletes accountable at a high level...keep your damn hands off them & don’t drunkenly berate them in public. Sounds like there are definitely two legitimate sides here...regardless, this program is going to be a disasterpiece for the next couple years...good luck kids.
What I don’t get is where have the assistant coaches been, especially Anita Campbell, when all this nonsense has been going on.
Shadow Lurker wrote:
Important lesson here...if you’re going to be a “tough love” coach who holds your athletes accountable at a high level...keep your damn hands off them & don’t drunkenly berate them in public. Sounds like there are definitely two legitimate sides here...regardless, this program is going to be a disasterpiece for the next couple years...good luck kids.
There's a difference between "hold[ing] your athletes accountable at a high level" and manipulating/shaming/scaring them into unhealthy behaviors.
#TimesUp wrote:
Shadow Lurker wrote:
Important lesson here...if you’re going to be a “tough love” coach who holds your athletes accountable at a high level...keep your damn hands off them & don’t drunkenly berate them in public. Sounds like there are definitely two legitimate sides here...regardless, this program is going to be a disasterpiece for the next couple years...good luck kids.
There's a difference between "hold[ing] your athletes accountable at a high level" and manipulating/shaming/scaring them into unhealthy behaviors.
Which category would pinching your runner's gut and telling him that he may want to lay off the cookies fall under?
Tyson wrote:
What I don’t get is where have the assistant coaches been, especially Anita Campbell, when all this nonsense has been going on.
Keeping their jobs & supporting their families. They knew the moment they said something (if “something” really was there), that they’d lose their jobs along with Greg. It’s easy to call someone out for this until it’s you in that position & you have small children to feed. Ever wonder why Kelly Bean & Lauren Denfeld quietly exited to lesser positions or the profession all together?
Where were the cries of gross mistreatment/sexual assault when parts of the team decided to entrap a certain male distance runner on an apposing team as a practical joke?
“It’s just a joke, it will be funny, I don’t even care”
Yeah you guys are disgusting. You try to act like you are the victim but YOU are/were the problem. Leading a revolt against Metcalf due to “behavior” and “abuse” without ever considering your own actions ever. You are what you stood against.
Maybe the Seattle Times should write about that...
As someone who experienced a similar type of team atmosphere (many years ago) in college, Metcalf's behavior isn't uncommon and most coaches get away with it for their entire careers. A lot of the allegations being made about Metcalf are similar to what I witnessed at my own college and while I came forward to my athletic director about my coach, nothing came of it partially b/c I had no backing from other team members (men and women) plus there wasn't the threat of social media yet. I actually documented my experience in an e book called She Was Once a Runner. With the current social/political climate (e.g. #Metoo, USA gymnastics team), it's possible that the youth may now feel more empowered to come forward when they feel a line has been crossed by a coach. Had my experience happened now, I guarantee the outcome would have been different.
Let’s not equate this to sexual harassment. No where has that been suggested by anyone in either story nor with any credibility in this thread.
Nobody has credibility in this thread. Anyone who has not spoken anonymously has made a total a.s of themselves considering not all of the facts are known publicly, yet.
My experience wasn't sexual harassment necessarily (although the men on our team admitted on more than one occasion that he had told them he only recruits good looking women). I know the examples I gave have to do w/ sexual abuse, but I was referencing them more to prove there's a current trend where more men are getting called out for abuse of power -doesn't have to be sexual- and for building a culture of fear so that they can continue to exploit others and not be held accountable.
Yeah, sucks how Metcalf can call a girl a c*** and get away with it for two years am I right? For that POS, it was a long time coming, he's sexually, verbally and physically abused his athletes for the last decade. You can pity some coaches but DO NOT pity this former coach. From your own perspective as a former D1 coach, how bad would you have had to screw up to step down right before the regional meet?
Oh no! He told guys on the team he only recruits good looking women! What a horrible man!
First of all, as a guy on the team you think that is bad? Second, he quite obviously did not recruit only good looking women. Go look at the roster. If you are that much of a tool that your coach can’t joke with you then you really have issues.
Hhuyggg wrote:
Oh no! He told guys on the team he only recruits good looking women! What a horrible man!
First of all, as a guy on the team you think that is bad? Second, he quite obviously did not recruit only good looking women. Go look at the roster. If you are that much of a tool that your coach can’t joke with you then you really have issues.
She isn't talking about Metcalf
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