New Hayward Design Thoughts

Portland Hobby Jogger wrote:

It's great. Winds will be less of a factor and the roof structure will amplify the sound of the best track fans in America. I love Hayward Field but it hasn't aged well. The restrooms sucked, concessions are non-existent, and the East Grandstand was cramped and uncomfortable. Change is good.

You are entitled to your opinions, but not to your own facts. If you don't like the East fine. But your statements were just wrong.

There is absolutely nothing about the East Grandstand that is less comfortable than the West. There is more knee and leg room than in the West (go ahead, measure it . . . quickly!), and the benches are totally solid with 92-year-old old growth wood, and not flimsy as in the West.

The restrooms totally suck on the west side. Since the 1988 changes, the east side has good enough restrooms for a sports venue.

there's plenty of other tracks in the u.s. so it looks o.k. to me. no big concerns. why the controversy over so many minor, nitpicky issues?

In 1980 I remember sitting on one of the toilets and there were no stalls. Looked to the left or right and saw the guy sitting next to you. In one case it was Rudy Chapa and Bill McChesney.

IWuzaDuck wrote:

In 1980 I remember sitting on one of the toilets and there were no stalls. Looked to the left or right and saw the guy sitting next to you. In one case it was Rudy Chapa and Bill McChesney.

Yes, the East Grandstand was pretty grungy in the 1980s, before the 1987-88 move and fix-up. Since then, and especially since 2007, they've been quite nice.

Better restrooms than the west.

Better shielding from the rain and wind than the west.

Better view of sprints than in the west, because of the problem with people always standing up.

Closer view of pole vault.

Row 1 of the east is less than 6 inches from Lane 8, much closer than is Row 1 in the west

More leg & knee room than the west.

Less crowding, you can always find a place to stretch out and lie down on the benches, except during the evenings of the trials.

Cooler people sit in the east than in the west.

Cool. You can kiss both sides goodbye, though, so your pissing contest is moot.

I like it. SRG is a solid firm. Give them a chance. Go to their website and see the volume of work they do for campuses in the NW--impressive. I hope they're partnering with a specialty consultant (like Don Paige or someone similar) that will make sure all the T&F IAAF specifications and amenities will be addressed. It'll be fine...once built everyone will forget about old Hayward. T&F facilities are not like baseball, soccer and football stadiums. With T&F facilities, you really have to focus on the ideal geometry of the track (doesn't change as much in football, baseball or soccer) and creating the most efficient "wrapper" for the space. Prevailing winds, sun angles, sustainability, timeline, budget are just a small list of factors that go into the design.

One of the best anecdotes I ever heard (related to T&F ) was when Princeton was designing their facility with Architect Rafael Vinoly. Don Paige was the T&F consultant and wanted to move the grandstand canopy down to the start finish line. This would leave it off center (from the football stadium) and asymmetrical not what the hot shot architect wanted. Big debate and arguments ensued for (i believe) weeks/months(?) just over this feature. Vinoly threatened to leave the project...so it was centered.

It seemed like they could have done a lot to preserve the "look and feel" of the current/historic stadium with a "retro" architecture versus this very modern design. They could rebuild the older East grandstand in the same architectural style, and/or they could extend further along the finish straightaway the newer West grandstand in the same architectural style.

The tower has got to go.

It doesn't seem like they are planning "long-term" for permanent seating of ~10,000 for future events like NCAA, USATF, Pre-classic where they don't need much more seating than that. They only need 30,000 seats for the 2021 IAAF world championships which they could supplement with temporary seating. Beyond that they will have a white elephant on campus similar to an Olympic facility that was over-built for one big event.

For $200M, they should be able to figure this out.

Carl Spackler wrote:

. . . It doesn't seem like they are planning "long-term" for permanent seating of ~10,000 for future events like NCAA, USATF, Pre-classic where they don't need much more seating than that. They only need 30,000 seats for the 2021 IAAF world championships which they could supplement with temporary seating. Beyond that they will have a white elephant on campus similar to an Olympic facility that was over-built for one big event.

For $200M, they should be able to figure this out.

It doesn't seem like it? The design announced this week is for permanent seating of 12,900. That's enough to seat every attendee at any NCAA or USATF Championships held there subsequent to 1984, and since usually a couple thousand of the announced attendees are athletes, officials, coaches, support staff, etc. not using seats, 12,900 would have been enough for 1984 as well.

The all-time announced attendance record for the Prefontaine Classic was 14,221 in 2008, and as above, 12,900 seats would have been enough for that one, too, without needing any temporary stands.

The only time temporary stands will be required in the future at Hayward will be for possible future Olympic Trials.

2+2=4

Carl Spackler, I apparently misunderstood what you wrote upon first reading. Now I think I understand your point, and I think we are in agreement.

Fellow Trackfans:

Please LET GO of the idea of keeping the iconic Hayward grandstands! Why? I'll try to give several reasons why T&F Fans should say "good riddance" the those archaic monstrosities and support the newly-released design:

1-The Iconic Hayward Grandstands are not really Track and Field Grandstands! They are effectively "leftover", "hand-me-down" Football grandstands. Yes, the current Hayward Field Grandstands (both east and west) are based off of a random grandstand built, on the cheap, in 1920 for FOOTBALL. See photo:

https://cpb-us-e1.wpmucdn.com/blogs.uoregon.edu/dist/9/6814/files/2014/02/football1-2m1ka9y.jpg

I repeat, they are effectively FOOTBALL grandstands. What would you build in 1920, just 2 years out of WWI, so that a bunch of young men can stay out of the autumn Oregon rain while smoking and drinking and betting on a football game? You would build the cheap, ugly, impersonal, dark, cavernous and spare design seen in 1920 photo. This may very-well have perfectly reflected the cultural aesthetic for American football at that time. The rectangular "grid iron" reflected in the rectangular Grandstand. The ugly, brutal game in the mud and the ugly brutal, dark, cavernous and uncomfortable viewing platform, filled mostly with young men, tobacco smoke and alcohol. To preserve what is effectively a football grandstand for what is now a track and field exclusive stadium demeans the sport of track and field and perpetuates T&F's sad history of having to play "second fiddle" in stadiums built primarily for football.

2-It is simply a lousy design. It is uncomfortable, it is ugly, it is dark, it is cavernous. The back 1/3 rd seats on west grandstand are terrible and the back 50% of east grandstand are horrendous. Each so-called "seat" is an 18" wide strip of hard, wooden bench to put your butt. Before each meet, one prays to get a skinny distance runner as your seat neighbor. When you are seated in either grandstand, due to it terrible acoustics, you can hear people's conversations 50-75 feet away as sound echoes and bounces up and down. The echoing acoustics is annoying and bothersome. When they add "seats" for USATF Champs or Olympic Trials you can get a nosebleed sitting at top of a "stairway to heaven" in the temporary grandstand on your 18 inches of hard aluminum bench as you get poured on by the rain! The grandstands are NOT intimate, not good design, not human scaled and not appropriate for 21st Century Track and Field. Old, yes, but sterile, dark, cavernous, ugly and impractical and reminds me of an 'Eastern Bloc" Cattle Feedlot operation. Finally, the grandstands are so steep and high that they are dangerous for children and those folks who are a bit wobbly on their "pins". I have seen a few fans tumble and it is NOT pretty.

3- The seating design/arrangement and aesthetics for a T&F-exclusive stadium of 15-25k capacity should look completely different from a Football or Soccer Stadium of 50-100k capacity. For football and soccer you need to go high with the seats/grandstand to get enough folks in. For T&F, you want to stay low and get seats all-around (or mostly around) so everyone has a shot at experiencing the events without having to stare at the jumbo screen for the entire meet. As we all know, track and field is completely-different sport with substantially-different culture (and therefore design) requirements. In football and soccer, one is not looking for a more intimate experience. One expects to be among "the masses",among their giant tribe where they are cheering in unison for "their team". The folks in the nose-bleeds seats often have more fun than the expensive seats because of the giant party they are part of. As we all know T&F, at the national and world-level, is not really a team sport. The people sitting next to you, might not be favoring the same athlete that you are and that is a part of the beauty of the sport. It is a quieter, gentler fan experience (yes I know Penn Relays and other are exceptions) in general. Most of the time, there is no clear favorite competitor. What the fan is looking for and what the fan wants is to be able to experience a buildup of drama of the race or field event, as it unfolds the drama peaks and perhaps be close enough to hear the grunts and see the expressions on the faces. Everyone is a fan of the SPORT as much as the individual athletes. Therefore, no need for a "stairway to heaven" or skyhigh grandstands. Track and field is an intimate and flowing sport, there are little if any sharp angles in the sport and the stadium is often completely silent (before the starting gun, for instance). Although it occurs outdoors, it simply requires a higher degree of intimacy. A track and field-exclusive venue should be "low and flowing". The best T&F-exclusive stadiums (rare as they are, because T&F often plays second fiddle to soccer in Europe too) should be low and have a "flow". Think anti-brutalist, organic. IMHO, the recently-unveiled design (April 2018) scores high on both "low" and "flow".

Urgent action may be needed, especially if you live in Eugene. As of May 2018, I have read there is substantial opposition to this new design coming from various angles. But most of those who oppose the new design and want to keep the grandstands in Eugene are NOT T&F fans and know nothing about T&F. They are a mix of folks...hard core historic preservationists, anti-Nike people, anti-Phil people, anti-UO people, anti-$ people, etc. But most don't know sh*t about T&F. T&F fans, you need to step up and support this new design. Now is your chance to finally have a stadium that is not a hand-me-down from football or the 102nd Engineering Battalion. While I'm ranting, what a shame that we have to run XC on Golf Courses too. Tear down those old football stands and build this new, fan-friendly, people-friendly TRACK AND F-ING FIELD stadium with respectful and appropriate homage to the old stadium's behemoth grandstands.

Lastly, when I was a kid in the 70s, I lived in NY and people seriously freaked out about the old/original Yankee Stadium being torn down. Similar situation, the old stadium was just terrible but had a lot of history, yes. But it was just terrible. Thankfully it was effectively torn down and heavily redesigned but with beautiful references to the old. The attendance went through the roof in that new stadium and that rebuilt Yankee Stadium ushered in a new golden age for the Yankees from late 70s into the 21st century and served them well. Let us build a completely new and beautiful Hayward Field facility, with appropriate homages to the old, which will also usher in a new golden age for Track and Field not only in Oregon, but in USA. Cheers.

Jefe in the CO wrote:

Barabbas wrote:

They shouldn’t rename it Hayward because it isn’t anymore. Name it Knight Field or Nike Field or something - let’s call it what it is.

This is actually a great idea. We need some sort of procedure in place for renaming stuff when an a Phil Knight or other game changer comes along.

There is no one more influential in modern day T&F than Phil Knight. Night Field has a nice ring to it. Or maybe it could be Lannana's Luxury Boxes at Knight Stadium at Hayward Field brought to you by NIKE.

The deal was to name it after Kitzhaber

Is there a timeline for the stadium to be demolished? I thought it was going to happen shortly after the Eugene Marathon.

I disagree.

I personally don't like it. I raced on it a few times and I sensed an "aura" of the place. I would of thought it would be possible to find an architect who could incorporate the "old" and new, even if it is all dozed and rebuilt.

When I first heard about Eugene being "awarded" the WC I was uh... Pretty much every Outdoor worlds has been held in or near a "World Class City" with a MULTI USE facility, Olympic quality stadiums and venues. It's too late now, but the old Husky Stadium and Seattle would of been a better venue for worlds. What really does Eugene have to offer the international visitor? Pre has people for a day or two then they're gone. 2000 plus competitors, coaches, press, etc, what are they gonna say after they leave after being Eugene for 2 weeks. The fans were knowledgeable and the city and U were gracious hosts??

Closing thoughts:

-Hire a new architect that can incorporate Hayward, sans the phallic unit into the environment it's in.

-Use Hayward for what it has been used for

-Withdraw Eugene/Hayward from worlds and avoid the embarrassment and multi generational disdain for Eugene and Oregon as a "World Class Destination".

fly_guy wrote:

what are they gonna say after they leave after being Eugene for 2 weeks. The fans were knowledgeable and ... ??

Knowledgeable fans don't need field event results in feet and inches.

IWuzaDuck wrote:

In 1980 I remember sitting on one of the toilets and there were no stalls. Looked to the left or right and saw the guy sitting next to you. In one case it was Rudy Chapa and Bill McChesney.

LOL.

This is why I walked across the street and crapped in the dorms.