How can the new tax plan hurt the poor when 50% of Americans don't pay Federal Income Tax.

Because opportunities for the pee-on's (those who aren't in the top 2% or so of income earners) to get ahead and take advantage of economic mobility are closing. A lot of the itemized deduction opportunities the middle classes would take advantage of to save more money are being closed.

My parents made about 800k last year and wanted to pay more taxes but trumps plan gives them a big break.

You can read the CBO's report here: https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53348 The table on page 10 is the kicker. Presumably it comes down to reduction of benefits.

Overall, the combined effect of the change in net federal revenues and spending is to

decrease deficits (primarily stemming from reductions in spending) allocated to

lower-income tax filing units and to increase deficits (primarily stemming from reductions

in taxes) allocated to higher-income tax filing units.

Which is it? Do the pay NO income taxes as the title says or do they pay 1.9% as your post says?

How are tax cuts for the rich being funded in this plan? That is the question to ask. Is ACA markets being defunded so the poor can longer afford health care? I would say that hurts.

Will getting rid of Student Loan deduction hurt poor recent graduates starting careers and paying student loans?

The answer is right in the title...if someone doesn't pay income tax now, but will pay income tax under a new plan, that would hurt them

Stopme99 wrote:

Currently any American family making less than $50,000 (Almost half of America) on average pays 1.4% Income tax

You are an IDIOT. This might be true if you include people who have zero taxable income in your data set.

Ffhfchkj wrote:

Because opportunities for the pee-on's (those who aren't in the top 2% or so of income earners) to get ahead and take advantage of economic mobility are closing. A lot of the itemized deduction opportunities the middle classes would take advantage of to save more money are being closed.

My parents made about 800k last year and wanted to pay more taxes but trumps plan gives them a big break.

Then why didn't they?

Ffhfchkj wrote:

Because opportunities for the pee-on's (those who aren't in the top 2% or so of income earners) to get ahead and take advantage of economic mobility are closing. A lot of the itemized deduction opportunities the middle classes would take advantage of to save more money are being closed.

My parents made about 800k last year and wanted to pay more taxes but trumps plan gives them a big break.

They can write a check to the Treasury. There is no law stopping people from paying more in taxes.

Stopme99 wrote:

Currently any American family making less than $50,000 (Almost half of America) on average pays 1.4% Income tax and only makes up 19.1% of all paid income tax.

Why are we complaining that the new plan would raise taxes by an average of $240.00 for anyone family making under $45,000. They already pay so little...why should they pay less when everyone pays more?

Well, if the idea is to help out folks who earn below the median income then any sort of increase is not really a good idea, but you are correct in that almost 50% of people will likely see no direct benefit since they are not already paying taxes. Also some of those folks get a check from the gov in the form of the Earned Income Tax Credit.

simple wrote:

Ffhfchkj wrote:

Because opportunities for the pee-on's (those who aren't in the top 2% or so of income earners) to get ahead and take advantage of economic mobility are closing. A lot of the itemized deduction opportunities the middle classes would take advantage of to save more money are being closed.

My parents made about 800k last year and wanted to pay more taxes but trumps plan gives them a big break.

Then why didn't they?

Yep. People complaining about not paying enough tax can pay extra. They're just virtue signaling if all they're doing is complaining.

The estate tax should be increased. It should start at $1Mil (exemption) and then increase linearly, so that anything over $11Mil is taxed 100%.

Estates that have $11Mil have more than the means to properly plan to shift those estates to their survivors while avoiding most of the tax.

Corporate tax rates should be set at 26%. The Reps were asking for 25% two years ago. This would be a compromise that would get several Democrats on board.

20% corporate taxes will explode our deficit and debt, which is really what the Reps are know for over the past 3 decades.

Dividends and long-term cap gains should be taxed at the same rate as short-term caps and wages.

Exemptions for real estate gains on a primary residence should be reduced or eliminated. They don't really make any sense.

Progressive tax rates on income should get more progressive, instead of less.

Tax system fixed.

I left out that we should get rid of tax exempt status for churches, charities, and non-profits.

Without the mortgage interest deduction coming close to the standard deduction poor people will lose almost all incentive to buy a house. They'll be stuck with bad rents in even more droves than they already are. Great time to invest in real estate holders! Without estate taxes I imagine the top level of housing prices will be able to stay quite high. Rich real estate moguls might benefit from this as long as they can prevent the middle class from bottoming out.

I'm sure it's just a coincidence that Trump is big into real estate.

Agree that it's time to tax churches. Too many are politically active.

UsedToBeKnowItAll wrote:

Corporate tax rates should be set at 26%. The Reps were asking for 25% two years ago. This would be a compromise that would get several Democrats on board.

20% corporate taxes will explode our deficit and debt, which is really what the Reps are know for over the past 3 decades.

The stated corporate tax rate is 35%, but few pay that because they use loopholes.

The average corporate rate actually paid is 18% (or 22% depending on your source)

A 20% rate is in the ballpark, if there are no deductions allowed.

If it drops to 20% with the deductions in place, many companies will pay 0 in tax.

123456789012345678901234567890

In 2011 General Electric filed a 57,000 page tax return.

They had $11 BILLION in profit. (profit, not revenue)

Not only did they not pay any tax on it, they got a refund.

General Electric protested the story.

Here is just one provision. It changes the index of inflation from the CPI to the Chained-CPI. The Chained-CPI grows more slowly than the CPI. This changes not just the indexing for tax brackets (leading to people moving into higher tax brackets at a faster rate), but all sorts of ways that inflation is used to calculate public benefits (SSA, SSI, food stamps, etc).

Over the next decade, changing the inflation measure would mean that families would lose $134 billion by paying more in taxes and receiving fewer benefits than they would under current law.

You could make a philosophical argument that chained CPI is better, but that does not seem to be an argument that is being advanced. The result of the change is not ambiguous. Huge cuts in taxes for those at the top of the income spread paid for by higher taxes and lower benefits among those at the bottom.

The current plan wont hurt or help any single person/household/entity drastically one way or the other.

What it will do is not fund the govt appropriately which will drive up the deficit and debt.

You have fallen into the trap of worrying about the details instead of the major outcome.

Remember no historic data exist that suggest that simply lowering taxes will grow the economy or GDP but the two worst economic disasters were proceeded but significant tax cuts.

Ffhfchkj wrote:

Because opportunities for the pee-on's (those who aren't in the top 2% or so of income earners) to get ahead and take advantage of economic mobility are closing. A lot of the itemized deduction opportunities the middle classes would take advantage of to save more money are being closed.

My parents made about 800k last year and wanted to pay more taxes but trumps plan gives them a big break.

Don't count on inheriting any cash from your 'genius' parents. If they feel guilty about their financial situation, they can donate to a charity with little overhead where as much as 90% of the donations go to those in need. Some churches are a good start.

Geez, a minimum of research will show them that their money will be more efficiently used outside of the inefficient, politically correct governments, at all levels.

Did your parents inherit their money? Are they in law, medicine or education?

Are there no deficit hawks left in the Republican party? This tax cut will explode deficits.

BobbyAxelRod wrote:

The current plan wont hurt or help any single person/household/entity drastically one way or the other.

What it will do is not fund the govt appropriately which will drive up the deficit and debt.

You have fallen into the trap of worrying about the details instead of the major outcome.

Remember no historic data exist that suggest that simply lowering taxes will grow the economy or GDP but the two worst economic disasters were proceeded but significant tax cuts.

Yep. Typical Republican bullsh!t. It's actually why I left the party. They talk conservative, but when they are in power, they always blow up the debt. They fooled me once, and then the second time, I realized they were completely full of sh!t and I left the party. They aren't fiscally conservative. If you're a libertarian-leaning Rep, like I was, wake up. Reps aren't your friends. They are actually worse than the Dems.

The best scenario seems to be when Dems are in power, and then the Reps actually try to curb spending and tax hikes. When Reps are in power, they just blow up the budget, and Dems do little to nothing to stop it.

Look at the history.

Under Reagan/Bush I, deficit exploded from $998B to 4.4T. When Clinton left, it had only grown to 5.8T. Bush Jr gets back in and it literally explodes to $11.9T. Obama actually sucked too. It grew to $20.2 under his watch. It's projected to grow another $10T over the next decade, and that's before this "tax reform." And I know a lot of people will dispute this, but we're pretty much at full employment now. Things aren't going to get better in the economy and pay for the tax cuts.

This tax cuts will boost the economy thing is horse sh!t. The economy is doing great. We have low unemployment. Interest rates are low, so pretty much anyone with a job can buy a house. Corporate earnings are excellent. The DJI has almost doubled in the past 5 years. If the economy gets any "better" we're going to have massive inflation.

This tax reform is going to be something we're all going to regret in about 5 years.