Careers where people are worth more than they are paid

C'mon guy wrote:

zephito wrote:

Congressional staffers maybe? I've read low level staffers make about $30 or $35K (in the DC Metro area to boot), working awful hours for generally terrible people (my guess is only those with monstrous egos become congresspeople). I imagine many are sharp, hard-working, ambitious people. I guess they do it to be "near the action" or something.

Serious logical failing here.

The congressmen and congresswomen are "terrible people" with "monstrous egos", but those who choose to hang around them are "sharp", "hard-working", and "ambitious"?

Why do you think one becomes a congressional aide?

I'll give you a hint: it's often because one wants to someday become a member of congress.

C'mon, C'mon. I worked on Capitalism Hill for more than 12 years. Your hint is, well, wide of the mark, in my experience. Many staffers lack the shine and people skills of their craven bosses and would probably be a reach for elected office. Some *are* sharp, hard-working and ambitious (which doesn't preclude them having monstrous egos as well). Key staffers are the "unelected," who stay in positions where they can amass enormous power within committees like Finance, Energy, etc. They interact at high levels with large federal agencies/massive lobby firms/constituent groups. Yes there are young receptionists in every congressional offices who make zero bank, but others are top aides with years of legislative experience working at the committee level. They would never trade for the day-job of a freshman House member who risks being out of work every two years. On the other hand, if "their" member of Congress is tossed out during a tough election cycle, oh well. They can simply re-locate to a lobby shop on K street and have the last hyena-like laugh.

God bless America.

If a career pays low it's usually because it's paying fair market value. Most high-paying careers have some sort of barrier to entry that keeps pay high. If we had a 100% free market then few careers would pay six figures because there exist enough motivated people to saturate the field and bring pay down. Overall, everyone would benefit.

Loving Parents

Lots of jobs are underpaid. Some are overpaid. It is because of an imbalance of power in an unbalanced economy. Admittedly, if there was a true free market, you would be right but that is not the reality. We have mostly done away with collective bargaining in the US to the point that workers have almost no power in relation to the company owners/management. The government continues to side with them by allowing corporations unlimited donations to campaigns, allowing companies to pay so little that their employees are on food stamps (Corporate Subsidy we don't always notice), minimal oversight, etc. Corporate campaign contributions effectively mean that the government is a puppet of Corporate America. The balance of power shift to the owners/management allows them to pay as little as they possibly can and because there is no collective bargaining anywhere, wages are depressed everywhere except for those in power because they have effectively squashed the free market by having all the power over wages. Example: A financial institution. The CEO makes multiple millions and has a golden parachute where they pay him 10s of millions to go away if he does a poor job. At the same company, the IT department essentially is in control of the entire operation of day to day capital movement and protection of those assests (ie. what the bank actually does). The IT people get a modest middle class salary. Proper or improper IT is critical to the ultimate success or failure of the company. Which would cause certain failure for a financial institution: Removing the CEO for a month or removing the IT department for a month? But the salary choices are made by the CEO and his BOD buddies... Teachers are responsible for providing an educated workforce. This educated workforce is THE reason that the US is a superpower. We are currently squandering that role by shunning teachers and under funding education. If we don't provide a consistent education for ALL of our citizens, we will end up a 3rd world country where only the rich are educated and the poor have no skills so they cannot contribute to the economy. Given their contribution to our society, Teachers are worth much more. Anyone who believes that America is a true free market economy is not well educated. Companies are provided an educated workforce that they do not have to directly train in basic knowledge and skills. They are provided an outstanding infrastructure (roads, power grid, ports) and a strong system to protect their interests (military, police, fire departments). This is a multi Trillion dollar investment by the government to seed the economy. Yet companies demand more and want to pay less in taxes and wages even as corporate profits are soaring. And they have convinced people that this is the American Way.

John Utah wrote:

People are generally paid exactly what they are worth from an economics perspective. That’s where supply meets demand.

One more thing. Sometimes corporations are limited by government and it can hamper their ability to hire and profit. Again, the point is that there is not a true free market economy. In reality, the educated would never wish for that in a million years because very few would survive.

They are not underpaid. That's the pay that represents the demand in the marketplace for what they do.

I love classical music, but most people don't give a s#it and won't pay for it, don't want to see/hear it, won't buy it, etc. Therefore they are paid what supply and demand say they are worth.

slaves.

sadly, still a reality in parts of the world.

otherwise, OP does not believe in neoclassical economics, it seems.

/thread

No system is perfect, but I would say of the 200 million people working in the USA (or whatever the total number is), the vast majority are paid what they are worth in the economic sense as determined by supply and demand. There are exceptions of course, but there are exceptions, not the norm. Don't get thrown off by exceptions and measuring reality against some kind of textbook theoretical-perfect-system-in-a-vacuum nonsense. Engineers, accountants, teachers, mechanics, carpenters, etc., etc, etc, etc. It pretty much falls in line for the vast majority of "jobs" in the usa.

Also, did you know that corporations are taxed both at the corporate level and at the ownership level? If you own shares in Apple you are an owner of the company. When the company makes money they pay dividends to their owners, you. And you, the owner of said company, pay taxes on dividends/profits. And you, the owner, pay taxes again gain if and when you sell your shares. If you think the government isn't getting paid you are ignorant of the facts (not a pejorative).

Companies pay market rates of pay. Just like you demand to get paid market rates. Just like you want to pay market rates for the goods and services you buy.

The market works. I'd be nice if we let it work MORE in some areas... (I'm speaking to you public education.)

This is a perfect example of basic economics at work.

There is a relatively large supply of qualified people who want to make a living being a professional musician in this area. Universities across the country churn out classical music majors who aim to make a living in this field, year after year. Yet the demand for their product/service is not very high, in a relative sense. Therefore, you are left with a situation where the market rate of pay, the point of intersection between supply and demand, is lower than what people would like given the amount of work, skill, dedication, etc put into their craft. Basic supply and demand. It's a shame in this particular case when you see such high levels of demand for s#itty rap music and such, but that's the reality.

17 minute guy wrote:

17 minute 5k guys

This

I am not completely opposed to anything you are saying. The market does set the rate. But the market is rigged because of the power balance. The supply and demand equation is skewed by manipulation. As an engineer myself, I have seen what H1-B visas did to wages for engineers in the US. These are supposed to be for skills that cannot be found in the US, but companies have used it as a way to hire indentured servants. That in brings down the wages for other tech people. Consequently, it drove bright young people out of Tech so now there really is a shortage and wages are slowly rising, but the correction will take many years and wages were flat for more than 10 years due to the manipulation of the supply and demand equation. Wages being flat for 10 years in an entire industry is not an exception, it is a rule and a bad one. Other companies operate outside of the rules to gain an advantage: Farming, construction, etc hire illegal aliens and/or pay cash and there are no income taxes paid by those people. So the system breaks down when those people go use government services. But the business has already pocketed the difference - corporate subsidy on the sly. Saying someone is an "owner" of Apple by owning stock is technically true, but still the individual investor has no say in whether Apple operates ethically in hiring and wages, environment, etc. They can vote on corporate policy, but it will have no effect (drop in the ocean). And yes, the "owner" pays taxes but it is usually at a lower rate than income so again the rich gain a tremendous advantage as that is the source of more of their income. So the government is getting paid, but less than is should. People are getting paid market value in an artificial market.

Custodial Engineers!

Police and fire dispatchers

John Utah wrote:

There are a lot of people here that might benefit from taking a fundamentals of economics class or two.

darunningguyguy wrote:

Police and fire dispatchers

Where I live they are having a horrrrrrrible problem filling jobs for school bus drivers. If you can't find someone to do the job, it just means you aren't paying enough.

NotPC wrote:

darunningguyguy wrote:

Police and fire dispatchers

Where I live they are having a horrrrrrrible problem filling jobs for school bus drivers. If you can't find someone to do the job, it just means you aren't paying enough.

Who the heck would want to drive a school bus with the animals that attend public schools these days. The kids these days have about as much respect for school bus drivers as Dillinger had for the FBI! ?

100m wrote:

I agree completely with college athletes. The NCAA is a pure exploitation machine.

Another is shoe-shiners. There's nothing like a good spitshine. "Now go home and get your shinebox."

I wonder what percent of NCAA athletes are in non-revenue sports but I'd say they're definitely not exploited especially the ones who get a scholarship.

Football and basketball players don't just subsidize their coaches and the administrators, they also help give all the other non-revenue sports scholarships.

Event organizer: expect to lose money and field complaints until you quit it forever wondering why you ever did it in the first place.