He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
Sad when it takes guts to show respect.
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Alejandro Villanueva has guts. It bucked all the peer pressure and he was the only Steeler to come out of the locker room to show his love and respect for this country.
He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
Sad when it takes guts to show respect. -
I'm genuinely having trouble with declining-to-worship-a-graven-image somehow being equated with having-respect-for-one's-country.
The *real* disrespect IMHO comes when the SSB--our *national anthem*--is played to commemorate something as trivial as a sporting event. -
Sorry, almost forgot: 5/10. You should get some semi-serious hits (like mine!).
-
A post trophy wrote:
I'm genuinely having trouble with declining-to-worship-a-graven-image somehow being equated with having-respect-for-one's-country.
The *real* disrespect IMHO comes when the SSB--our *national anthem*--is played to commemorate something as trivial as a sporting event.
It's not commemorating a sporting event. It's a chance to commemorate the country. Also, it's not worshipping anything, it's showing allegiance to the American people, a siblinghood. -
Also, Kaepernick just won Trump 2020 and possibly a 2024. LOL. Guy's an absolute idiot, although I don't necessarily disagree with his views.
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I will assume you are a troll because you pretend to think people are honoring a piece of material woven into a flag.
The national anthem is showing your love and respect for your country. Its not saying your country has no faults or does nothing wrong. People honoring this country know there are many things the government might do that they think are wrong, but they still love and honor this country.
Do you get it now?
Now if you really are disgusted with and hate this country and feel you can't show it honor and respect, then by all means sit down. But do it on your own time, not when you are being paid indirectly by all the fans who still love the country.
A post trophy wrote:
I'm genuinely having trouble with declining-to-worship-a-graven-image somehow being equated with having-respect-for-one's-country.
The *real* disrespect IMHO comes when the SSB--our *national anthem*--is played to commemorate something as trivial as a sporting event. -
Yes, it took guts for him to that while his piers weren't.
Peer pressure, as you say.
So imagine the guts it took for Kaepernick to do what he did, going against his piers.
And taking on national backlash and losing income from it.
All just for a cause.
Guts
It would be easier for each of them to just follow the crowd. But one risked a lot more. -
It takes guts to jump in front of a moving vehicle. He's brave, but went about it the wrong way. He's DUMB. A big-time dummy.
L L wrote:
Yes, it took guts for him to that while his piers weren't.
Peer pressure, as you say.
So imagine the guts it took for Kaepernick to do what he did, going against his piers.
And taking on national backlash and losing income from it.
All just for a cause.
Guts
It would be easier for each of them to just follow the crowd. But one risked a lot more. -
I never said he wasn't brave of him to follow his convictions. Apparently his disgust for this country prevented him from displaying respect and love for his country. He wanted everyone to know he doesn't respect this country because racism exists.
He did it while being paid millions by the owners and indirectly the fans. I think if they love and respect this country they would be right to tell him not to disrespect the country on their time.
L L wrote:
Yes, it took guts for him to that while his piers weren't.
Peer pressure, as you say.
So imagine the guts it took for Kaepernick to do what he did, going against his piers.
And taking on national backlash and losing income from it.
All just for a cause.
Guts
It would be easier for each of them to just follow the crowd. But one risked a lot more. -
Red white & blue wrote:
He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
The flag in question is the flag of our government, not the flag of our country. I love and respect the ~320 million people who are my country. This love is not reflected by pledging fealty to a bureaucracy that is one small part of our culture. -
exthrower wrote:
A "Man" among boys....
Exthrower's ultimate fantasy.... -
So what is the flag of the country? Pride? The anthem is a tradition of morale. USA! USA! USA! I'm not even American. Do you actually think the people who stand for the anthem are thinking of politics?
government isn't the country wrote:
Red white & blue wrote:
He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
The flag in question is the flag of our government, not the flag of our country. I love and respect the ~320 million people who are my country. This love is not reflected by pledging fealty to a bureaucracy that is one small part of our culture. -
I never implied that guts/bravery and intelligence were the same thing.
-
L L wrote:
So imagine the guts it took for Kaepernick to do what he did, going against his piers. And taking on national backlash and losing income from it.
Kapernick is a true hero; at great personal sacrifice to his career and at the risk of violent retaliation from gun-clenching racists and a banana republic, he decided to take a 'stand' by kneeling. He is on the right side of history, but rarely does being on the right side of history bring praise in the here and now. Well, that ends now: he has my praise. Well done, good sir, and keep fighting the good fight. -
"To believe that patriotism will not flourish if patriotic ceremonies are voluntary and spontaneous instead of a compulsory routine is to make an unflattering estimate of the appeal of our institutions to free minds. We can have intellectual individualism and the rich cultural diversities that we owe to exceptional minds only at the price of occasional eccentricity and abnormal attitudes. When they are so harmless to others or to the State as those we deal with here, the price is not too great. But freedom to differ is not limited to things that do not matter much. That would be a mere shadow of freedom. The test of its substance is the right to differ as to things that touch the heart of the existing order.
"If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception, they do not now occur to us."
--Supreme Court of the United States, West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943). -
There you go. Kaepernick is shaming people for being American. It's that simple.
-SCOTUS- wrote:
"To believe that patriotism will not flourish if patriotic ceremonies are voluntary and spontaneous instead of a compulsory routine is to make an unflattering estimate of the appeal of our institutions to free minds. We can have intellectual individualism and the rich cultural diversities that we owe to exceptional minds only at the price of occasional eccentricity and abnormal attitudes. When they are so harmless to others or to the State as those we deal with here, the price is not too great. But freedom to differ is not limited to things that do not matter much. That would be a mere shadow of freedom. The test of its substance is the right to differ as to things that touch the heart of the existing order.
"If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception, they do not now occur to us."
--Supreme Court of the United States, West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943). -
You really don't think the flag represents our people, our system and our values.
Is it really that hard to to respect our country, its people, its values? That doesn't mean you agree with everything.
No I really don't understand it.
government isn't the country wrote:
Red white & blue wrote:
He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
The flag in question is the flag of our government, not the flag of our country. I love and respect the ~320 million people who are my country. This love is not reflected by pledging fealty to a bureaucracy that is one small part of our culture. -
-SCOTUS- wrote:
"To believe that patriotism will not flourish if patriotic ceremonies are voluntary and spontaneous instead of a compulsory routine is to make an unflattering estimate of the appeal of our institutions to free minds. We can have intellectual individualism and the rich cultural diversities that we owe to exceptional minds only at the price of occasional eccentricity and abnormal attitudes. When they are so harmless to others or to the State as those we deal with here, the price is not too great. But freedom to differ is not limited to things that do not matter much. That would be a mere shadow of freedom. The test of its substance is the right to differ as to things that touch the heart of the existing order.
"If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein. If there are any circumstances which permit an exception, they do not now occur to us."
--Supreme Court of the United States, West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943).
You are missing a couple of main points here.
(1) People watching someone being openly disrespectful to a country that they love have EVERY RIGHT to show and express their disapproval and to decide that they no longer want to be a part of that event.
(everyone agrees right?)
(2) He did this while under the employment of the team owners who have every right to require a certain level of decorum and behavior while under their employment.
(3) When on there own time everyone has complete freedom of expression. Everyone agrees with that. -
Red white & blue wrote:
Alejandro Villanueva has guts. It bucked all the peer pressure and he was the only Steeler to come out of the locker room to show his love and respect for this country.
He served in Afghanistan and he knows what respect and love of country means.
Sad when it takes guts to show respect.
I suspect that compared to what he has seen and done, this wasn't his gutsiest move. -
I have something to explain to you that most of you really are missing. You think Trump made a huge blunder by taking on the players who would not stand. You see the unity of all the players and you hear the commentators being critical of Trump and you think he made a huge political blunder, right?
Well very wrong. His popularity might actually go up. The NFL is black dominated and has a strong sense of team so their unity reaction to this is understandable. Owners can't defy 70% of their team so they walk a tight-rope.
Commentators have great fear of being caste as racist so they will talk the cause.
But heres the deal, almost everyone stands and believes that people should respect the country. They are offended when people kneel or sit during the anthem. People quietly agree with Trump on this one. They see highly paid black athletes leading a movement to disrespect the country they love.
Trump called them out on it. In the long run, HE WILL NOT BE HURT BY THIS but might actually gain popularity for his bravery.
I know most liberals will not understand or believe this.
