The Strange Case of Andrew Wheating

Just a coincidence wrote:

Interesting to see little taoufik in there. Hard to believe that he would completely destroy everyone in London 2 years later. Oh wait, Aden became his coach and watch holder...

Winner there is Amine Laalou. Served a nice fat doping ban while representing morocco.

jamin wrote:

Most runners set all their PRs in the same year (or same month) and then decline irreversibly

Fake news: A quick check shows that's not so for Kiprop, Rowbury, Rupp or Simpson.

Not a good look for the J-man. The ladies won't have much time for a know-it-all who makes stuff up.

Sad.

carmichaeldonuts wrote:

2010 PR: 3:30.90

2009 PR: 3:40.92

Enuf said.

It's hard to exaggerate how far out of his norm Wheating ran in Monaco. His next fastest 1500 in 2010 was 3:37.52. He ran that in Austin in late May. He ran a fast mile at Pre in early July, and then ran 3:30 three weeks later in Monaco. He never ran anywhere near as fast as those two races.

The 3:37s were predictable. His 1500 pr was 3:38.60 in 2008.

He dropped his 800 PR by 1/2 a second in 2010, so if he was doping, it didn't help much there.

And of course, his 2011 times are all substantially slower -- 1 1/2 seconds in the 800, and almost 3 1/2 seconds in the 1500. Since then, he's only gotten slower.

Without Monaco, nobody would mistake him for a world class anything. He'd be remembered as a guy who ran some fast 800s, but then got hurt and never recovered. I doubt anyone would suspect him of doping.

It's silly to think he's a doper. And people saying he had one outlier of a race are missing his body of work.

He doubled and won NCAA's in the 800 and 1500 his senior year. Doing that indicates he was well faster than his 3:37 seasons best.

I think for Andy it came down to not loving what he did and turning track into a job. The man needed an identity outside of track to keep him grounded. Track needed to be a form of expression, not a commitment.

Even when you watch his instagram clips. They're generally about him joking about the struggle, and how much work track is, but I don't think you'd be posting those things if you really enjoyed what you did.

If he was to keep running, I'd suggest he get a young coach. He has had enough old men telling him what he needs to, maybe someone younger and more emotionally attached could awaken a new spirit in Andy.

Wrong, but right wrote:

HardLoper wrote:

Remember, only two guys in the last decade (Kiprop and Kiplagat) have broken 3:30 outside of Monaco! Trampoline track?

Actually, since 2007, four guys have broken 3:30 outside of Monaco. [b[Choge ran 3:29.47 in Berlin in 2009, and Chepseba ran 3:29.90 at Hengelo in 2012. This just reinforces your point: Almost nobody runs under 3:30 outside of Monaco.

AND Choge has also ran sub 1:45, sub 7:30, and sub 12:55 which no other runner has achieved. GOAT 800+.

Wheating's problem is he's too tall. He could get away with being skinny when he was barely more than a teenager, but after that your body tries to fill out, and a filled out tall person is slow. If you starve yourself to stay skinny, BAM injury. Listen to your body as they say. Look at Choge. Little dude. That's how it's done. Wheating is more for basketball or something.

As an outside observer world class performances can be fleeting at best. Andrew ran extremely well when a season or a block of training went perfect. For those that run at an elite level we all remember that time. Unfortunately trying to regain that form is extremely difficult and for whatever reason he hasn't progressed. Will that ever take away from what he achieved? Not at all, but unfortunately the history tells us that the likely hood of him running those times again are extremely unlikely. In saying that I hope he does but whatever he thinks is working it isn't and he needs to find that place that allows him to be physically and mentally ready to get back to that level. I hope he does and wish him the best in finding out the 'answer'.

Fifjxjfbdbdbd wrote:

And people saying he had one outlier of a race are missing his body of work.

What exactly is this "body of work" that makes him "world class"?

It certainly wasn't his times. Except for July, 2010, he just wasn't that fast.

It also wasn't his ability to win races. As you say, he was very successful in college. But he was never that successful internationally, or as a pro. He made three national teams, but didn't make it out of rounds in the Olympics or Worlds. I don't remember him placing in a DL event.

I'm hardly a hater. I loved to watch him run, and always hoped he'd get back to his 2010 form. But he never did. After looking at his record, I was forced to admit that he just wasn't in the same league as Lagat, Centro, Leo or Lopez. They all were consistently faster and more competitive. He clearly belonged in the next group, and only for a few years.

As for whether Monaco was an outlier...

3:30.90

3:34.39

3:35.89

3:36.46

3:36.68

3:37.03

I only read the first page of posts, but it is common knowledge that Wheating is a stoner who further stepped up the blazing after college. Therefore, it should not be surprising at all that he has not been able to compete at the world class level since his college days.

I still think a sober and focused Wheating could make a surprise comeback and break 3:30. Let's hope!

Fogrunr wrote:

TAGAWIA wrote:

Wheating ran his best times of 1:44.56 and 3:30.9 when he was 22. Wheating started running later than many world class runners. However, Wheating is now 29, not much older than Mo Farah was when he began world domination. Yet Wheating is generally considered finished as a world class runner.

3:30.9 is extremely impressive. Not a whole lot of people who have run sub 3:30. And among those are quite a few dopers I'm sure. Perhaps he's not a doper and that is why he's not there anymore.

Some people on this board seem to think that massive outliers in performance and general inconsistencies indicate doping. I really believe the opposite is true. It's guys like Wheating, Webb, and Manzano who are clean. They had some real good seasons, and had some amazing races, but perfect training is hard to replicate over and over. The ups and downs are far more indicative of natural ebbs and flows in performance.

It's the guys who year in and year out seem to get it right that make me skeptical (i.e. Farah, Rupp)

letsbang wrote:

Fogrunr wrote:

3:30.9 is extremely impressive. Not a whole lot of people who have run sub 3:30. And among those are quite a few dopers I'm sure. Perhaps he's not a doper and that is why he's not there anymore.

Some people on this board seem to think that massive outliers in performance and general inconsistencies indicate doping. I really believe the opposite is true. It's guys like Wheating, Webb, and Manzano who are clean. They had some real good seasons, and had some amazing races, but perfect training is hard to replicate over and over. The ups and downs are far more indicative of natural ebbs and flows in performance.

It's the guys who year in and year out seem to get it right that make me skeptical (i.e. Farah, Rupp)

I certainly did not begin this thread with the intention of discussing doping, but just to address your point, there is no reason to assume that Webb and Wheating were either doping or not based on their trajectory, and your beliefs are countered by many examples. Some would contend that an erratic career could indicate doping. I am not necessarily convinced either way and am certain that some dopers have been erratic and others consistent. Some have doped consistently and others inconsistently...

Not an Ivy wrote:

Every athlete has to be evaluated on many levels. Not only talent wise (where Wheating is a 99) but also the ability to stay injury free (think Rupp), willingness to do all the little things to improve (think Willis) and the mental part of sport (think Centro).

Although Wheating may rank above the others in talent, he's far far below them all in the other three categories. At the college level, where he was micromanaged by a great manager/coach and was competing against far inferior athletes, he got by. On the world level where he's largely on his own, his poor ratings in the other areas were his downfall.

For another example of an athlete like Wheating, see: Brian Bozworth

Didn't the Boz have like a bone problem though? I can't remember exactly but I don't think his work ethic was necessarily his down fall

Rupp fan wrote:

I only read the first page of posts, but it is common knowledge that Wheating is a stoner who further stepped up the blazing after college. Therefore, it should not be surprising at all that he has not been able to compete at the world class level since his college days.

I still think a sober and focused Wheating could make a surprise comeback and break 3:30. Let's hope!

Lazy stoner. Wasted talent is what that $hit gets you.