Made that comment before I got to that part. But, I don't know the details of her assault. Was she actually assaulted like, someone forced her into some sexual activity? Or did some coach touch her on the shoulder while telling her how she could have improved her most recent race? Both of them seem to be thrown in the same bucket these days and I never know which one to assume happened anymore.
"While I had no reason to believe athletes were being sexually abused ..."
around 5:50.
show me your credentials, stud wrote:
99ninety wrote:
Snowflake
Do not use this term. It does not mean cry-baby liberal. It comes from the Aryans.
This thread is seriously warped. How many posters here are on the team at Harvard? So why do you care /spread the hate? If the article were written by Justin Smith, Ph.D., MIT pole vaulter, would you react the same way?
The answer, clearly, is no. They're a bunch of has-beens or never-was types.
The French coined the term "Ressentiment" for those frustrated men who projected their failures outward, at those on the rise and those whose value systems they blame for contributing to their downward trajectory.
Just go to the "Imma tryin run 2:30" page and find the real names of some of these dude-bros.
ohyeahthatstheticket wrote:
knower of things squared wrote:
My son runs D1. While my son's experience has been very positive despite a year long injury, I agree with this--most runners would be better off in D3 vs D1.
D1 distance running, especially at the top tier, is hard core. If you're ridiculously talented or have a lot of talent and love a challenge, go for it. Also, you better be durable. Otherwise, you'll probably have a more rewarding experience in D3 or a lower tier D1 program, IMO.
You don't need to go to college to run fast.
You are correct though, D1 vs D 3 is a totally different expectation. Edwin Moses was D3. It didn't slow him down.
If you're going to college for an education, it might be better to do it at a D3. If you expect have it paid for, it may be that you have to sacrifice a bit more than you are prepared to do.
Before my brother died I asked him why he turned down a full ride to UCLA. (Back when Lew Alcindor was a soph) He said the coach's expectation was that he'd run hurdles, sprints, relays, jumps each meet.. He was a Triple Jumper with a goal to go to the Olympics. He saw the college scene as one that was not conducive to his long term success for him. So he turned it down, and did quite well, achieving his goals.
Its all about choices. Understand what you are getting in to. If you want to coast and study, stay off the scholarship athlete circuit.
It seems these "this is Div 1" posters fail to understand that:
1) none of these X-C / Track programs are revenue-generating so there's no economic reason for taking physical and emotional abuse - if there EVER was.
2) Ivy League schools don't give out athletic scholarships. Students go to Ivy League schools for academics. So in that sense they do have an understanding what they're getting into - school! It's the coaches who don't.
Poster #191 wrote:
Made that comment before I got to that part. But, I don't know the details of her assault. Was she actually assaulted like, someone forced her into some sexual activity? Or did some coach touch her on the shoulder while telling her how she could have improved her most recent race? Both of them seem to be thrown in the same bucket these days and I never know which one to assume happened anymore.
Maybe you shouldn't assume anything.
Maybe you shouldn't assume that this was potentially a "touch on the shoulder".
Are you f-ing kidding us?
Just because it wasn't criminal assault, doesn't mean it was defensible at all, especially from people in authority.
The UW coach was fired after many allegations of weight-shaming combined with grabbing people's midsections. That's not sexual but it is bullying and harassing behavior. And the effects are real.
https://www.safetyandhealthmagazine.com/articles/18015-study-shows-workplace-bullying-rivals-diabetes-drinking-as-heart-disease-risk-factorknower of things squared wrote:
Premium BS Detector wrote:
Total BS. The coaches have to go. You're either one of those coaches, a friend or spouse of one or more of those coaches, or someone hired by them in a vain attempt at damage control on this board. Harvard is now dead concerning any future recruiting, until an ethical coaching staff is put in place. End of story.
I beg to differ re: 'Harvard is now dead concerning any future recruiting...' Harvard is Harvard. If you're offered admissions and a package (not a scholarship) and you've spoken to some of the women who have publicly supported PWD, you're probably going to Harvard.
Remember, once you're in Harvard, you can stop running and graduate from Harvard. Not a bad outcome. Which is why, IMO, so many women have quit. Why put up with a jerk coach? Just stop running and remain a student. NBD.
If you're truly committed to maximizing your potential, you'll probably love PWD.
Either way, you win.
Sorry, runners worth making a D1 team won't just sell out for a Harvard degree. If you are fast enough for Harvard, you are fast enough for Yale. An equally amazing school with a brilliant and talented coach. Runners that do go, just haven't done their research. Improvement and retainment SHOULD be key criteria in selecting a school.
sconehead wrote:
Maybe you shouldn't assume anything.
Maybe you shouldn't assume that this was potentially a "touch on the shoulder".
Are you f-ing kidding us?
Just because it wasn't criminal assault, doesn't mean it was defensible at all, especially from people in authority.
The UW coach was fired after many allegations of weight-shaming combined with grabbing people's midsections. That's not sexual but it is bullying and harassing behavior. And the effects are real.
Maybe you shouldn't assume I assumed anything. Had you actually processed what I wrote you would have determined that I quite clearly stated that I don't know what happened. Because we're now okay with calling almost literally anything assault, the spectrum of what she alludes to can be
Some coach touching her on the shoulder
Some coach forcing himself on her sexually
Or anywhere in between
I'm not jumping to any conclusions, simply stating that the times and circumstances we live in have thrown a fog over allegations without details or evidence. I specifically used the two examples above because her mannerisms in he video can be explained by both scenarios as well. If someone really forced her into sexual activity, I could see it effecting her speaking patterns when talking about it in public. But if it's one of the newfangled cases of 'assault' and she had these mannerisms to begin with, she would definitely be the type of person to interpret a touch on the shoulder as assault.
Don't be mad at me, I didn't create this mess.
dontsellout wrote:
knower of things squared wrote:
I beg to differ re: 'Harvard is now dead concerning any future recruiting...' Harvard is Harvard. If you're offered admissions and a package (not a scholarship) and you've spoken to some of the women who have publicly supported PWD, you're probably going to Harvard.
Remember, once you're in Harvard, you can stop running and graduate from Harvard. Not a bad outcome. Which is why, IMO, so many women have quit. Why put up with a jerk coach? Just stop running and remain a student. NBD.
If you're truly committed to maximizing your potential, you'll probably love PWD.
Either way, you win.
Sorry, runners worth making a D1 team won't just sell out for a Harvard degree. If you are fast enough for Harvard, you are fast enough for Yale. An equally amazing school with a brilliant and talented coach. Runners that do go, just haven't done their research. Improvement and retainment SHOULD be key criteria in selecting a school.
Plenty of runners worth making a D1 team make the choice to persue one of the best educations and college experiences in the world.
Yale’s team is not a better substitute for Harvard. In XC they consistently lose to Harvard.
As for retainment, they lost a large portion of their guys a few years ago and are still recovering.
Poster #191 wrote:
sconehead wrote:
Maybe you shouldn't assume anything.
Maybe you shouldn't assume that this was potentially a "touch on the shoulder".
Are you f-ing kidding us?
Just because it wasn't criminal assault, doesn't mean it was defensible at all, especially from people in authority.
The UW coach was fired after many allegations of weight-shaming combined with grabbing people's midsections. That's not sexual but it is bullying and harassing behavior. And the effects are real.
Maybe you shouldn't assume I assumed anything. Had you actually processed what I wrote you would have determined that I quite clearly stated that I don't know what happened. Because we're now okay with calling almost literally anything assault, the spectrum of what she alludes to can be
Some coach touching her on the shoulder
Some coach forcing himself on her sexually
Or anywhere in between
I'm not jumping to any conclusions, simply stating that the times and circumstances we live in have thrown a fog over allegations without details or evidence. I specifically used the two examples above because her mannerisms in he video can be explained by both scenarios as well. If someone really forced her into sexual activity, I could see it effecting her speaking patterns when talking about it in public. But if it's one of the newfangled cases of 'assault' and she had these mannerisms to begin with, she would definitely be the type of person to interpret a touch on the shoulder as assault.
Don't be mad at me, I didn't create this mess.
You don't get it. And yes, the likes of you are creating this mess.
It's not newfangled - look up common law & your statutes on assault / battery, the language is much older than you: an assault is an offensive touching. What's an offensive touching? When one person intentionally touches another person, knowing that the person is thereby likely to cause offense / alarm to another. Law schools have tested on it for decades.
Your claim that "we're now okay with calling almost literally anything assault" is simply Cro-Mag talk radio fhilu78q3 4kn;wtw4ehrow3iye rgudlrygt98osytfouq2rp gibberish and totally false. That's how you are jumping to conclusions.
Find one example of your premise in college sports or any employment context. It doesn't exist.
By creating this false premise, you have widened the definition in your mind and also (unintentionally, I don't know) diminished the harm that has come to these student-athletes.
You are also jumping to conclusions with your "mannerisms in the video" thing. WTF? Are you an expert on assault? Are you saying everyone who experiences assault needs to exhibit some set of behaviors to validate their ordeal for you?
You LRC bros are something else.
I think you missed the whole (Harvard, Yale, or Princeton, I don't remember) fiasco where everyone was up in arms about a video showing a coach touching a female athlete. You also must have missed the part where some floozy claimed Neil DeGrasee Tyson sexually assaulted her because he touched her shoulder while looking at her solar system tattoo and people are taking her seriously. You think I'm making this out of whole cloth? It would not be in my mind at all if there weren't real world examples of it.
Make your case for 'coach shouldn't touch, period' or 'famous scientists shouldn't touch, period' but when you feel the need to empower weak people into victimhood by encouraging them to feel like the victim of a sexual assault over nothing, then YOU are the problem.
You want to get into the law with a fine tooth comb? Fine. Prove that in either of these instances the guy knew and was intentionally trying to cause distress. I'll wait, I've got time.
You seem like you have an unhealthy amount of energy behind this. Do you know what happened to the speaker in the video? I don't. Why don't you muster up your best guess? Or do you just always assume when someone says 'I was sexually assaulted' that it means the absolute worst possible case scenario?
And to clarify, no, I'm certainly not an expert on behavior or assault. I made a statement based on some very basic generalizations of people who've experienced trauma or are generally mentally unwell. Pretty obvious there's going to be a wide spectrum of behaviors associated with those. Hers in the video are pretty spot-on for both, again, not an expert but I doubt an expert would disagree when it's as plain as it is there.
Randomly found this while looking up Alberto Salazar stuff today. I also ran with Jason several years before you and found it equally terrible. I had come from an incredible HS team with a top class coach and switching to Jason's coaching was terrible. I cried every single one on one I had with him. He lacked empathy and training skills. The workouts he put together made no sense and he often wouldn't even tell us how many repeats we were doing in the middle of a workout which seems completely counter productive to training for long distance where you need to regulate your speed over distance. When I was injured he accused me of not wanting to get better, (I lived for running at the time and it was the furthest thing from the truth as possible), and I got pneumonia from running in the cold (-5 in boston) and he thought I was making it up and made me attend practice where I nearly blacked out and finally went to student health services. Those are just a few examples. I'm sorry you had a bad experience too. It makes me sad he's running this program especially for women. It's ridiculous that Harvard didn't promote Ricardo Santos to head coach when they had him. He was much more sensitive and his coaching record since he left Harvard speaks for itself.
This post was removed.
Jakob Ingebrigtsen has a 1989 Ferrari 348 GTB and he's just put in paperwork to upgrade it
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
Strava thinks the London Marathon times improved 12 minutes last year thanks to supershoes
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts