Have you ever tried to make the Olympic Marathon Trials?

i would be for that only if the half marathon time standard got tougher. Say sub 64there are a bunch of 2:21-22 guys who would have to make a significant leap to get to 2:18, and i think that 4 minutes separates the men from the elite meni know (4) 2:20-21 guys in my city who have full-time jobs and only one of them has run sub 65 HM.it would be nice for there to be more bodies in the trials, which i think would be awesome, so why not?! i'm sure many of the 2:18:01 - 2:22:00 guys would be happy to pay their way to the trials too

NERunner053 wrote:

Would love to see the men's standard back at 2:22.

There are certainly people that have a family, challenging career and still run at a high level, but it is definitely not the norm. I also know many people just make excuses about their situation in order to justify their own laziness.

Over the last 3 years I have definitely asked myself if I am just making excuses. I certainly could run more than I do, but I have a very difficult time mentally fitting it all in. I have always been an all or nothing person. All running to all family.

My job also doesn't provide the best work life balance. I work a lot of weekends and have a fairly random schedule which prevents me from having a consistent plan or being able to tough out the week and know I can make it up on the weekend. I also have a 50 minute commute at the moment because my wife and I prefer to live outside of the city. Fortunately in October of this year that commute is going to drop down to 3 minutes. I am actually very optimistic that i'll be able to get back on the wagon. My wife and I are also considering having her stay at home at the end of the year which I hope will help alleviate some of my guilt of running after work. right now I leave for work at 5:45 and get home at 6ish. Dinner with the family, put my son (6 months old) to bed at 7, then my wife works evenings so I need to be around in case he wakes up.

It would be easy to say find a different job, get a shorter commute, live somewhere else, skip dinner with your family 3 days a week, run at 4 am everyday. I have a good paying job that provides well for my family, I love where I live and its where I want my kids to grow up, the commute issue is going to improve and skipping dinner with my family 3 days a week isn't an option.

I'll be the first to admit that I am not strong enough to run at 4am everyday. If it was once and a while I could pull it off, but 5 days a week is just too much for me. When you spend 10 years making every decision in life based on how it relates to your running then completely shift to making decisions based on how it relates to your family it made it very difficult for me. I still have faith I can get back into it sometime in my 30's so hope is not lost!

When my son was born last November I took a month off work and was able get back in the routine of running each day. It definitely felt great and I was able to drop my 5k from 18 min to 16:20 in about an 8 week stretch. I'm still fairly new to this whole husband and father thing so hopefully I'll get better at managing it all and be able to find more time and energy for my athletic pursuits.

A fairly long commute and a wife who works a different schedule definitely complicates things more. And I couldn't do the 4:00 am thing either. But I would submit that you are probably on one far end of the spectrum and that most people are not away from their home for 12+ hour stretches 5 days a week.

I have a 5 minute commute, and it is glorious, and my kids are past the toddler stage and have reached the point where they can bathe themselves. So don't get too down about not running - there is light at the end of the tunnel on that front.

I'm not sure I've been a good 5K 10K guy in college is a prerequisite… But when you start looking at the standard of two hours 18 minutes that's a lot of speed I'm not saying the women standard is significantly easier or harder I have no clue I'm not a woman. I do certainly think that running 5:15-5:20 pace is certainly fast... you have to run 16:30 5k pace for 2 hours.... that isn't slow.

To run 2:45 a 6:20 mile isn't even comparable.

I can run 2:30 for reference but dropping to 2:18 requires some serious speed. 5:20 miles are fast as crap.

I've also known/met a lot of runners who've run in the Trials over the years...I can't think of a single guy that ran sub 2:19:00 that wasn't a 5km/10km (or any distance) runner in college (and usually a pretty good one!). For women I know there are stories of several who took up distance running later life (i.e. their 20s and 30s) and hit the OTQ standard though. Most of the guys that OTQ (esp. for the 2:19:00 standard) were pretty good (if not great) college runners. Probably at least sub 31:00 10km (if not sub 30:30). There are always a few that developed a lot later (usually with very high mileage) and made it after college with slightly slower 10km times - but it is certainly not easy and not the norm. There are 29:00 10km guys that also don't make it sometimes. You don't have to be All-American college level (I certainly wasn't), but it's probably going to take some pretty high mileage and smart training/workouts.

Speed needed wrote:

I'm not sure I've been a good 5K 10K guy in college is a prerequisite… But when you start looking at the standard of two hours 18 minutes that's a lot of speed I'm not saying the women standard is significantly easier or harder I have no clue I'm not a woman. I do certainly think that running 5:15-5:20 pace is certainly fast... you have to run 16:30 5k pace for 2 hours.... that isn't slow.

To run 2:45 a 6:20 mile isn't even comparable.

I can run 2:30 for reference but dropping to 2:18 requires some serious speed. 5:20 miles are fast as crap.

Speed needed wrote:

I'm not sure I've been a good 5K 10K guy in college is a prerequisite… But when you start looking at the standard of two hours 18 minutes that's a lot of speed I'm not saying the women standard is significantly easier or harder I have no clue I'm not a woman. I do certainly think that running 5:15-5:20 pace is certainly fast... you have to run 16:30 5k pace for 2 hours.... that isn't slow.

To run 2:45 a 6:20 mile isn't even comparable.

I can run 2:30 for reference but dropping to 2:18 requires some serious speed. 5:20 miles are fast as crap.

Agreed. I'm just saying that I was able to make the women's marathon OTQ standard with a 5K time that would not be remotely competitive at any level (except Masters). A competitive 5K time for a man is a whole lot faster than for a woman, and the OTQ marathon standard is too.

I think your description of what it takes talent and training wise was true for the sub-2:20 guy 40 years ago. So seems spot on to me.

Igy

I agree 100% with Smoove. The good thing about our sport is how truly convenient it is compared to most traditional sports. We don't require a team to scrimmage with, we don't require much gear, we can train almost anywhere, and best of all is that there are plenty of competitions to pursue past your collegiate days with road racing. Sure, some times you may not get as much sleep as you want to, or run as much mileage as you need to, but the time commitment is generally not really an issue if you put your mind to it and are willing to be flexible. If running 1-2hrs a day is going to hold your impressively busy life back and reduce your social life that much, then I feel bad for you.

A good "developed later" case is Steve Way. Didn't run at all in high school or college and his shorter distance PRs are relatively very poor compared to his marathon PR (2:15 set at age 40).

I tried to make the trials back in 2012 and qualified at probably the last opportune time... My progression was all over the place, as the qualifying window opened on Jan. 1st of 2009. The qualifying times were:

A Standards

1/2 Marathon - 1:05:00

Marathon - 2:19:00

There were no B standards for the men at the time, but there were for women... and I don't remember their qualifying time off the top of my head. Anyways, I ran a 1:08 low for my debut half marathon in 2006, and I regretted not chasing the marathon standard at the time for the 2008 (aka. 2007 NYC) Trials, but decided I would chase it for 2012. In 2008 I ran a 1:04:55, but that would not qualify since the window hadn't opened yet. After that quick half, I was sure of a qualifier in the half, so by January in Houston, I thought I would knock it out of the park. Boy, was I wrong, I ran a 1:05:38. That fall I attempted the full marathon distance at Twin Cities and ran 2:24 after going through half in 1:11. I didn't want to blow up, so I felt I would race my first marathon conservative. It was 2009, and I felt I had plenty of time to qualify.

After not making it in Twin Cities, I decided to race a low key spring marathon and ran 2:26 after going out in 1:09 something. It seemed like my training and racing were going backwards. I followed that race with a 2:26 in Chicago of 2010. It was hot there, but I probably trained like an idiot. I was with a huge pack of guys - a few Hansons guys (Sage, Tim Young) a few other solid guys, but we came through in 1:09 as well, and I just blew up. After Chicago, I felt I was not a marathoner and I should just give up. I also got injured for about 5 months. Once spring came around, I got motivated again and continued to chase the OT time. I was going to run New York City in Nov if I hadn't qualified in the half, and after running a slew of 1:06 - 1:05's that fall, I felt that NYC would be a difficult course, so I switched over to CIM. At CIM I ran 2:17, just 5 weeks before the Houston Trials. I was beyond ecstatic when I qualified at CIM, and was thrilled as hell to be on the starting line in Houston with all the best marathoners the US had to offer. Needless to say, with 5 weeks after CIM I ran a 2:22 at the trials. Still worth it!

S. Canaday wrote:

I've also known/met a lot of runners who've run in the Trials over the years...I can't think of a single guy that ran sub 2:19:00 that wasn't a 5km/10km (or any distance) runner in college (and usually a pretty good one!). For women I know there are stories of several who took up distance running later life (i.e. their 20s and 30s) and hit the OTQ standard though.

Fellow former Hansons runner Mike Reneau was not a collegiate distance runner and ran in the 2008 and 2012 Olympic Trials Marathons. I can't think of any other examples like that though, so the point basically holds true.

Cole Atkins is one example of someone who came to the sport late and qualified for the OT in the marathon with only a limited collegiate track history- he played college soccer for 4 years and then came to the track for only his senior year.

Hoping may be helpful to moms/women who want OTQ. Did not run in college.

1st (@ 30 mpw) 1994 (Boston) 3:35

2nd (50-70 mpw no speed/no pick ups) 1996 (Bay State) 3:02

3rd (50-70 mpw speed) 1997 (Boston) 3:00

4th (50-75 mpw speed) 1998 (Houston) 3:00

5th (50-80 mpw speed) 1998 (Vermont) 2:54

Baby #1 Feb 1999

6th (50-80 mpw speed/pickups) 1999 (Chicago) 2:47

7th Olympic Trials 2000(Columbia SC) 2:52

Baby #2 Dec 2000

8th (60-85 mpw speed/pickups) 2002 (Boston) 2:46

9th Olympic Trials (60-90 mpw speed/pickups) 2004 (St Louis) 2:45.

Due to medical complications could not run while pregnant. Worked full time. Did have 3 month maternity leave after Baby #1. Treadmill in basement w baby monitor & bouncy saucers. Single/double baby jogger for thousands of miles. No doubles. Keep faith! Train hard. You can do it!

Kiki C wrote:

Hoping may be helpful to moms/women who want OTQ. Did not run in college.

1st (@ 30 mpw) 1994 (Boston) 3:35

2nd (50-70 mpw no speed/no pick ups) 1996 (Bay State) 3:02

3rd (50-70 mpw speed) 1997 (Boston) 3:00

4th (50-75 mpw speed) 1998 (Houston) 3:00

5th (50-80 mpw speed) 1998 (Vermont) 2:54

Baby #1 Feb 1999

6th (50-80 mpw speed/pickups) 1999 (Chicago) 2:47

7th Olympic Trials 2000(Columbia SC) 2:52

Baby #2 Dec 2000

8th (60-85 mpw speed/pickups) 2002 (Boston) 2:46

9th Olympic Trials (60-90 mpw speed/pickups) 2004 (St Louis) 2:45.

Due to medical complications could not run while pregnant. Worked full time. Did have 3 month maternity leave after Baby #1. Treadmill in basement w baby monitor & bouncy saucers. Single/double baby jogger for thousands of miles. No doubles. Keep faith! Train hard. You can do it!

This is really inspiring to read! What age did you start running marathons?

26 years old for 1st marathon (3:35). Swore I'd never run another. Inspired by 1996 Runner's World article on Jenny Spangler & her 30 minute PR. Said if her, why not me? Trained myself for 1996 (3:02). Then joined running club & got professional coaching which brought OTQs.

Kiki C wrote:

26 years old for 1st marathon (3:35). Swore I'd never run another. Inspired by 1996 Runner's World article on Jenny Spangler & her 30 minute PR. Said if her, why not me? Trained myself for 1996 (3:02). Then joined running club & got professional coaching which brought OTQs.

That's awesome. What were some of the workouts that you remember doing? I'm trying to learn from other women, but I feel like a lot of my peers/competitors are very vague when I ask them how they train.

For what it's worth, I was never coached by anyone. I ran 3:47 in my first marathon at age 25, 25 pounds overweight and badly undertrained but with adequate respect for the distance, so I went out slowly and actually had a pretty good experience. After getting serious around age 30 I lost weight and upped the mileage. However, apart from a weekly long run with my running club, which followed no particular training schedule (whatever they decided to do that week), and often a mid-week interval workout, all of my runs were alone and unstructured. I ran 2:45 and 2:43 at age 33.

amkelley wrote:

For what it's worth, I was never coached by anyone. I ran 3:47 in my first marathon at age 25, 25 pounds overweight and badly undertrained but with adequate respect for the distance, so I went out slowly and actually had a pretty good experience. After getting serious around age 30 I lost weight and upped the mileage. However, apart from a weekly long run with my running club, which followed no particular training schedule (whatever they decided to do that week), and often a mid-week interval workout, all of my runs were alone and unstructured. I ran 2:45 and 2:43 at age 33.

That sounds like what I do.

Used a 21 day training cycle w 2 days off every 21 days. 10 days running 1 off/9 days running 1 off. 4-5 miles intervals on track every Tuesday (i.e 16 x 400 or 20 x 400 or ladders 400, 800, 1200, 1600, 1200, 800, 400 or inverse, in & out 400s for 5 miles, 10 x 800, 4 or 5 x 1 mile, less rest as training cycle progessed). Training partners for speed work were key. Fartlek every Thursday. Marathon Pace during late stages of weekly Long Run progressing in length as training cycle progressed. Some up tempo activity usually 3 x per week. Before babies, lifted weights 2 x per week. Still feel reaped benefits of weight work years later.