Good morning! How are all you LRC stable geniuses doing this fine am?
Good morning! How are all you LRC stable geniuses doing this fine am?
Flagpole wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
BTW, Trump will not resign. Trump is an autocrat and autocrats don't resign.
There are only three ways that autocrats leave office.
They either rule for life, get thrown in prison, or they are taken out back and shot.
Yeah, but that's not how we do things here. IF there is a benefit to him via plea bargain to resign, then he will. If and his legal team are smart, they will actually ASK for that.
I agree with you that he doesn't have the makeup to resign, and if he were in another country he would not, but again, if there is a plea deal attached to his resignation, he will do it.
That's not how we do things here? Since when have American political norms applied to Donald Trump?
Also, how do you attach a plea deal to the resignation of a president? There is no legal mechanism to do that. No court would accept such a plea.
Trump simply will not resign. He will not willingly give up power under any circumstance.
It's September 4th. Give up losers, he's not being impeached. You claimed in April(?) that by Summer, we'd all see.
The mainstream media combined with your own small brains is what's leading you to believe the impossible. Now it's next Spring!
LOL, you guys have no lives, not one of you 3 idiots.
Flagpole leads with---trollnobrains & LLbraindead follow. Hilarious! The 3 Stooges!
Thanks for the entertainment you old farts!
Call the election into question in who's mind? There may be 10 or 20 million morans who think Trump losing means it's been hacked. Who cares?
Serious people don't believe that nonsense.
What you think Trump would order the military to do if he wanted to stay in power? How do you think they would respond?
Cheeto Benito wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
Trump would just need to cook up enough phony evidence to call the election into serious question.
Riots don't matter. In this scenario, it comes down to who has control of the military. Trump would still be commander in chief after the election.
The question is whether or not the military would follow his lawful orders.
Call the election into question in who's mind? There may be 10 or 20 million morans who think Trump losing means it's been hacked. Who cares?
Serious people don't believe that nonsense.
What you think Trump would order the military to do if he wanted to stay in power? How do you think they would respond?
The Military has a very high Trump approval rating. Big pay raises, bonuses, and easier promotions tend to help in that.
Alan
Cheeto Benito wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
Trump would just need to cook up enough phony evidence to call the election into serious question.
Riots don't matter. In this scenario, it comes down to who has control of the military. Trump would still be commander in chief after the election.
The question is whether or not the military would follow his lawful orders.
Call the election into question in who's mind? There may be 10 or 20 million morans who think Trump losing means it's been hacked. Who cares?
Serious people don't believe that nonsense.
What you think Trump would order the military to do if he wanted to stay in power? How do you think they would respond?
For starters, he could order the military to detain the president-elect and prevent him or her from taking the oath of office.
Like I said, the question would be whether or not they would follow his order. So Trump would find loyalists and put them in charge of our military. This is how authoritarians stay in power.
I know a lot of this sounds unthinkable in America. A lot of unthinkable things have already happened. It was unthinkable that our government would steal children from their mothers. It's unthinkable, but it happened. Trump ordered it and it happened.
RCP average approval rating down to 41.8%. The McCain thing really hurt Trump with his base.
The separation of families happened because many people who are opposed to illegal immigration believe that's warranted. Was that a Trump initiative though?
I don't think Trump could just issue that kind of order out of the blue. There would have to be a lot of agreement between him and various generals first. Otherwise Trump wouldn't know how they would respond. I just don't think he could pull it off.
Trump has burned his bridges. He stabs everyone in the back eventually. Would it be worth any senior military figures taking part in a coup?
Runningart2004 wrote:
Cheeto Benito wrote:
Call the election into question in who's mind? There may be 10 or 20 million morans who think Trump losing means it's been hacked. Who cares?
Serious people don't believe that nonsense.
What you think Trump would order the military to do if he wanted to stay in power? How do you think they would respond?
The Military has a very high Trump approval rating. Big pay raises, bonuses, and easier promotions tend to help in that.
Alan
I don't think they will just commit treason because they approve of him. They probably approve of him in part because they think he isn't corrupt or treasonous. If he says one day: "Thank you for your loyalty. America is now a banana republic. I order you to detain the President-elect. I'll give you a bonus!" I think they will detain him instead.
Cheeto Benito wrote:
Runningart2004 wrote:
The Military has a very high Trump approval rating. Big pay raises, bonuses, and easier promotions tend to help in that.
Alan
I don't think they will just commit treason because they approve of him. They probably approve of him in part because they think he isn't corrupt or treasonous. If he says one day: "Thank you for your loyalty. America is now a banana republic. I order you to detain the President-elect. I'll give you a bonus!" I think they will detain him instead.
Detain him? You've all gone bonkers!!! Flagpole with yet another handle!:)
Still Laughing@U wrote:
It's September 4th. Give up losers, he's not being impeached. You claimed in April(?) that by Summer, we'd all see.
The mainstream media combined with your own small brains is what's leading you to believe the impossible. Now it's next Spring!
LOL, you guys have no lives, not one of you 3 idiots.
Flagpole leads with---trollnobrains & LLbraindead follow. Hilarious! The 3 Stooges!
Thanks for the entertainment you old farts!
I have to say, we underestimated the Republicans ability to be blind to reason and exist in a totally partisan vacuum.
There is no way that a Republican majority would impeach a Republican president.
Even of he shot a person on Fifth Avenue.
So we must wait for next spring where a Democrat majority House can begin impeachment proceedings.
Even then, there has to be something serious underlying that we don't know about now.
And I think there is something serious underlying. And I think Mueller has it already.
If Republicans hold onto the House, yes, Trump sails through to then end of 2020.
Then Trump can rape babies in the Oval Office on live TV and have no consequences.
Yes, the separation of families was a Trump administration initiative. They announced that they were going to do it. Then they did it. Nobody in government refused to carry out the orders.
It remains to be seen if good men and women in the government will finally stand up against Trump's authoritarianism. So far the record is not so good.
"Two long running, Obama era, investigations of two very popular Republican Congressmen were brought to a well publicized charge, just ahead of the Mid-Terms, by the Jeff Sessions Justice Department. Two easy wins now in doubt because there is not enough time. Good job Jeff......"
Unbelievable or par for the course (at Maralaga)?
A sitting president just blasted the justice system for charging Republicans for crimes that they did in fact do.
Trump is actually trying to direct his Attorney General to only charge Democrats with crimes.
Flagpole Handle Seeing of Changer of Minds of all things Hillary wrote:
Cheeto Benito wrote:
I don't think they will just commit treason because they approve of him. They probably approve of him in part because they think he isn't corrupt or treasonous. If he says one day: "Thank you for your loyalty. America is now a banana republic. I order you to detain the President-elect. I'll give you a bonus!" I think they will detain him instead.
Detain him? You've all gone bonkers!!! Flagpole with yet another handle!:)
So do you think out of the blue Trump will just issue an order to detain the President Elect? I don't think authoritarians just do this without prior agreement.
I really don't know what will happen if Trump throws a tantrum. Perhaps somewhere in between Jon Drummond staying on the track for a few minutes after false starting and Margaret Thatcher crying when she left Downing Street.
Fat hurts wrote:
Flagpole wrote:
Yeah, but that's not how we do things here. IF there is a benefit to him via plea bargain to resign, then he will. If and his legal team are smart, they will actually ASK for that.
I agree with you that he doesn't have the makeup to resign, and if he were in another country he would not, but again, if there is a plea deal attached to his resignation, he will do it.
That's not how we do things here? Since when have American political norms applied to Donald Trump?
Also, how do you attach a plea deal to the resignation of a president? There is no legal mechanism to do that. No court would accept such a plea.
Trump simply will not resign. He will not willingly give up power under any circumstance.
You are definitely correct about political norms not applying to Trump and that there is no legal mechanism to attach a plea deal to the resignation of a president. For the former, though norms haven't applied to Trump, your three possibilities are too extreme to apply here. Regarding the former, anything can be brought up as a first-time thing. Trump and his legal team are going to want to protect him as much as possible, and since he WILL face impeachment and removal and he WILL face being indicted after removal from office, they will at least try to have some sort of agreement about how it is all to go down...call it a plea deal or not, but they will try to strike some sort of deal. Perhaps it will go no where. I hope so, because as he gets more and more cornered, he is more and more dangerous to our democracy, and that can not stand.
I see no benefit to him to wait out a Senate decision. The only light at the end of the tunnel for him is to resign and hopefully get lesser punishment.
I hope you are correct. Seeing Trump not willingly give up power and yet he is removed from power is a strong message to the world and to any future dictator wannabe US Presidents.
It is going to be interesting to see how this all goes down, but he WILL face the music.
L L wrote:
"Two long running, Obama era, investigations of two very popular Republican Congressmen were brought to a well publicized charge, just ahead of the Mid-Terms, by the Jeff Sessions Justice Department. Two easy wins now in doubt because there is not enough time. Good job Jeff......"
Unbelievable or par for the course (at Maralaga)?
A sitting president just blasted the justice system for charging Republicans for crimes that they did in fact do.
Trump is actually trying to direct his Attorney General to only charge Democrats with crimes.
Trump is an authoritarian. Is anyone surprised at this?
I just question how much of a departure that was. There is already a campaign against illegal immigrants, so I'm not surprised that ICE did what they were told. I'm also not surprised that other figures (police, military, ???) did not challenge them, because this is clearly the responsibility of ICE.
I don't think there is any section of the military which is supposed to help the President become an autocrat, so if some agreed to help, others would likely act to stop it. I think this fact alone means nobody (probably not even the President, but even more surely nobody in the military) would try it.
Flagpole wrote:
Seeing Trump not willingly give up power and yet he is removed from power is a strong message to the world and to any future dictator wannabe US Presidents.
I agree with this.
It would be nice to see the system work and the checks and balances put into the Constitution utilized to remove a president.
That's never happened before.
And it won't happen. If it gets to a point where 67 Senators are about to vote for conviction, some deal will be struck to avoid that conviction.
Nixon resigned when he knew for votes for impeachment were there.
Nixon received a pardon for any crimes he might of committed while in the president.
He wasn't even indicted and he was pardoned.
Trump might want a deal like that.
Cheeto Benito wrote:
So do you think out of the blue Trump will just issue an order to detain the President Elect? I don't think authoritarians just do this without prior agreement.
I really don't know what will happen if Trump throws a tantrum. Perhaps somewhere in between Jon Drummond staying on the track for a few minutes after false starting and Margaret Thatcher crying when she left Downing Street.
First, Trump would put loyalists in place to carry out the orders. Then he makes the order. That's how it works.