USA Cycling Wants to Permit EPO Use and Transfusions

pop_pop!_v2.2.1 wrote:

Old Man Winter wrote:

So he wants to redefine the word "cheating" to mean preventing athletes from using potentially harmful drugs?

I'd like to point out this is THE HEAD OF AN ANTI-DOPING ORGANIZATION TELLING ATHLETES THEY SHOULD DOPE. USA Cycling will not stop them.

It's almost shocking except for the fact the guy that owns USA Cycling was the one behind the USPS doping system has a long history of being okay with doping.

Imagine that. An IOC sports federation promoting doping.

Serious question: Who is the owner of USA Cycling?

Of course it is also perfectly reasonable that Dr. Gabriele Rosa said that he left the sport of CYCLING to move to Kenya to work with Kenyan runners because the sport of cycling was too dirty with drugs like EPO for a person like himself to stay and involve himself in things like that.

In conclusion:

nothing to see here.

The Overexplainer wrote:

Serious question: Who is the owner of USA Cycling?

Thom Wiesel. He runs USA Cycling by controlling the assignment of a majority of the seats on the BOD. Look at USACDF's tax forms.

The rest of the seats go to donors and his friends.

A haematology consultant told me EPO is definitely not safe & is only uses in medical emergencies.

I was seriously ill in hospital with a blood disorder for several months. Had every drug under the sun including one to boost blood cell production.. and they still didn't give me EPO!

While the subject is still somewhat open, there exists a body of material pointing out that cancer patients receiving rEPO treatment have actually larger risk of dying than patients not getting the treatment. This idea was popularized a few years ago in the book Blood Medicine by Kathleen Sharp, a book which was reviewed recently in Podiumcafe by Feargal McKay.http://www.podiumcafe.com/book-corner/2015/4/26/8499095/blood-medicine-by-kathleen-sharpHere is an interesting paragraph from the book quoted by McKay:

An independent study published in the October 2003 issue of the British medical journal the Lancet had tested European patients in a well-defined scientific trial. The ENHANCE Study had all the right components and was a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of 351 head and neck cancer patients receiving radiation therapy. The researchers had expected that patients who had received the drug before radiation treatments would fare better than the control group who skipped injections. Some oncologists hoped EPO might even help study patients live longer, which would have been a boon for patients and drug-makers alike. But to everyone's shock, the EPO group fared much worse; they were 69 percent more likely to die.

Without vouching for the often repeated and almost totally unsubstantianted claim about 18 deaths in Netherlands and Belgium caused by EPO in 1987-1990 (I don't believe the story for various reasons), there is the possibility that EPO indeed does cause blood clots if hematocrit levels are elevated too high. If I am not mistaken, patients receiving rEPO-treatment had higher level of thrombosis cases also than the control group.

Yes. And some other studies also show decreased survival in other conditions and increased tumor growth.

The HIF-stabilizers may also increase tumor growth since besides increasing transcription of the gene for EPO, they would also increase transcription of other genes such as VEGF that are involved in angiogenesis, which could increase blood vessel growth to the tumor and promote tumor growth.

Maybe a little boring for some people:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HIF1A

…and interesting for other people.

Oh well.

I encourage you all to take a look at this analysis of those cycling deaths:

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17460263.2011.555208

I'm not going to say EPO is as safe as orange juice, but there is some over-hype of the risk early adapters put themselves through.

Clerk wrote:

I encourage you all to take a look at this analysis of those cycling deaths:

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17460263.2011.555208

I'm not going to say EPO is as safe as orange juice, but there is some over-hype of the risk early adapters put themselves through.

This issue is always under some pressure for revision.

absolutely lack empirical evidence,

It's true. No empirical evidence because apparently there was no autopsy, tests, or aggregation thereof.

Meanwhile, in Pantani's era, cyclists were wearing heart rate monitors before going to sleep so they would be alerted if their heart rate got too low and then jump on a trainer to fix it.

It seems like the research isn't an accurate reflection of reality.

Well, most of the time EPO is not going to be considered as a cause of death. It would be very difficult to prove that it was the cause of death. For instance, here is an article about the sudden death of the young woman that Kenenisa Bekele was going to marry. In the article it states that she had visited Dr. Hans Mueller Wohlfharht in Germany way back then…which of course is just another coincidence.

There is also a statement about allegations that Healing Hans had the entire German World Cup soccer team on anabolic steroids in 1974. There is also a statement about Paula Radcliffe seeing Healing Hans days before the 2004 Olympic marathon when she failed to finish.

http://www.ethiomedia.com/newpress/kenenisa_alem_techale_story.html

Your article is biased by who has inspired the writer. He is writing in a history journal, not a science or medical journal. Look at his inspiration:

This article is inspired by another of Møller's contributions,5 as well as by the book written by sports historian Paul Dimeo A History of Drug Use in Sport,6 and an article by the sports scientist Bryan Denham.

Now look at what he says at this part:

The main findings of the group of articles reporting on haematological research do not support the claims concerning the alleged lethal effects of EPO use either, although it must be taken into account that none of them refer to experiments in which the ‘safe’ threshold of 50% haematocrit has been passed in humans. Lundby et al. describe an experiment involving ‘eight healthy subjects receiving 5000 IU recombinant human Epo (rHuEpo) for 15 weeks at a dose frequency aimed to increase and maintain haematocrit at approximately 50%’.98 ….Based on this, blood viscosity may be assumed to be relatively unchanged.99

So in the study he uses as a reference, the researchers did not actually measure blood viscosity but ASSUMED it be relatively unchanged!

The other key point he admits in the paragraph above is that : NONE OF THEM REFER TO EXPERIMENTS IN WHICH THE 'SAFE' THRESHOLD OF 50% HEMATOCRIT HAS BEEN PASSED IN HUMANS. They never even come close to 50% hematocrit in any of the renal dialysis studies, so the dialysis studies are largely irrelevant. Obviously a 50% hematocrit is safer than much higher values, but that does not mean that an EPO elevated hematocrit value is as safe as a normal hematocrit value.

There are no studies (they have not been done because it would be too dangerous to do the studies) on what happens when you increase the hematocrit levels to 60% like Pantani, or 65% like Riis and some other riders, or 70% and above…like some of the DEAD cyclists.

So in my opinion, that seems like a very important LIMITATION to this guy's very long Dimeo dimwit lovefest history study. All the studies that he references are IRRELEVANT to the ACTUAL hematocrit levels that have been reached in both LIVE and DEAD cyclists or runners.

In conclusion:

1)I am not impressed at all with this history article.

2)Dimeo and Yanni Pitsiladis are total nutcases.

3) pop pop is right about cyclists waking themselves at night to increase blood circulation to try to make sure they do not drop dead.

4) Is #3 a good way for any normal human to live?

5) My answer is : NO

Just a personal opinion.

And since then, Jos Hermens has managed Abeba Aregawi , who tested positive for meldonium. He also sent his athletes to other doctors than Dr. Hans Wolf-fart.

He also sent some athletes to Dr. Miguel Angel Paraita…who had the bad luck to be involved in Operation Puerto in Spain along with Dr. Fuentes.

Jos Hermens just had bad luck in picking a doctor.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics-claims-over-a-doping-network-are-crazy-says-hermens-425356.html

Yea. Sure.

The great Pantani!!!

... and the great Dr. Fuentes!!!

from Wiki:

During the 2001 Giro d'Italia, a syringe containing traces of insulin was found in Pantani's room. Pantani claimed that the insulin had been planted and that he did not stay in the room that night.[60] In 2002, he was banned for eight months by the Italian Cycling Federation, but he later won an appeal due to an absence of proof.[34][61]

In 2006, two years after his death, Pantani was linked to the Operación Puerto doping case. According to documentation released by Spanish radio network Cadena SER, Pantani was allegedly given the code name "PTNI" by Eufemiano Fuentes, with a detailed program in 2003, his last season, including EPO, growth hormone, Insulin, Levothroid and IGF-1.[62] Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera indicated that he was administered over 40,000 units of EPO, seven doses of growth hormone, thirty doses of anabolic steroids and four doses of hormones used to treat menopause.[63] In 2006 Jesús Manzano, a Spanish professional road racing cyclist whose statements led the Guardia Civil to conduct the Operación Puerto investigation, disclosed in an interview with French television channel France 3 that Pantani was a client of Eufemiano Fuentes.[64]

On the penultimate stage of 1998 Giro d'Italia, Pantani's teammate Riccardo Forconi was expelled from the race for an haematocrit value above 50 percent. Ivano Fanini, the manager of Amore & Vita–Giubileo 2000–Beretta, suggested during the early stages of 1999 Giro d'Italia that Pantani and Forconi had exchanged their blood samples in order to avoid Pantani's disqualification. According to Fanini, Forconi's haematocrit value the previous day was only 47 percent.[65] In 2008 Fanini further claimed that Forconi had received a house for the exchange but Forconi refuted these claims.[66][67]

Matt Rendell's biography of Pantani suggests Pantani used recombinant erythropoietin (rEPO) throughout his professional career. It alleges that seasonal hematocrit levels from several sources showed variations which exceeded those possible naturally, and that Pantani's main victories were probably won also thanks to blood hematocrit levels which could have been up to 60%.[68]

A French senate report into doping released in July 2013 confirmed that Pantani had tested positive for EPO during retroactive testing of samples from the 1998 Tour de France conducted in 2004.[69]

In the early evening of 14 February 2004, Pantani was found dead at a hotel in Rimini, Italy. An autopsy revealed he had a cerebral edema and heart failure, and a coroner's inquest revealed acute cocaine poisoning.

Good times! What fun!

Who are Jos Hermens (the Netherlands) and Dr. Frederico Rosa (Italy) managing today? Here are just some of them:

http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/jos-hermens-141642

http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/federico-rosa-169284

A lot of winners.

Is there a tangible connection between Rosa or Hermans to EPO or cycling?Or is this all tabloid fodder?

rjm33 wrote:

Who are Jos Hermens (the Netherlands) and Dr. Frederico Rosa (Italy) managing today? Here are just some of them:

http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/jos-hermens-141642http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/federico-rosa-169284

A lot of winners.

As I get it, it is a standard procedure that whenever anyone dies outside hospital, there is an autopsy performed. There was also an official inquiry on the mysterious deaths by the Dutch cycling authorities (KNWU) and they most likely had access to the autopsies as they could reach a conclusion on causes of deaths of most of the cases. There were actually a variety of causes established and the head of the Medical Commission of the Dutch Cycling Union, Lon Schattenberg, told later that one of the causes being even a suicide.

After doing some research on the subject, I am personally not even fully convinced that there was statistically extraordinarily high amount of deaths in the first place, a thesis that I'll outline here briefly.

Here is a disturbing quote from The New York Times (5/19/1991) on the magnitude of the problem of death cyclists:

At first look troubling cluster of deaths isn't that convincing, because if you actually go through the dozens and dozens of Dutch newspapers from 1987 until 1990 with search engines (with Dutch equivalents of words such as "cyclist" [WIELRENNER/AMATEURWIELRENNER] "death" [OVERLEDEN/DOOD] etc.), you do not find individual news items of some fifteen cyclists dying suddenly at the time when they died (1987-1990). The more realist list is two in 1987 (Cees Evers, Rainier Valkienburg), one in 1988 (Connie Meijer), one in 1989 (Bert Oosterbosch) and one in 1990 (Johannes Draaijer). Interestingly even when you do know the names of some of the victims, such as Ruud Brouwers and Arjan de Ridder, you don't find their deaths mentioned in the press at all at the time they passed away, even when their deaths were mentioned repetitiously in the media after 1990 in wake of the concern that started after Draaijer had died suddenly the same year.

This is not to claim that there weren't some fifteen cyclists who died, but in absence of news reporting, one can not but reach the conclusion that most of them were either recreational cyclists, unknown amateurs (even aforementioned Arjan de Ridder was only 19 year old kid when he died) or retirees, with all the groups practically no access nor interest to r-EPO, a hormone that wasn't even an official product with a brand name until 1989.

Aragon wrote:

if you actually go through the dozens and dozens of Dutch newspapers from 1987 until 1990 with search engines

1. Pre-Internet stories not ending up in a search engine means it didn't happen? This is a serious question.

2. This is cycling, not football.

rekrunner wrote:

Is there a tangible connection between Rosa or Hermans to EPO or cycling?

Or is this all tabloid fodder?

rjm33 wrote:

Who are Jos Hermens (the Netherlands) and Dr. Frederico Rosa (Italy) managing today? Here are just some of them:

http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/jos-hermens-141642http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/athlete-representatives/directory/federico-rosa-169284

A lot of winners.

Dr. Gabriele Rosa came from the sport of cycling and his son Dr. Frederico Rosa has managed the athletes:

1) Pamela Chepchumba- EPO positive in 2003.

2) Rita Jeptoo- EPO positive in 2014.

3) Matthew Kisorio-nandrolone positive but did interviews talking about the use of drugs that "increase oxygen in the blood" by Kenyan runners that made him feel "so smooth" while running. That sounds like EPO to me.

4) Agatha Jeruto-anabolic steroid nandrolone positive-does not count (not EPO).

Jos Hermens (Hey rekrunner. His last name is not spelled Hermans... Wrong again) sent some athletes to Dr. Miguel Angel Paraita for medical treatment... and it turns out that Dr. Paraita was involved in Operation Puerto... which involved cyclists, EPO, blood transfusions, and anabolic steroids.

Of course all of this will NEVER be enough of a tangible connection for you…as it is just tabloid fodder.

Jos Hermens just had bad luck in picking a doctor that he thought had 'revolutionary' methods and Rosa just had a few bad apples to throw out of his beautiful and totally clean orchard at his 5 Kenyan training camps.

That is fine if that is your view.

Some other people have a different view.

Correction: Agatha Jeruto tested positive for the anabolic steroid norandrosterone (not the anabolic steroid nandrolone).

Gosh. That was close. Someone might have noticed that obvious mistake.

I can't help people forming their own views, but just point out when they are baseless.So (for me) your links to EPO and cycling are, at best, indirect.Gabriela Rosa, is one link away from Frederico, and Frederico has not yet been linked as the supplier of EPO, nandrolone, or norandrosterone to his managed athletes.As you know for me the problem lies in the missing links.- At the time Kisorio was interrogated and spoke to both Seppelt and the authorities, cooperating fully in the hopes of getting a reduced sentence. What was the outcome for Frederico Rosa? Actually we don't know who supplied Kisorio yet. Seppelt has since issued another Kenyan documentary, with no real "inside" information.- Similarly, we don't know who supplied Jeptoo with EPO, but our letsrun Kenyan informant suggested that it wasn't her management, but came through her husband.- Most of the Kenyans lately were busted for nandrolone -- this is a sign of a lack of sophisticated doping (as is being busted for EPO ever since the cycling peloton discovered micro-dosing) -- something I would not expect from experienced Italian coordinators of doping.So how about the link with Dr. Paraita and Operation Puerto? From your Independent article, "Peraita, according to Spanish media reports, shares or shared an office in Madrid with Jose Merino Batres, one of the sports doctors under investigation in the Spanish cycling doping scandal."Let's take a moment to digest that. Wow -- he shares or shared an office with another doctor, and THAT doctor was under investigation! That's particularly damning. Thanks for the informative link. Be sure to let us know the outcome of the German criminal investigation launched in 2006, and the consequences for Dr. Paraita and for Jos Hermens.

pop_pop!_v2.2.1 wrote:

Aragon wrote:

if you actually go through the dozens and dozens of Dutch newspapers from 1987 until 1990 with search engines

1. Pre-Internet stories not ending up in a search engine means it didn't happen? This is a serious question.

2. This is cycling, not football.

The archives I've consulted are scanned page-to-page versions of the most read Dutch newspapers (De Telegraaf etc.) and several smaller ones. The context has been scanned also with OCR, so the papers are fully searchable with some OCR-related typos here and there.

My point is that most likely "it" did happen, but not as it is reported, as it is very apparent that most of the victims don't fit at all into a profile of a rEPO-user. Interestingly when L'Equipe made their list of mysterious deaths of Dutch cyclists in 1991, they came up with total of 12 names for years 1987-1990. Apart from the names I've mentioned, one is a 33-year old amateur cyclist who died in a traffic accident and the rest are 40+ retirees.