this just in...
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34781922
it sounds like they are going after the dopers, not the doping system. I was hoping for the latter.
this just in...
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34781922
it sounds like they are going after the dopers, not the doping system. I was hoping for the latter.
Blaming the athletes is a fantastic strategy.
It's the best way to ensure nothing changes at the IOC or sports federations.
pop_pop!_v2.1.1 wrote:
Blaming the athletes is a fantastic strategy.
It's the best way to ensure nothing changes at the IOC or sports federations.
you must wake up and start counting people who are screwing you over.
How many so far today?
IOC remembers the 1980s too well. They do not want to return to the time when each Olympic games had an asterisk due to the cold war. Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc. Thus, IOC will want to avoid any politicization of the doping issue and just hit the athletes. Also, the IOC may have been complicit in some of the offenses and will not want a long protracted inquiry. Swift justice for a few and then back to the status quo has been the M.O. for dealing with doping for IOC.
Precious Roy wrote:
IOC remembers the 1980s too well. They do not want to return to the time when each Olympic games had an asterisk due to the cold war. Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc. Thus, IOC will want to avoid any politicization of the doping issue and just hit the athletes. Also, the IOC may have been complicit in some of the offenses and will not want a long protracted inquiry. Swift justice for a few and then back to the status quo has been the M.O. for dealing with doping for IOC.
I hear you and generally agree. But I'm not so sure that the standard operating procedure fits here. If the IAAF blinks, then how do they explain to other nations that yes Russia is non compliant but they can compete anyway. That opens a door for other nations not to take the compliance rules seriously.
I think the IAAF and IOC will tell Russia that they are banned as of January 1. To be reinstated they will have to follow a protocol to get back in compliance with the antidoping rules. They need a lab, they need out of competition tests, etc.
I assume the russkies can get that done in a couple months, plenty of time for Rio. They will be reinstated and the show will go on.
Precious Roy wrote:
IOC remembers the 1980s too well. They do not want to return to the time when each Olympic games had an asterisk due to the cold war. Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc. Thus, IOC will want to avoid any politicization of the doping issue and just hit the athletes. Also, the IOC may have been complicit in some of the offenses and will not want a long protracted inquiry. Swift justice for a few and then back to the status quo has been the M.O. for dealing with doping for IOC.
You might consider the news of today.
WADA report leaves question mark over Bach's cosy relationship with Vladimir Putin
http://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1031555/nick-butler-wada-report-leaves-question-mark-over-bachs-cosy-relationship-with-vladimir-putinAND...Lord Coe has some explaining to do:
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/nov/10/sebastian-coe-dcms-select-committee-doping-scandal-nikeWhen we had the Watergate Investigation in the 1970's, did they only go after the people who committed the break in?
The athletes are not blameless obviously, but the rot is at the top, and it certainly appears that it includes Coe and quite possibly Bach, and certainly Putin. The athletes are just trying to survive in their sport, and they're going to do what they need to do to survive. It's the totally corrupt political actors at the top that allow this total abomination to occur and continue. The IOC and IAAF thus far have done NOTHING to clean up the sport. All they care about is that their pot of gold keeps coming from the sponsors. They don't care about the athletes at all.
Remember that quote at Duke.edu that everyone on here used to hate where Salazar said you can't be in the top 5 in the world without doping? Well, he was an optimist.
agip wrote:
Precious Roy wrote:IOC remembers the 1980s too well. They do not want to return to the time when each Olympic games had an asterisk due to the cold war. Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc. Thus, IOC will want to avoid any politicization of the doping issue and just hit the athletes. Also, the IOC may have been complicit in some of the offenses and will not want a long protracted inquiry. Swift justice for a few and then back to the status quo has been the M.O. for dealing with doping for IOC.
I hear you and generally agree. But I'm not so sure that the standard operating procedure fits here. If the IAAF blinks, then how do they explain to other nations that yes Russia is non compliant but they can compete anyway. That opens a door for other nations not to take the compliance rules seriously.
I think the IAAF and IOC will tell Russia that they are banned as of January 1. To be reinstated they will have to follow a protocol to get back in compliance with the antidoping rules. They need a lab, they need out of competition tests, etc.
I assume the russkies can get that done in a couple months, plenty of time for Rio. They will be reinstated and the show will go on.
That would probably be a win for the 'good guys'. No? Even if the Russians find their way into cheating again, it is likely that we will see a clean-ish Rio Olympics.
somebloke wrote:
this just in...
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34781922it sounds like they are going after the dopers, not the doping system. I was hoping for the latter.
What authority does the IOC have over the "doping system"?
coach d wrote:
Precious Roy wrote:IOC remembers the 1980s too well. They do not want to return to the time when each Olympic games had an asterisk due to the cold war. Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc. Thus, IOC will want to avoid any politicization of the doping issue and just hit the athletes. Also, the IOC may have been complicit in some of the offenses and will not want a long protracted inquiry. Swift justice for a few and then back to the status quo has been the M.O. for dealing with doping for IOC.
You might consider the news of today.
WADA report leaves question mark over Bach's cosy relationship with Vladimir Putin
http://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1031555/nick-butler-wada-report-leaves-question-mark-over-bachs-cosy-relationship-with-vladimir-putinAND...Lord Coe has some explaining to do:
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/nov/10/sebastian-coe-dcms-select-committee-doping-scandal-nikeWhen we had the Watergate Investigation in the 1970's, did they only go after the people who committed the break in?
The athletes are not blameless obviously, but the rot is at the top, and it certainly appears that it includes Coe and quite possibly Bach, and certainly Putin. The athletes are just trying to survive in their sport, and they're going to do what they need to do to survive. It's the totally corrupt political actors at the top that allow this total abomination to occur and continue. The IOC and IAAF thus far have done NOTHING to clean up the sport. All they care about is that their pot of gold keeps coming from the sponsors. They don't care about the athletes at all.
Remember that quote at Duke.edu that everyone on here used to hate where Salazar said you can't be in the top 5 in the world without doping? Well, he was an optimist.
eh
nah
do you really think jenny simpson, Molly huddle and Shannon Rowbury are doping? And Nick Willis?
I could go on.
Don't make more of this than we should.
how would they do that? wrote:
somebloke wrote:this just in...
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34781922it sounds like they are going after the dopers, not the doping system. I was hoping for the latter.
What authority does the IOC have over the "doping system"?
I don't know what they can or can't do. I like athletics, I don't know much about the bureaucracy aspect of it. My view is as simple as it can be: IOC runs the olympics, they should be able to say country X is not invited to compete in sport Y because of Zed.
how would they do that? wrote:
somebloke wrote:this just in...
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34781922it sounds like they are going after the dopers, not the doping system. I was hoping for the latter.
What authority does the IOC have over the "doping system"?
It's operated by the member sports.
https://www.wada-ama.org/en/who-we-are/governance/foundation-boardUntil recently, Sepp Blatter was a foundation board member. So, corruption is not a problem.
agip wrote:
pop_pop!_v2.1.1 wrote:Blaming the athletes is a fantastic strategy.
It's the best way to ensure nothing changes at the IOC or sports federations.
you must wake up and start counting people who are screwing you over.
How many so far today?
I'm not understanding what blaming the athletes to keep the system the same has to do with my world view.
It can't be any clearer at this point, the system permits doping.
Precious Roy wrote:
Pursuing a ban on Russia would inevitably cause a reaction by Russia that might include future boycotts and seeing Russia drop out entirely from the Olympic games to form its own event with anti-West countries like China, Iran, Venezuela, etc.
Honestly, good riddance
agip wrote:
pop_pop!_v2.1.1 wrote:Blaming the athletes is a fantastic strategy.
It's the best way to ensure nothing changes at the IOC or sports federations.
you must wake up and start counting people who are screwing you over.
How many so far today?
Being a realist does suck, but someone's got to do it.
WTF, Coe is still on the Nike Payroll?
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/aug/30/sebastian-coe-defends-links-nike-iaaf-president
I'm so naive. I thought he might do something about this Russian scandal, but he clearly doesn't place a high priority on ethics. Burn the whole thing down and start over.
how would they do that? wrote:
What authority does the IOC have over the "doping system"?
The IOC can refuse to sell a ticket for Rio to Putin. That will show him!
get ugly wrote:
WTF, Coe is still on the Nike Payroll?
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/aug/30/sebastian-coe-defends-links-nike-iaaf-presidentI'm so naive. I thought he might do something about this Russian scandal, but he clearly doesn't place a high priority on ethics. Burn the whole thing down and start over.
Welcome to 2015. You might want to ask what Coe was doing as VP for years at IAAF while Diack was taking bribes. That Coe is clean, clean, clean. He didn't see a single thing over at FIFA either.
The IOC is perfectly okay with the doping and corruption.
Rio is going to be a partaaaaayy!!!
get ugly wrote:
WTF, Coe is still on the Nike Payroll?
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/aug/30/sebastian-coe-defends-links-nike-iaaf-presidentI'm so naive. I thought he might do something about this Russian scandal, but he clearly doesn't place a high priority on ethics. Burn the whole thing down and start over.
Welcome to 2015. You might want to ask what Coe was doing as VP for years at IAAF while Diack was taking bribes. That Coe is clean, clean, clean. He didn't see a single thing over at FIFA either.
The IOC is perfectly okay with the doping and corruption.
Rio is going to be a partaaaaayy!!!
the probem is always at the top.
in humanland this is always the problem.
i would allow the use of anything for peiple over the age of 18. but have everyone report what they take and how so the exercise is useful to mankind.
the clean guys with their pure ethics are a menace to the public benefitting from good sports medicine by driving the science underground.
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
Jakob Ingebrigtsen has a 1989 Ferrari 348 GTB and he's just put in paperwork to upgrade it
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these