Arcadia kid fails to take down Austin Tamagno's Mt. Sac record. And blabs about how soft it is.

Been There Done That B4 wrote:

... but you know the old saying "should have could have would have"....... i wish i could have seen the MTSAC race against Mills!

People who use that saying are dumb. There are many possible reasons why someone would not do something even if they could have or should have done it.

Interesting but we will never know....... just like who would win the Patriots at their best or the 72 Dolphins? we will never know. we should just appreciate their greatness and recognize the things they have done

Has Rocha ever beat Tamagno head-to-head in HS in track or xc?

Looking at the boys (Tamagno) vs. girls (Baxter) course records and men's (Bekele) vs. women's (Dibaba) 5000 WRs, you get nearly equal ratios.

14:23/16:00 = 89.8%

12:37/14:11 = 88.9%

Maybe you can call it .9% "soft"?

14:23*99.1% = 14:15

"People who use that saying are dumb."

Come on really? We were all playing nice and you had to go and say that.....

We are all grown up here we dont have to call each other dumb.

Besides you are making my point......

"There are many possible reasons why someone would not do something even if they could have or should have done it."

My point is he didnt do it and there does not have to be any other reason other than he didnt

The problem is people will say "(enter name here) could have done this or that" the reality is if it didnt happen it does not matter, if there are no facts to back it up i think in court they call it hearsay. If not all records would be based off of what an individual or their fans think they could have achieved

Call me crazy.......

Mt. Sac history

http://archive.dyestat.com/results/xc2003/Oct/24MtSAC/CourseChange.htm

Im not sure what their record is head to head. From what i remember (and dont quote me) but i dont think Rocha has beat him...... but i could be wrong.

But as far as the .9% soft...... haha that is great! not even a full %.... i like that you did the math..... so what we can say is the record is not soft but has 14:15 potential (based on the ratio) and with any record we have to see where our great HS runners of now and the future take it.

But for the sake of argument...... what if Baxters record is soft and we dont know it. no one has called it soft yet..... haha jk watching Sarah run was fun

Great find, way to come up with some facts. But he bottom line is this, it is a dirt course and with weather and wind things are going to change..... we cant even be sure that the hills are as high as they use to be or the grade is the same..... we cant fight nature

As far as the course changes that were made in the name of safety..... there may have been unintentional slight modifications over the years that have gone unnoticed like a turn sharper or wider.

Kind of like if you set up a course in a park and the next time you come back to set up the same course you may not put that cone or flag in the exact same spot (longer or shorter) you have changed the course with out even knowing, but you still use it for record purposes.

I think the MTSAC people have done an excellent job maintaining the integrity of the course given all the challenges the job presents.

I heard when Chad Hall broke the record at the woodbridge old course (woodbridge high) he thought the course was slightly different.

But thats racing

coach^3 wrote:

Has Rocha ever beat Tamagno head-to-head in HS in track or xc?

Looking at the boys (Tamagno) vs. girls (Baxter) course records and men's (Bekele) vs. women's (Dibaba) 5000 WRs, you get nearly equal ratios.

14:23/16:00 = 89.8%

12:37/14:11 = 88.9%

Maybe you can call it .9% "soft"?

14:23*99.1% = 14:15

If you want to compare boys and girls records at Mt Sac you need to take into account differences in depth. Baxter's time is really an outlier whereas there are a lot of boy's times clustered near 14:23.

In the races this weekend there were at least 15 boys sub-15 and only one girl sub 17 (16:55) with the next fastest time at 17:17 (9:53 runner Destiny Collins ran 17:40).

It will take a truly exceptional performance by an exceptional runner for a girl to break 16. But in any give year there are usually several boys capable of breaking 14:23. That does not necessarily mean the boy's record is soft, it just shows how much deeper the boys are at the top.

Yet another good point...... there is much more depth on the boys side which makes what Baxter did so special. but i think it also speaks to the quality of the record on the boys side, there is this deep field of talent and so many record attempts come up short

Did you all watch the interview? It's priceless. He talks about how soft the record is, mentioning that about 20 times in fact. Says how his life is harder than anybody's. States he probably won't go to Foot Locker, despite better competition being there.

Maybe the best was saying how he went relatively easy running 14:24. Yet if you watch the race video his legs are so wobbly after crossing the line he nearly falls over. Then he does collapse to his knees about 10 seconds later.

Don't know the kid, so can't comment on his character. Only advice would be to decline interviews in the future.

The Week That Was – October 20 – 26, 2014

by LetsRun.com

October 30, 2014

Austin Tamagno Does Not Break The Mt. SAC Course Record

So a lot was being made last week about high school junior Austin Tamagno breaking the course record at historic Mt. SAC in XC by running 14:23 – MB: Austin Tamagno Breaks Famed Mt. SAC Course Record – Runs 14:23!. There is no doubt that Tamagno, who ran 4:09 as a frosh and 4:06 as a sophomore, is a big-time talent but he’s not the best guy or fastest guy ever at Mt. SAC.

That title still belongs to Jeff Nelson in our book. Nelson, who had the US two-mile prep record for 29 years at 8:36.3, ran 14:32 on Mt. SAC way back in 1978. Ten people (list here) have now “bettered” Nelson’s time but when Nelson ran the course it was longer and slower (2.95 miles versus 2.91 miles). The course now is at least 10 seconds, some say 15-20, faster than it was back in the day. At the pace Nelson was racing, the extra .04 miles would have taken Nelson 11.8 seconds to run. Subtract 12 from 14:32 and you get 14:20.

So we think it’s best to say Tamagno is the course record holder for the new course at Mt. SAC. The best performance ever run at Mt. SAC still belongs to Nelson.

haha yeah the interview was funny

like i said in an earlier post Rocha "Trumped it"

channeling AJ Acosta

but no one runs 14:24 on this course "relatively easy" and if it was "relatively easy" why didnt he run under 14:23 "relatively easy?"

ill tell you why........ because running 14:24 is tough at MTSAC and he did it ..... good for him...... but dont try to make it seem easy

i didnt see the race but now i want to

i hope things in his personal life gets better, i do feel bad he has to go through that.

but i think you have some sound advice

Nice fake faint by #2

I saw the race live.

He probably could have run a few seconds faster if there was someone with him to the end, but he was definitely tiring and couldn't muster anything extra on his own.

The race could have been run an hour earlier when it was cooler and that probably would have been enough for him to break the record on his own.

Been There Done That B4 wrote:

First the record is not soft....

But thats just my opinion.........

My opinion is different.

And of course everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

But my opinion is just a little bit better than yours.

nice of you to join the conversation

now try and catch up

cant wait to hear your opinion

since its just a little better

you can sort out this whole thing for everyone

cant wait to hear your pearls of wisdom

What do you think Jeff Nelson's 14:31 is worth on today's course? I'd say about 14:10-15.

thats worse than the time i said i would run 14:19

The kid's obviously going through some very difficult times with his family and he is obviously upset about missing the record because he had no competition--obviously with competition the time could have gone, so cut him some slack. He's right (dividing up the best between races holds back the top times). You actually have to give him some credit for racing that well by himself when his family's obviously falling apart.