We seem to be blindly submissive to objective rules.
Sometimes you just gotta let one go.
Just call "no harm, no foul" on this one.
We seem to be blindly submissive to objective rules.
Sometimes you just gotta let one go.
Just call "no harm, no foul" on this one.
Coach B. wrote:
This is what happens when you don't keep score in kid's soccer games and everyone gets a trophy.
False. If you want an individual race then take away the team scoring. If you want team scoring make it a team effort - no holds barred. Open your eyes to see that the old way isn't the only way.
I ran XC a long time ago before they had this rule. When the strong runners would finish a race, we would go sprinting back from the finish line out to pick up the weaker kids on the team and carry them in on our backs to try to improve our team standings. We even incorporated speed drills in our training carrying weighted dummies like they use to train fire fighters. The race organizers had to put old mattresses at the finish lines because so many kids would come running across the finish line carrying teammates that they needed a safe place to drop them. During unusually warm races, extra volunteers were needed at the finish line to drag away all the bodies that were getting dumped over the finish line by the stronger kids.
And, scene.
Stupid rule. The kid who gets help crossing the finish line gets DQ-ed. The kid who helps his teammate gets a pat on the back for being a good person. Forcing kids to watch their best friends struggle without letting them help them is probably something that was practiced in the Hitler youth or amongst the child soldiers of the Lord's Resistance Army (ok, not that bad, but you get the point).
The headline is misleading, as the collapsed runner had NOT finished yet.
The other guy aided him in getting to the finish, which is most definitely a DQ and is the right decision to be made.
Additionally, NEVER pick up someone who has collapsed down on the ground, as they are there for a reason, and picking them up can have serious consequences. Let them stay down on the ground and recover.
I don't understand why some people consider it to be good sportsmanship to help a collapsed runner. If the person can't finish the race, they can't finish the race. That's just how the sport works.
It's not the end of the world. The DNFer has presumably finished hundreds of races before, and they will be able to finish races again. Their life won't be over because they couldn't make it to the line one time out of several hundred attempts.
Also, WTF does this sentence from the article mean?
"The team is headed to state in the district meet, the Courier reported."
Old Miler wrote:
With that said, if someone from another team wants to assist a member of your team that should be allowed as well. As long as there is no physical interference of another team I don't see why it shouldn't be allowed.
It looks like the assisting runner had already completed the race, therefore at this point they were no longer a racer helping a fellow competitor but just another spectator assisting an athlete.
Should other spectators then be allowed to assist athletes across the finish line?
More importantly, if this athlete was in such a condition that he requires assistance to reach the finish, then shouldn't someone have been getting him to the medical tent and not the finish line? Where are people's priorities?
"His heart has stopped and we need to get him to the defibrillator!"
"Wait, help us drag him across the finish line before you go shocking him back to life!"
The ASSISTED runner was assisted (duh!) and did not get to the finish line by his own effort. He should therefore be DQ'd.
The ASSISTING person had completed the race by his own effort and was no longer a competitor. There was no more ground to DQ him than to DQ a parent or coach who comes on to a course to assist a runner. You cannot DQ a non-competitor because they aren't competing in the race. The rule does not say that a FORMER competitor can be retroactively DQ'd for "assistance" after the race is over. By this logic you could DQ someone from a race that was over the previous week.
Bad call, dudes! wrote:
The ASSISTING person had completed the race by his own effort and was no longer a competitor.
It doesn't work.
If the fastest members on a team complete a race, they could go back and pace or create a draft line for the slower members all the way in. They shouldn't all be DQ'd because they finished the race already?
By this logic you could DQ someone from a race that was over the previous week.
Officially the race isn't over until all runners cross the finish and the director declares the race over. This race wasn't finished.
My how the times have changed since John Landy.
Ridiculous.
He had already finished and won the race.
Most people with a beating heart would agree that helping someone get medical aid is a good thing. If the runner had headed straight to the ambulance (and not the finish line) after helping him up, he'd get nothing but praise, and no DQ.
Most people on who are familiar with competitive running would agree that helping someone get to the finish line faster is a bad thing. Helping someone to strengthen your score or weaken someone else's--straight DQ.
The problem is when these two areas overlap--getting a hurt person to medical aid via the finish line--such as happened here. (The hurt kid did go to the ER; one of my friends was an EMT on the ambulance that night). One problem I've heard about the current rules is that they discourage people from providing medical assistance. How do you keep the race fair for everyone, and still not make people hesitate to provide genuinely needed aid?
The HS rules have both the provider and receiver of aid is DQ'd. From what I could find, the NCAA rule seems to be that only the receiver is. Is this correct, and does that solve the problem, or just introduce others?
Coach B. wrote:
This is what happens when you don't keep score in kid's soccer games and everyone gets a trophy.
this ^^^^
Thetigerrunner wrote:
Wow. Your just as dense in the brain as the meet referee and the ihsaa. When does common sense take over. He already finished his race. The runner was not on his own team. How can you penalize someone for good sportsmanship. In any other sport this would be encouraged. I think this rule needs to be rewritten. Many times the meds refuse to get involved because they know that any assistance means a dq.
as in the trained professionals who are educated as to when tits time to step at the cost of the runners disqualification and when its not? The rules are there for a reason, and the meds don't step in until they have to for a reason as well. If the kid was truly in danger and the meds were in a position where they should have stepped in but didn't then thats one thing but if that were the case than an emergence help up from the ground and push to the finish line isn't the appropriate response either.
the guys heart was in the right place, that was great of him to do, and the race coordinators hopefully took the time to acknowledge that before awarding the winners but he broke the rules and the dq is fair imo