Why are so many athletes leaving Oregon?

Kinda dount they are transferring to Arkansas and Oklahoma State to go to "a better university" I don't perceive Oregon has any higher number of transfers than would be expected for a top program.

Coach wrote:

Is it possible they realize there is life after college and running and they want to go to a better university?

Great kid, but had no business being at Oregon. She's just not that fast. She's basically a D2 level talent who does not have the tools to be competitive at the upper level of D1. Not a slam, just an honest appraisal.

Flagpole wrote:

I have noticed this too...one was a former state champ from Ohio - Therese Haiss. Transferred to Arkansas.

Sorry, but nearly all the top programs have some form of roster management in place. Scholarships are based on performance and many coaches will find ways to reduce aid. It cannot be done without notice as per NCAA rules, but it can and is done very frequently. It's the business side of collegiate sport that many find distasteful, but it does happen.

O to the H to the I to the O wrote:

Great kid, but had no business being at Oregon. She's just not that fast. She's basically a D2 level talent who does not have the tools to be competitive at the upper level of D1. Not a slam, just an honest appraisal.

Flagpole wrote:

I have noticed this too...one was a former state champ from Ohio - Therese Haiss. Transferred to Arkansas.

Hmm...gonna have to disagree on that. Any HS female who runs 4:50 in high school and 2:08 is fast enough to be on a stellar D1 team. She did move on to Arkansas after all...not too shabby of a place, and she has dropped her mile time down to 4:36 indoors. That's not D2 female talent. I know a GUY who got a scholarship to run D2 who has a 4:36 1600 PR.

Likely its because the kids want to have a winning college experience, not just one where they run faster.

If you are the spare wheel in the trunk, you don't have the same holiday journey.

Hmm...gonna have to disagree on that. Any HS female who runs 4:50 in high school and 2:08 is fast enough to be on a stellar D1 team. She did move on to Arkansas after all...not too shabby of a place, and she has dropped her mile time down to 4:36 indoors. That's not D2 female talent. I know a GUY who got a scholarship to run D2 who has a 4:36 1600 PR.[/quote]

I agree with all of this except a 4:36 guy getting a scholarship... who the f*ck is giving a 4:36, 1600 guy a scholarship? who ever told you that must have been lying to feel better about themselves or it was financial aid.

Ok... allow me to politely rephrase. Yep, she can be the 4-5th fastest person in each of those events at Arkansas which is a pretty nice accomplishment, but at the national level, her marks are generally of a D2 standard. Of course, that could change and who could fault her for aiming high, but given her build and lack of great 400 speed, I don't see it happening. I'd be happy to be wrong as you'd be hard pressed to find a nicer kid from what I've been told. At schools like Oregon, it's about points at the NCAA meet where scholly $$ is concerned.

[/quote]

Hmm...gonna have to disagree on that. Any HS female who runs 4:50 in high school and 2:08 is fast enough to be on a stellar D1 team. She did move on to Arkansas after all...not too shabby of a place, and she has dropped her mile time down to 4:36 indoors. That's not D2 female talent. I know a GUY who got a scholarship to run D2 who has a 4:36 1600 PR.[/quote]

Eh, the poster seems pretty knowledgable to me. Hiltz won the 1600m state title as a junior, runner-up as a senior. (Those who understand the bloodbath that is Cal prep track will understand just how incredible this is.) Despite this, she didn't even get a full ride to U. of Oregon. Think about that. The program is made up of a bunch of cheap b@stards who lowball athletes just because Pre went there. They can, they will.

Furthermore, who let's an All American transfer? Hiltz notched her first at NCAA Indoors, and now she's at Arkansas? Where good runners go to die?

Hiltz ran 4:42 as a HS junior. Ran 4:48 in a dual meet as a junior.

Well...... wrote:

Coach wrote:

Is it possible they realize there is life after college and running and they want to go to a better university?

You probably haven't noticed that for many of the Oregon runners, life after college is running professionally. With an Oregon pedigree and a pro running resume, many of them end up coaching or working at places like Nike following their running career.

There are no other colleges that come close to Oregon if you want to run professionally and/or work at a place like Nike. If you want to coach, especially at the college level, having an Oregon running career followed by pro running on the resume will get you an interview more often than not.

Who from Oregon has ended up coaching recently?

I don't think it's necessarily a question of going to a powerhouse track program and feeling disposable. Because Arkansas is arguably even more so, particularly on the women's side, particularly in indoor. How many NCAA scorers from Arkansas are having successful pro careers now?

Pre's Stroller wrote:

Eh, the poster seems pretty knowledgable to me. Hiltz won the 1600m state title as a junior, runner-up as a senior. (Those who understand the bloodbath that is Cal prep track will understand just how incredible this is.) Despite this, she didn't even get a full ride to U. of Oregon. Think about that. The program is made up of a bunch of cheap b@stards who lowball athletes just because Pre went there. They can, they will.

Calling them cheap Pre-worshippers is one way to look at it. There are many other views,

* e.g. that the viewpoint expressed is rooted in a sense of entitlement.

* There used to be extensive scholarships available at Oregon until Title IX, so Oregon has never been philosophically opposed to spending on track. During Olympic years, Oregon cuts back on the workload of their athletes that can contend at the Trials.

* Others come for a shot at being a part of something greater than what they can individually accomplish and are willing to sacrifice.

* It's not even really about Pre. It's about 10K people in the stands, regular news reporting, fans who stop you in the street to chat, rubbing shoulders with Wheating, Centro, Greer, Fleet, Ches, Gardner, Francis, Prandini, Roesler.

* A few come because they are narcissists and will pay the price to indulge their egotism.

O to the H to the I to the O wrote:

Ok... allow me to politely rephrase. Yep, she can be the 4-5th fastest person in each of those events at Arkansas which is a pretty nice accomplishment, but at the national level, her marks are generally of a D2 standard. Of course, that could change and who could fault her for aiming high, but given her build and lack of great 400 speed, I don't see it happening. I'd be happy to be wrong as you'd be hard pressed to find a nicer kid from what I've been told. At schools like Oregon, it's about points at the NCAA meet where scholly $$ is concerned.

Surely this is a troll attempt? Or maybe Haiss just pissed you off at one point and this is your way to get back at her?

Last indoor Haiss tied for the 11th fastest time in the NCAA (4:36.11). The fastest D2 time was a 4:44.80. Haiss did not have as successful of an outdoor season but the 4:36 is certainly indicative of bonafide D1 talent at any school.

Not a troll attempt whatsoever. I applaud the efforts, etc., but my point is that for schools like Oregon, it's about points at the NCAA meet and that hasn't happened yet. Could that change? Absolutely, but I wouldn't bank on it. As I wrote, I'd be happy to be wrong and will gladly eat my words should that prove to be the case.

Also, I would not discount the possibility that her transfer to Arkansas was for other factors altogether.

[/quote]

Surely this is a troll attempt? Or maybe Haiss just pissed you off at one point and this is your way to get back at her?

Last indoor Haiss tied for the 11th fastest time in the NCAA (4:36.11). The fastest D2 time was a 4:44.80. Haiss did not have as successful of an outdoor season but the 4:36 is certainly indicative of bonafide D1 talent at any school.[/quote]

Not a duck or a hog wrote:

Surely this is a troll attempt? Or maybe Haiss just pissed you off at one point and this is your way to get back at her?

Last indoor Haiss tied for the 11th fastest time in the NCAA (4:36.11). The fastest D2 time was a 4:44.80. Haiss did not have as successful of an outdoor season but the 4:36 is certainly indicative of bonafide D1 talent at any school.

Hey, you're right! In fact, this entire thread seems like a trolling. Someone trolls Haiss, someone trolls the U of O, someone trolls Nike.

If y'all would like some context for NCAA programs with interpersonal drama and power plays... perhaps take a look at this long-read ESPN Mag article by veteran reporter Jeremy Fowler:

It's about a major NCAA program called the Florida Gators playing a sport called football. In this article, you might be shocked to find that even in other sports, athletes fight, coaches promote all sorts of psychotic behavior, high-profile athletes transfer after getting disillusioned with the madness, multi-millionaire coaches burn out and almost die of heart attacks, and the nation goes crazy for the team because they are flashy and win national championships despite racking up dozens of arrests in the local police blotter. It's just amazing! Before reading this article, I thought these kind of things only happened in track and field, in Oregon, with people like Ashton Eaton and Andrew Wheating.

So now that I've contributed my trolling, I'll retire to other things.

Julliard grad wrote:

A better university? For what major? Do you realize that the best university for one major may not be the best university for another. For music, Julliard is world-renowned but it isn't the best music school for every one of the instruments. Maybe there are better schools if you want to major in french horn but for violin, Julliard is #1.

Oregon has a shoe design major. They do internships at Nike. Following graduation who do you think gets first dibs at Nike when they have a shoe design opening?

Making a generic statement claiming there are better universities shows your ignorance and implies you may not have any university experience of your own.

I don't think that more students are leaving the program, compared with peer institutions, but the university is really struggling, again, compared with peer institutions. A recent article:

Highlights from above article:

-UO produces fewest doctoral degrees per tenured and tenure-track faculty

-No competitor school brings in less federal money

-But at the same time, a $50 million renovation for the rec center, and $95 million for a new student center

Sure, UO has Nike, but that's it. As another poster said, it's not like the relatively small number of athletes who do transfer are going to schools that are so much better, but any place that has had five presidents, including two interim heads, in the past six years, is going to have serious issues that manifest themselves in corners where even Nike money cannot reach.

No engineering, no med school, no pharmacy, no $ (that isn't from Mr. Knight)

I am going to take a wild stab and say athletes are leaving because of scholarship money. Guys get 12 and girls get 18 of them. A 4:01 miler might not be receiving any athletic scholarship at UO, but the my entire girls team would have blown a 4:01 miler and my coach would have given him a full ride. Seems like a reasonable reason to transfer. Any transfers have anything they want to say?

Well...... wrote:

There are no other colleges that come close to Oregon if you want to run professionally and/or work at a place like Nike. If you want to coach, especially at the college level, having an Oregon running career followed by pro running on the resume will get you an interview more often than not.

That's a pretty bold claim. Any evidence? Or is this just your impression?

And then there's the causation/correlation problem.

My hunch is that Centro would still be Centro if he'd gone to Stanford or any of a number of other places. So maybe Oregon produces the best runners because it enrolls the best runners.

PS I'm pretty sure Uncle Phil has a soft spot in his heart for MBA's from the KMC. You know, at 655 Knight Way. It's a little south of Eugene, but it's got his name all over it. Literally.

Chad decided he wasn't happy there and left. I bet any school would love to have an NCAA champion on their roster. Stop being a Duck fan boy....