Re: Very disappointing start to XC (Highschool)

I kind of skimmed through the responses so this may already have been covered.

1 - You are running the workouts too hard. You don't have to run 100% in practice to improve. You don't have to beat your teammates in every workout. No one scores the workouts.

2 - Intervals alone may not be the best workout for longer races especially if you are resting too much between intervals. You can't take a break during your 5k race. You can kill the intervals because you are probably resting too much between each one.

My high school training was devoid of tempo runs - where you hold a challenging (but not near race pace) pace for a distance usually greater than your race distance. I wonder how many tempo runs your coach incorporates into workouts. So if you are running 6 min pace in 5k race, your tempo run might be 6:20-6:25 pace for four to five miles. You can see how that builds confidence if you can hold that pace for a longer distance than 5k.

3 - Don't start out so fast in a race. If you are averaging around 6 min/mile than go out at about that pace. If you feel great with a mile or so to go - pick up the pace.

4 - To help with nerves - time your warmup to finish 5-10 minutes before race starts. If you are still nervous - do some strides right before the race starts. Being nervous generally makes you start out too fast. Physical activity helps calm the nerves. Coffee will probably just amplify the nervousness.

Disappointed wrote:

During practice, I can run 5:30x4, 2:20x3 and then 1:00 for 2, yet during the meets I CAN NOT perform.

You are competing fine based on your level of development.

You have plenty of speed, but are lacking the endurance & stamina to run any faster for 5k. Your times will get faster as you do.

4x 5:30 for the mile is not indicative of anything faster than what you've been running so far. The 400 and 800 times mean nothing for XC. Your times will come down as you get more consistent with mileage, and bring down your averages for the longer repetitions. In the meantime keep racing, and focus on running as evenly as possible through the races.

Keep it going and you will see substantial improvements over time.

PLEASE STOP THESE RACIST THREADS!!!

Thanks for doing a littl # summary list, it means a whole lot to get so much feedback. This will definitely help me so much to realiz me that the community of runners is so strong in helping people :D

In the meantime, intervals might actually be the problem. For sprint work during track, we'd do very fast intervals with long breaks (catholic school, the coach can't specifically push the kids to a breaking point) so I definitely need to incorporate sprints where I sprint (say for 800/mile repeats) I will sprint then jog during the break.

Also, possibly sprinting some workouts like.. 5 mile run, I'll run 3.5 then walk for .3 then run again Is not the best strategy. I just need to realize that I need to push my mentality further, and race with all my hard work behind me without getting so scared/nervous.

Thanks so much to all the responders. You all are truly an inspiration.

don't ever read newspaper results of xc meets in your area/statedon't ever come to lets run or other running blogs.don't record your workouts on garmin/strava and if you do keep a log, leave it in your school locker room so you don't obsess about it every day.just have fun and keep running as best you can. if it's not fun, or you don't like it, stop. if you are afraid you wouldn't be someone if you aren't a runner, you are wrong. you'll be fine, and find great things in your life.the best thing my high school coach ever told me was that i was too smart for my own good; meaning - i over-thought everything and psyched myself out of so many races. work on staying relaxed, breathing, and try to put as much confident in your coach and training that you can. just trust the training and if you are making sure that goes well, you will be fine in a race. the other runners will run their races... just practice and train smart and get enough sleep and have a good diet, but after that, find a way to have something else aside from running to think about.my H.S. coach knew i was so nervous before the state xc meet he took me around town to the bars to show me 'what i should never become" and tried to drag me into a strip club (this was only at like 9:00m pm, but it was such a funny/weird/new distraction that i forgot to think about the runners i would be facing the next day and i ran my best race of high school and was 9th in the state)

First off, you did the right thing by setting aside your pride and asking for help. There are a lot of runners who are too afraid to ask for help like you are doing right now.

The way I approach racing is a bit different than the standard approach. Most people will tell you to try and relax; do deep breathing exercises; try to go to your "happy place." I say embrace the fear and anxiety you are feeling.

The fact is that every runner on this planet gets nervous before a race (to varying degrees). They may look stone cold on the outside, but at some point during the day they've been nervous. It's completely normal, amd it's actually a good thing. Your body is getting ready for a brutal test of physical and mental strength. Do you really want to go into it ice cold? Of course not! Your body is on high alert. The epinephrine is flowing, and your body's systems are getting amped up for battle.

So try this out: instead of focusing on relaxing, acknowledge that you're nervous and that it's okay. When you feel your heart pumping harder and your legs feeling like jello, say to yourself, "it's okay. My body is just getting ready for the race," and move on. Don't dwell on your nerves, because that will just make you more nervous. Recognize that you're nervous, accept it, and keep going through your pre race routine. It's a hard concept to get down, but when you get it right, it works.

Some other things to keep in mind:

- you've raced this distance and xc 2 times. That's nothing at all! It's only early September, and the races that matter aren't until the end of october. By then you'll have more experience under your belt and more confidence moving forward.

- running isn't that big of a deal. You're not trying to save someone's life; you're running 3.1 miles as fast as you can. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. It's just running. You've done it every day for a while now, and it's going to be the same thing on race day as it is on your pre meet run and your cooldown run. The only thing that changes is where you're running and a couple dozen guys lined up next to you.

- I prefer a light breakfast in the morning. Granola, water, and maybe a little gatorade. That's all you need really because you can pig out once it's over.

- overall, don't take it so seriously. No one is forcing you to be there, and your livelihood doesn't depend on your performance. Remember your love for running on race day, and keep it fun. High school xc and track were the most fun running related things I've ever done. Enjoy it, because when it's over you'll never quite feel the same way about xc, even if you do run in college.

Ok lets check on something else here. Your Pr's aren't bad! You mention 40 miles and 5:30 repeats, 2:20 repeats. So as a coach, it seems you are messing with some long intervals. What kind of ground, what is recovery and are you improving on these splits? Tell me about your long runs? How is your Tempo going, distance and pace? If I'm your coach, we both know DARN well what your going to run..give or take a small bit after discussing the particular course. I don't think your trained. Can't determine much from your description of your running but I kind of feel you know your training is not on board, it is all over the place and so your race will be also. You know this before the race. You do your easy long run pace, hard long run pace, Tempo's, say long intervals like 1600, 1200, 1000 X2, week in week out. You document, rest recover and what your going to run starts to become clear. Your PR's tell me the guns are on board, if you had a good coach you would be coming on, no doubt in my mind.

The workouts consisting of 4xmile and half mile splits are on the track. I've realized I've taken a sorinter's approach though, because I can't in no way race the way I sprint my 800's.(...although in my race last week, I went out in 2:17) and I completely dog the workouts. I definitely need to incorporate longer intervals/shorter rest time.

Thanks for your post :)

I definitely need to have fun and relax. I am worried about getting a scholarship, but realize that XC is not the best for me and I just need it to train for the 800\1600, respectively.

I have practice this morning and will not sprint then walk during the long run. I need to fix my walking issues and stop walking.

But that input on what your coach did is quite funny!

Thanks for your post :)

I might need to try that strategy where I just accept that I'm nervous, but not let my body get ahead of me.

During the race, I told myself to not be in first and on the first mile... 5:20, first. Adrenaline really kicks in and it's insane what it can do for you.

I won't take it too seriously though, I need to relax. I'm brand new to XC and need to see that other runners have been running for 3-4 years, I'm like a freshman lol.

Thanks for your post :)!

I would question whether the interval lengths from practice are accurate. Are they run on a track? If not, you probably aren't running 5:30 miles in practice.

If the intervals are accurate, where are they run? There's a huge difference between times on a track, and times on a cross country course.

I would also venture to guess that you are a workout hero. You probably kick at the end of your intervals and try to beat your teammates. This feels natural, especially if you are a fast-twitch runner. However, you cannot get away with this strategy in a longer race. Your practice intervals should be run at your race effort, or slightly faster. Otherwise, you are primarily training your anaerobic systems, and in the process you are neglecting aerobic development.

I say all this because you sound like you are a similar runner to how I was in high school. Some workouts which might help you (they definitely helped me!) are long hill repeats, fast continuous runs (6-8 miles), and long runs (12+ miles).

In your last race,, CC race,, you went out in 2:17 the first 800? Do you realize how gutzy that is! My top senior, right now, ( who was top 15 at footlocker last year) will take the first 800 out, this weekend at 2:24. In this weekend race, if you were with him or ahead of him, at 800 I would say that kid has guts man. Then if you fall apart, I would say his training is not there, BUT if he can flow like that for 800 then if he did have the proper training look out! My guy will be leading this weekend at that 2:24. If you were with him, it indicates you are a darn good runner/athlete. Why do you think the other 150 runners are not gonna be with my guy as he hits that 2:24. Even if you fall off, its just you don't have the distance training for cc on board, that's all. My guy's training say last 9 days, 10 long easy pace 6:30, 2 a day) 5early, and 2Xmile breakdown 600,300,300,200,100,100X2 attempting 4:00 pace with good recovery between reps...he missed it but he was close, 6 mile progression run..very easy and gentle, 4 mile Tempo at 5:12's he did it! at altitude, gentle shake out recovery day, another easy day 5 early easy 4 late easy, 11 mile long hard long run pace at 6:15's. We are running against guys doin over 70 a week, you probably are also. If you are targeting track 800/1600 sounds great, just don't let the CC right now upset you. If you don't have the proper distance training under you, last month and a half, your gonna crumble. Put it this way, if someone told me YOU were gonna run against my runner this weekend and YOU were gonna be shoulder to shoulder with him at 800, BUT they informed me YOU don't have the distance training on board like my runner, I would say well the kid has guts...but it will hit him at 900 meters or maybe around 1000 meters. The rest of the race is really gonna be hard on him. Its just common sense and the truth, I would like to see how you do in the 800 this year! Good luck!

did you possibly become a Coach?

See you at Footlocker!

Disappointed wrote:

I might need to try that strategy where I just accept that I'm nervous, but not let my body get ahead of me.

During the race, I told myself to not be in first and on the first mile... 5:20, first. Adrenaline really kicks in and it's insane what it can do for you.

I won't take it too seriously though, I need to relax. I'm brand new to XC and need to see that other runners have been running for 3-4 years, I'm like a freshman lol.

Thanks for your post :)!

You are pretty close here. Maybe for race day acknowledge the nerves, but go through the things you've done to prepare up to race day and tell yourself you are ready. For me, this is the purpose of logging training. You can go through it

I would encourage you to be a little more open-minded about what kind of runner you are. Give XC your best, paced, efforts. IMO, you will learn quite a bit.

Disappointed wrote:

but realize that XC is not the best for me and I just need it to train for the 8001600, respectively.

That is total nonsense.

You need to do the proper training to approach your XC potential.

Wow you seem like a very experienced coach!!

I definitely have sprint speed, but I need to work on my overall endurance. I've seen all the footlocker YouTube cc videos and it's amazing how the athletes are able to run 2:25's- consistently, etc.

thanks again!!

I guess I am a little gutsy though, I always strive to be first, but need to realize that the 5k is completely different than the 800.

Thanks for your reply, means a wholenlotcoming from a coach!!

Amen brother. Amen

not I said the flea wrote:

Disappointed wrote:

****Keep in mind., these 2 5k's are my only 5k's I've ever ran in my life.,

Maybe you need to keep that in mind.

This is probably largely mental, and guess what, the mind is just another part of the body that needs training. So get out there and run more races. Your eventual success will be all the sweeter after being able to truly put crap performances behind you.

And while you're training your mind by getting those racing miles in, remember, the goal is to focus on success, not on not failing.

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