2nd Former Nike Oregon Project Massage Therapist Comes Forward And Admits He Had Grave Concerns - Went To USADA In 2012

Looking worse all the time. Kupczak is sort of suggesting that AlSal was giving androgel or some other illegal ped to Rupp during the massages. But why not just come out and say it? For some reason he does not say "i think he applied androgel during massages." It is frustrating to say the least. If these people know something, stop being a baby and come out and say it! If not, then what are you talking about? It seems like it goes like this with every drug scandal. It's like these people think they can both come forward with their evidence / suspicions and also keep everything going as before when it comes to employment and relationships.

I'm amazed that Salazar and Rupp are actually using the "stay quiet and maybe it will go away" tactic. That will not work. If they are guilty, it is just getting worse. If not, they are being unfairly destroyed in the press every day and doing nothing to stop it. The androgel is an example of this. At first, we were talking about thyroid hormone with a TUE and IV fluids. These are legal within the guidelines though perhaps the system can be gamed. It is unclear whether those even make you a better competitor though they might. Now we are speculating about Androgel massages based upon AlSal's secret test-defeating protocol cooked up via experimentation on his own son! That is what happens when you let a story just spin out of control and refuse to talk about it.

So if Salazar was rubbing Andro on Rupp, and Andro is bad for people with heart issues, did the guy who cleaned up the training camp apartment find latex gloves around? I'd hope Salazar would be smart enough to protect himself.

I didn't read all the linked articles, hope that wasn't covered.

How would you feel if these high school coaches did the "leg rubs" in private?

I've been known to do that from time to time.

So far this story really hasn't gone anywhere in the mainstream sports press in the US. If Salazar gives a detailed answer, there's some chance the ensuing coverage will cross over into the main stream sports press, so for now, I don't think he sees any reason to say anything.

The whole dynamic changes if Mo leaves Salazar, but I don't see that happening before World Championships [if it happens at all].

dkny64 wrote:

So far this story really hasn't gone anywhere in the mainstream sports press in the US. If Salazar gives a detailed answer, there's some chance the ensuing coverage will cross over into the main stream sports press, so for now, I don't think he sees any reason to say anything.

The whole dynamic changes if Mo leaves Salazar, but I don't see that happening before World Championships [if it happens at all].

no one cares about running here. Salazar can make all the statements he wants but no one will care. The mainstream media won't bother to pick up this story because it's a non story. If the UK press keeps the heat up (as I imagine they will) eventually something will crack and there will finally be some sort of coverage here in the states. Mo won't leave Salazar but the press will keep the heat up until something breaks and it eventually will. Salazar is just putting off the inevitable. He will never admit to anything but he will more than likely be brought down for this. I have very little confidence that Rupp will medal at the WCs now and before I thought he was a lock for a 10000m medal.

madmandoc wrote:

Looking worse all the time. Kupczak is sort of suggesting that AlSal was giving androgel or some other illegal ped to Rupp during the massages. But why not just come out and say it? For some reason he does not say "i think he applied androgel during massages." It is frustrating to say the least. If these people know something, stop being a baby and come out and say it!

UK libel laws. They literally couldn't print that.

It's kinda weird hearing about some of these accusations against Salazar & Rupp. In 2006 I was at the NCAA Midwest region championships in Austin, TX. One of the Texas distance guys was a transfer from Oregon. He said that Salazar would rub a gel substance on Rupp's legs and no one knew what it was......there was a group of about 5 of us that were sh*t talking on Rupp so this wasn't out of context. This was in May 2006. I've told this story to quite a few running buddies over the years. When Tyson Gay got busted and I read that a substance had been rubbed on his legs which caused him to test positive I instantly thought back to the story I heard in 2006. Looks like it was true all along.

dkny64 wrote:

So far this story really hasn't gone anywhere in the mainstream sports press in the US. If Salazar gives a detailed answer, there's some chance the ensuing coverage will cross over into the main stream sports press, so for now, I don't think he sees any reason to say anything.

This is a gloriously mindless thing to say.

Forget the mainstream U.S. sports press and everyday sports fans. NOTHING will EVER make the average retard care about distance running in this country.

Salazar CERTAINLY knows that the only American who WILL ever care are ALREADY avidly following the story. Do you REALLY believe otherwise?

In conclusion, quit producing flagrantly idiotic excuses for Salazar's silence. It makes you look less than brilliant.

Bbbbbbrent wrote:

madmandoc wrote:

Looking worse all the time. Kupczak is sort of suggesting that AlSal was giving androgel or some other illegal ped to Rupp during the massages. But why not just come out and say it? For some reason he does not say "i think he applied androgel during massages." It is frustrating to say the least. If these people know something, stop being a baby and come out and say it!

UK libel laws. They literally couldn't print that.

BS - see

GalenRuppCan'tPlayVolleyball wrote:

It's kinda weird hearing about some of these accusations against Salazar & Rupp. In 2006 I was at the NCAA Midwest region championships in Austin, TX. One of the Texas distance guys was a transfer from Oregon. He said that Salazar would rub a gel substance on Rupp's legs and no one knew what it was......there was a group of about 5 of us that were sh*t talking on Rupp so this wasn't out of context. This was in May 2006. I've told this story to quite a few running buddies over the years. When Tyson Gay got busted and I read that a substance had been rubbed on his legs which caused him to test positive I instantly thought back to the story I heard in 2006. Looks like it was true all along.

Yeah because there is only one type of massage gel in the world. Some of you guys are idiots and will believe whatever you have decided to be true.

What's sad about this whole affair is that it's showing young athletes how easy it is to cheat. A non-tested or rarely tested high school / University athlete can learn just by reading the articles how can they can boost performance through easily available and legal pharmaceutical grade drugs such as the Big 4 (Salbuterol, Advair, Cytomel and Testosterone). Unlike doping in sport such as football where young athletes have to take a bigger leap into sketchy and illegal means such as buying black market and illegal steroids, young runners can easily get their hands on the Big 4 safely and legally. Testosterone would be harder to get but any adult male parent/coach/friend could do it for them, and even have a medical plan to cover the costs as well. Sad. Feel sorry for athletes and coaches today.

Surprised that this is the first people are hearing about Al Sal giving the massage guys the night off. It's a fairly regular thing for him to massage these guys, and I've (based on the stories told) always suspected something like this as a reason.

It's so common that the athletes even have a cutsey name for it. They call it getting a Cuban.

Wrong again wrote:BS - see

http://www.journalism-now.co.uk/sue-sue-defamation-libel-media-law-ethics-ian-anderson-week-3/

Congratulations on posting a link. Is there a section in particular that you think proves your point?

I'll make it easy for you. Allan Kupczak never saw Alberto apply the gel to Galen. He can speculate all he wants, but in the UK a publisher couldn't publish that speculation.

madmandoc wrote:

I'm amazed that Salazar and Rupp are actually using the "stay quiet and maybe it will go away" tactic. That will not work.

Staying quite proves that they have a PR crisis management firm working with them. Staying quite works in politics where another crises eventually makes problems go away. But, that won't work in this case. The T&F community is small, and committed to the sport, and vocal about cheating. The testing organization is the USADA which is run by committed doper-hater Travis Tygart. Go luck PR Firms, your usual tactics will fail.

inside info wrote:

More people have come forward over the past week and you should expect another article to be released soon by David Epstein. Salazar should probably consider not releasing a statement because it will most likely contradict anything that he is about to release. Getting caught in a lie is the worst part about cheating and getting caught. Best thing he can do is admit to it and retire immediately. The more he fights the bigger club they are going to use to take him down. It's only a matter of time until the big hit comes and it won't be long.

Give us just a small taste of what's to come.

I'm headed to the kitchen to refill my popcorn bowl. This has been one hell of a show the past few weeks, and I'm certain we haven't seen the climax.

[quote]schwastey wrote:

Still, I feel like the "night before the meet" detail makes it likely this is not used for androgel application.

quote]

and you expertise comes from ?? Do you have any understanding of the acceptable t ratios?

schwastey wrote:

If it was androgel, why would Salazar only put it on Rupp the night before a race? This maximizes the chance of a positive doping test.

No. Not at 4:1 T:E threshold it doesn't. This is why Test use is rampant in endurance sport at least. You have a huge advantage over 99.9999% of your clean-ish competitors even at 2:1 T:E ratio.

My limited understanding is the sleep cycle and Test is a big recovery booster. Also any kind of spike from the exogenous Test would be gone by morning when the test window opens again.

Alberto and the rest of the determined dopers in elite IOC sport know all of this. So do the sports federations, so, it's all good.

row row rowbury your boat wrote:

runDirtyrun wrote:

Al Sal's child was used to dose exogenous Test to "never test positive."

Honestly, can someone sum ^this up for me? I watched the documentary while I was working from home and I completely missed this segment. Remember it being there, but not what was said and/or known.

runDirtyrun speaks this as if it is a proven fact. Is that the case or was it another insinuation to add to the fire. It may or may not be, and insinuations burn just as well as facts, I am just asking to clarify.

Alex [Salazar] was occasionally used as a guinea pig to test supplements and then get evaluated in the lab. In one instance, Magness says Alex told him that he was testing testosterone gel: rubbing some on, getting tested in the lab, rubbing some more on, getting tested in the lab. Magness said, “it was them trying to figure out how to cheat the tests...So it’s how much can we take without triggering a positive.”

You're welcome.