DREW HUNTER TAKES DOWN GRANT FISHER IN BROOKS PR 2 MILE

Yeah, you're right, because if some kid runs 4:05 in the mile it's equally impressive whether he's a freshman or a senior. "BFD", right? And all the message board threads and articles that would follow certainly wouldn't note that the kid just ran the fastest mile ever for a freshman. It also wouldn't help the kid realize just how special he is by being able to compare himself to all-time greats at any given age.I'm just way, way out there I guess... (shaking my head at the stupidity sometimes displayed on Letsrun).

Shawn H wrote:

You have a point, but it's way, way out there. I guess I never cared about H.S. class records since all classes compete against one another in high school. I guess if you really get out in the weeds and worry about what the freshman, sophomore, etc. records are, well, you're really out in the weeds. But then some people on this forum get all concerned over whether so-and-so ran his PR when he was 17 and 9 months while so-and-so ran his PR when he was 18. As long as there is an age rule and someone was age-eligible, BFD, in my opinion.

George Atlas wrote:

No high schooler has ever closed a two mile in that time as Hunter.

I've been beating the Drew Hunter drum since last fall, but I don't know if this is a fact.

Neither Hunter's or Fisher's runs would have qualified them for the indoor 3000m at NCAAs. Once they step up to the college ranks, you'd better be able to close a 7:56 3K (8:32 2-mile pace) in sub-60.

I think in order to cement the legacy of this race, a lot depends on where these guy's careers go.

The Ritz-Webb-Hall clash at Footlocker was considered one of the best matchups ever, and now that each of them have held American Records or "best ever times", it is in the conversation of best HS race ever.

I'll stand by my assertion that I don't think Fisher will produce much on the NCAA level. I think he lacks the smoothness of some of the other preps in recent years such as McGorty, Saarel.

Lenny Leonard wrote:

Neither Hunter's or Fisher's runs would have qualified them for the indoor 3000m at NCAAs. Once they step up to the college ranks, you'd better be able to close a 7:56 3K (8:32 2-mile pace) in sub-60.

no high schooler ever has closed a sub 8:32 2 mile in sub 60. In fact only one high schooler ever has broken 8:32. So what does your "neither Hunter's or Fisher's runs would have qualified them for the indoor 3000m at NCAAs" have to do with anything? Its not like its any surprise that the hardest working, most talented, most driven, luckiest regarding injury, and best coached 22 year olds in the country (plus some international students from countries such as kenya) are faster than our best high schoolers.

Sorry, should have included full quote:

George Atlas wrote:

And I would bet currently there aren't more than a dozen D1 college runners that can do that.

What a great Foot Locker. It's a testament to Ritz's insane HS XC abilities that he broke a runner as talented as Webb that completely in the race. Ritz ran 14:35 in (according to the announcera) blistering heat and humidity. Look at him after he finished. He killed himself! He said he was running 90-95 MPW during the base phase. Does anyone else think that may have affected Jim negatively in the long-term in terms of injuries?

I miss that Ritz! I love you, Grant Fisher, but Ritz would've beaten ANY HSer ever in XC when he was in that shape.

The shorter distances are a different story, obviously. It's a testament to the ability of Lindgren that Ritz couldn't break his 5,000M record. 13:44 back 50 years ago in HS?! That's nuts! I was always sad Ritz didn't get that record.

Hahahahahahaha. So much stupidity, so little time...

Lenny Leonard wrote:

I'll stand by my assertion that I don't think Fisher will produce much on the NCAA level. I think he lacks the smoothness of some of the other preps in recent years such as McGorty, Saarel.

GoldenMiles wrote:

What a great Foot Locker. It's a testament to Ritz's insane HS XC abilities that he broke a runner as talented as Webb that completely in the race. Ritz ran 14:35 in (according to the announcera) blistering heat and humidity. Look at him after he finished. He killed himself! He said he was running 90-95 MPW during the base phase. Does anyone else think that may have affected Jim negatively in the long-term in terms of injuries?

I miss that Ritz! I love you, Grant Fisher, but Ritz would've beaten ANY HSer ever in XC when he was in that shape.

The shorter distances are a different story, obviously. It's a testament to the ability of Lindgren that Ritz couldn't break his 5,000M record. 13:44 back 50 years ago in HS?! That's nuts! I was always sad Ritz didn't get that record.

Yes, and if I remember correctly Ritz himself has said that looking back he think he would have been better off in the end by doing less mileage in high school. I don't remember where he said that, though, so can't supply the quote.

yellen atcha wrote:

Hahahahahahaha. So much stupidity, so little time...

Oh yeah? We'll see, buddy boy.

Yeah, doing 90+ MPW in HS is pretty damn rare outside of Gerry Lindgren (and how long did his career last? Kinda serious question, as I don't know, but I doubt long on 200+ MPW). Knowing Ritz, I wouldn't be surprised if that was more his idea than his coach's back then.

Oh, how I wish how he would've been healthier throughout his career. I wish Ritz would've been the great American men's long distance talent of the last generation, and not Rupp. Anyone else?

gilt wrote:

8:44.6 in his battle with Ralph Serna.

8:44.9 in that race with Serna his Jr year.

Hulst ran 8:44.6 the following year, basically alone in a Sectional qualifying meet.

GoldenMiles wrote:

Oh? wrote:

I'd say the 10k is about 4-5% slower than the 5k. For Chapa's time, that means somewhere between 13:33-13:42 for 5k. I think Chapa would be much more revered if more elite HSers had run the 10k, or if he had some All-Time marks in other more relatable events such as the 5k. As it is, most people probably just see him as a 8:51-low two miler that holds a strange record not many have attempted before.

That's crazy if true that his 28:32 is equivalent to that in the 5,000. Then I don't think Ritz could've ran that. Maybe Lindgren if he had been racing against someone else. And obviously Lindgren is a top 2 HSer of all time. Crazy time by Chapa.

Didn't 13:37 Rupp try for the 10K HSR and not make it under 29? Or am I misremembering?

I think Chapa's 28:32 10,000m is equivalent to about a 13:35 5000m. And this was 44 years ago.

Some perspective: Chapa went on to set the American 3000m record of 7:37 in college, but he never beat his HS 10k Record.

Let's not forget that the above referenced 10k for Lindgren was in the middle of the day in July in a packed LA Coliseum on a dirt track and 92F degrees.

Another solid call right here. :-)

It’s funny that people used to try to shoehorn Fisher as a miler and now he’s run a 26:33 10k

Care to revisit that?

Imagine saying that. LOL

one of the British commentators called Fisher 'bulky' during his 3000m AR. fml