If you want the story to play out differently, more evidence needs to come out.
So far, we can only talk about ethics, or talk about the legality of playing doctor, but there is not much that show that a WADA defined doping violation has ever been committed by Salazar or Rupp. It's possible that he only broke some laws, but not any WADA rule.
It's not about Nike or Salazar controlling the message -- there is simply too little evidence to talk about doping/cheating with banned substances or methods. The only possible thing that can happen now is that WADA look for ways to minimize TUE abuse, and look at some permitted substances more closely, so that the only permitted usage is the intended medical doses.
This is Alberto's defense
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ryan foreman wrote:
my bet would be that the the USADA and/or WADA knew everything Salazar was doing and gave him the ok.
It's a good thing for you that when you say thing like "My bet would be..." you're not talking about actually betting money. If you were, given your indisputable genius for being precisely, loudly and abysmally wrong about absolutely everything of relevance, you would have been living in a cardboard box on the street a long time ago -- and maybe you are already. -
jjjjj wrote:
Lagat has a lot more hardware and American records (1500m/3000m/5000m) than Centro or Rupp.
Lag at is a Kenyan, not an American. -
rekrunner wrote:
more evidence needs to come out ... there is not much that show that a WADA defined doping violation has ever been committed by Salazar or Rupp ... there is simply too little evidence to talk about doping/cheating with banned substances or methods.
I suppose saying the same thing three times in one short post is one way of going about convincing yourself of your own bullshit.
You plainly have no idea what evidence USADA and WADA possess, what lines of inquiry they are most avidly pursuing, and even what kinds of infractions would allow them to act. You're just one of those hapless souls who stays on the same failed message -- you think that only something like video footage of EPO or steroid use constitutes "real evidence," and (this is the funniest part) that the BBC and Mr. Epstein are basically the only ones who might have more and heavier evidence of any sort.
Are you forgetting that those who have spoken to the press may ALSO have spoken to USADA and WADA, and that those conversations have not yet come to light? -
Goucher Needles wrote:
I think you've locked down the basics of the Nike spin. I think it's most likely that nobody is penalized beyond the public relations consequences.
The only chance for a real bust is to catch an NOP athlete or two with some of the blatantly illegal stuff and get her or him to turn on the group with a promise of immunity.
I'd go after Ritzenhein if I were the investigators. He's already distanced himself from the group, but he likely has knowledge of (and participated in) the real PED use.
Or, maybe they're all innocent.
This will all blow over... Unless someone lies to a grand jury. Then it will get bad, very bad (i.e. Bonds, Jones, etc.) -
Man Overboard wrote:
But maybe he's doing his job as a fair journalist and letting the chips fall where they may instead of being an advocate for one side.
You mean journalists are just supposed to report facts and leave the innuendo aside?! But what's a story without spin?
A clear statement of facts in this case leave only the Androgel cream and the "testosterone document" as worthy of notice.
Weeks of "journalism" compressed to one sentence. -
"A clear statement of facts in this case leave only the Androgel cream and the "testosterone document" as worthy of notice."
LOL ... you can't read, or chose to read, only what you want to. There is a lot more to read, see, if you'll just take your head out of the sand. -
allahbacca wrote:
"A clear statement of facts in this case leave only the Androgel cream and the "testosterone document" as worthy of notice."
LOL ... you can't read, or chose to read, only what you want to. There is a lot more to read, see, if you'll just take your head out of the sand.
Oh there are plenty of words to read, sure. Empty words. Words designed to tell you how to feel, like Kara's "This is going to break his mother's heart." (I especially loved that one.) Strip those away and there is little to accuse anybody of. Not to say the allegations I cited aren't serious.
But you have NOP runners coming out of the woodwork saying "Salazar never asked me to dope." It really weakens the case.
When allegations came out against Lance, you had athletes saying they either saw him dope or were asked by him to dope.
This is much different. -
At first I thought that since none of Alberto's athletes failed a drug test, or have admitted to any heavy use, that there was no real evidence to throw down on the table against them, but after learning about micro-doping and a lot of the other topics the BBC documentary talks about. It is illegal to use testosterone, or any type of andro-gel for athletic enhancement period. It is banned from the sport, it may be so the Galen has "asthma", but to be on it since testosterone and predisone since 2002... It's just sketchy all of it, the way it is being handled... The way NOP is responding, Alberto is just going down swinging unfortunately... It is upsetting, for some it is heartbreaking, we all do not want to believe the people we support and look up to are cheating, but unfortunately there is just far too much at this point to try and pull the wool over our eyes... Just far too much.
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"jewbacca wrote:"
"When allegations came out against Lance, you had athletes saying they either saw him dope or were asked by him to dope."
- Salazar shares a room with Rupp when they travel. Salazar travels with vials, meds, and needles. Figure it from there.
"Oh there are plenty of words to read, sure. Empty words."
- The empty words are all coming from Salazar's silence.
"Words designed to tell you how to feel, like Kara's "This is going to break his mother's heart."
- Rupp plays with toys.
- Farah's wife is pregnant.
- Centro doesn't drink. -
None seers wrote:
"jewbacca wrote:"
"When allegations came out against Lance, you had athletes saying they either saw him dope or were asked by him to dope."
- Salazar shares a room with Rupp when they travel. Salazar travels with vials, meds, and needles. Figure it from there.
"Oh there are plenty of words to read, sure. Empty words."
- The empty words are all coming from Salazar's silence.
"Words designed to tell you how to feel, like Kara's "This is going to break his mother's heart."
- Rupp plays with toys.
- Farah's wife is pregnant.
- Centro doesn't drink.
You've said absolutely nothing. -
Nothing will happen at all. From the statute limitations to everything else being backed up by TUEs. Tons of athletes have TUEs. I have personally seen Cam Levins, Allyson Felix, Kara Goucher, Brenda Martinez, and Deena Kastor all use inhalers. Its pretty much normal now. Its what they have to do to even come close to the Kenyans and Russians. Nike helps its athletes get as close to the line as possible with its labs and even sending souts to foreign camps to figure out what the are using/doing. This will never stop in all sports.
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jewbacca wrote:
You've said absolutely nothing.
Basic reading and compression are not in you skill set. -
The OP fears that the story is being skillfully turned towards ethics, away from doping. I'm saying that so far, based on the combined testimony of 17 athletes/staff, the story cannot be turned away from something it never was.
If USADA/WADA has more doping evidence that has not come to light, then that evidence needs no public defense from Alberto, until after it comes out. Until then, it's to soon for the public to talk about doping violations that may or may not have occurred.
Fart in a Bell Jar wrote:
rekrunner wrote:
more evidence needs to come out ... there is not much that show that a WADA defined doping violation has ever been committed by Salazar or Rupp ... there is simply too little evidence to talk about doping/cheating with banned substances or methods.
I suppose saying the same thing three times in one short post is one way of going about convincing yourself of your own bullshit.
You plainly have no idea what evidence USADA and WADA possess, what lines of inquiry they are most avidly pursuing, and even what kinds of infractions would allow them to act. You're just one of those hapless souls who stays on the same failed message -- you think that only something like video footage of EPO or steroid use constitutes "real evidence," and (this is the funniest part) that the BBC and Mr. Epstein are basically the only ones who might have more and heavier evidence of any sort.
Are you forgetting that those who have spoken to the press may ALSO have spoken to USADA and WADA, and that those conversations have not yet come to light? -
Kant Reed wrote:
jewbacca wrote:
You've said absolutely nothing.
Basic reading and compression are not in you skill set.
It's cute when you try to debate with personal attacks. Let the big boys handle this one, son.
None seers wrote:
"When allegations came out against Lance, you had athletes saying they either saw him dope or were asked by him to dope."
- Salazar shares a room with Rupp when they travel. Salazar travels with vials, meds, and needles. Figure it from there.
I share a room with my coach when I travel. And I travel with creams and lotions. So obviously I'm doping? Or did you ignore all the posts about allergy meds being custom-made and tailored to the individual, requiring injection and refrigeration?
"Oh there are plenty of words to read, sure. Empty words."
- The empty words are all coming from Salazar's silence.
What are you trying to say? This is a worthless comment.
"Words designed to tell you how to feel, like Kara's "This is going to break his mother's heart."
- Rupp plays with toys.
- Farah's wife is pregnant.
- Centro doesn't drink.
I don't even know what to say.
The whole post was worthless.
Like I said, the testosterone document and Androgel are the only allegations worth considering at this point. -
The only way to stop steroids... Is to do more frequent testing..
Once a month for every athlete..
And they need to start testing for steroids in other areas of the world such as modeling and food based companies such as protein supplement companies..
We can never say for sure whos on steroids without 100 percent proof..
And most companies operate out of the mindset of prove to us that our athletes or models depicted in our media are on steroids.
I operate out of the mindset of exactly.. Prove to me that your models, fitness models, athletes, etc, depicted in your magazines, movies, commericials, books, events, promotions, etc are NOT on steroids.
There should be a law that every company that depicts humans across all forms of media should be required to test their athletes for steroids..
The testing places need more funding. -
For championships athletes should be in lockup, meaning that they all have to stay is a common hotel, or hotels, with their luggage screened, and controlled entrance and exit. This should start two nights before the event, and last the entire day before, and until the competition starts. Failure to get to the lockup means an athlete gets scratched from the meet. Fail three times and get a ban identical to missing three tests.
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Not to say I am defending NOP, but in the court of pulic opinion, they are guilty here. I wonder what defence ALSal could put out that would statisfy people. I don't think there is anything that he can say.
And right now it is a he said/she said as nobody has any solid proof. No smoking gun. Just people that left Nike/NOP under not the best terms saying they did not like what was going on. and that is what he is going to say. I am not sure what information is going to be provided, but it will not change anyones opinion. And having a clock on the front page showing its been two weeks since ALSal say he needed time and would respond. that is just stupid. Sorry BroJos.
For me personally, I think he gets off without anything happening. I think it is the system that needs changing. ALSal figures out ways to get his athetes on medications that helps performance. The issue is the way the TUEs are given out and maybe that needs to change. That way they are limited to athletes with a history of the condition, not just a recent occurance.
Just my 2 cents -
Salazar has no defence.
LOL ... another post brought to you the British PR fix it firm. Is Farah paying the bills, or Ricky Simms?
