captain obvioso wrote:
Scattered in the wind wrote:No, centro will go to Rowland. Rupp goes to Aden with Farah. Rowbury goes back to The Bay. Moser retires. Hasay goes who knows where.
As if it matters where Hasay goes.
this made my day. I just cracked up
I know this comparison has been made before but I think it's relevant right now so forgive me for beating it to death. Farah and Tegenkamp. Here's a comparison from before Mo went to the NOP in 2011.Matt Tegenkamp - born Jan '82PR's1500 Metres 3:34.25 Atha (Olympic Stadium) 02 JUL 20073000 Metres 7:34.98 Monaco (Stade Louis II) 20 AUG 20065000 Metres 12:58.56 Bruxelles (Boudewijnstadion) 04 SEP 2009Finished fourth and eighth at the 07 and 09 WC's and thirteenth at the 08 Olympics (all in the 5k).Mo Farah - born March '83PR's1500 Metres 3:33.98 Monaco (Stade Louis II) 28 JUL 20093000 Metres 7:38.15 Zagreb 31 AUG 20065000 Metres 12:57.94 Zurich 19 AUG 201010000 Metres 27:28.86 Marseille 05 JUN 2010Finished sixth and seventh at the 07 and 09 WC's and did not make it out of the heats at the 08 Olympics (all in the 5k).I didn't list Teg's U.S. finishes or Mo's Euro finishes but they have similar accomplishments there as well.
Flat Stanley wrote:
I have heard rumours of asthma medication, thyroid and locked fridges in appartments with Jerry’s guys as well. Did Jerry’s guys have access to the same Nike lab NOP used. Were any of them referred by the same scientists to doctors for a thyroid or asthma evaluation?
Teg's decline from a sub 13 guy to where he is now is truly staggering. It is almost like he was on something and either had second thoughts or realised he was no longer competitive so stopped taking it. I just don’t get the guy. He so rarely races when this is supposed to be his profession. What is the point of racing a 5K in 1355 and then not racing again for the rest of the summer? It is like he his hiding away.
Solinksys decline is worrying in the same way although that is clouded by the injury he suffered.
Maybe they were on the thyroid stuff etc. and thought better of it. Interesting to note in the last few years none of Jerry’s guys have got close to the times that Teg and Solinksy were running for 5K when arguably they have at least as much talent. Derrick, Lamong etc. Derrick has not approached Sols 10K time despite being so quick over 5K as a junior.
Maybe Jerry realised the s**t was going to hit the fan and got his guys off the stuff a few years ago before it happened.
I would like to ask Teg and Solinsky if they ever took thyroid, asthma medication or any other substances when they competed at their best.
Jager is the only one running really quick now but I can buy the fact he can run the times he is without thyroid etc. although I think he is asthmatic? 804 - 805 chase is probably worth 735 to 740 3K flat if you have good technique. I can believe that can be done legally and 3.32.97 is great but it’s not unbelievable that someone can run that legally with someone pulling them round nearly the entire race.
Sad thing about the sport is you just don’t know what you can believe anymore. I doubt a dirty Rupp could not run as fast as a clean Solinsky. Farah’s PR is only 2 seconds faster than Sol in the 5K.
Flat Stanley wrote:
I have heard rumours of asthma medication, thyroid and locked fridges in appartments with Jerry’s guys as well. Did Jerry’s guys have access to the same Nike lab NOP used. Were any of them referred by the same scientists to doctors for a thyroid or asthma evaluation?
Teg's decline from a sub 13 guy to where he is now is truly staggering. It is almost like he was on something and either had second thoughts or realised he was no longer competitive so stopped taking it. I just don’t get the guy. He so rarely races when this is supposed to be his profession. What is the point of racing a 5K in 1355 and then not racing again for the rest of the summer? It is like he his hiding away.
Solinksys decline is worrying in the same way although that is clouded by the injury he suffered.
Maybe they were on the thyroid stuff etc. and thought better of it. Interesting to note in the last few years none of Jerry’s guys have got close to the times that Teg and Solinksy were running for 5K when arguably they have at least as much talent. Derrick, Lamong etc. Derrick has not approached Sols 10K time despite being so quick over 5K as a junior.
Maybe Jerry realised the s**t was going to hit the fan and got his guys off the stuff a few years ago before it happened.
I would like to ask Teg and Solinsky if they ever took thyroid, asthma medication or any other substances when they competed at their best.
Jager is the only one running really quick now but I can buy the fact he can run the times he is without thyroid etc. although I think he is asthmatic? 804 - 805 chase is probably worth 735 to 740 3K flat if you have good technique. I can believe that can be done legally and 3.32.97 is great but it’s not unbelievable that someone can run that legally with someone pulling them round nearly the entire race.
Sad thing about the sport is you just don’t know what you can believe anymore. I doubt a dirty Rupp could not run as fast as a clean Solinsky. Farah’s PR is only 2 seconds faster than Sol in the 5K.
Teg got old.
Solinsky got hurt.
Glad I could clear up these great mysteries for you.
Teg got hurt in 2010. His best 5k was 13:25. This was the year after 12:58. He and his coach neglected his speed to experiment with the 10k. He was never really the same runner again. He was psychologically burnt out. The 5k was his event. He should have never moved up and continued to focus on speed.
RuKiddingMe!!!!! wrote:
Jerry's group is not transparent at all? why? and since their is no transparency how does he (the group) get away with it? Why all the secrecy? How many of their athletes are taking supplements, medications for illness, or other forms of prescription or non prescription drugs? Surely someone in the group is taking something...even if it is considered legal?...but what? Can someone please start asking Jerry's athletes on video what their athletes might using? Do they have something to hide?
Schumacher NEVER goes on video, for exactly that reason.
School girl gossip thread.
Guilty by association wrote:
So you're saying that a group that basically uses the same facilities and is bankrolled by the same organization as NOP should not be questioned.
If anything Shumacher has been more secretive than NOP over the years.
And a muscle that gets ripped off a bone does not raise questions?
Sorry to say, that whole place smells like sh!t.
I will still root for them (both groups), because I'm sure many other int'l pros are doing something in the 'grey-zone' or outright illegal.
Dude, you're talking about the group that Chris Derrick is in. Anyone who thinks that Derrick is enough of a douche to knowingly cheat or stupid enough to unknowingly cheat has absolutely no clue.
Proof by Derrick
Saying Jerry's group isn't as dirty as NOP is like saying that that only Team US Postal or Discovery/Garmin was dirty on the Tour de France. Like saying Lance was dirty but Floyd was clean or Tyler was clean.
Leirbag wrote:
Saying Jerry's group isn't as dirty as NOP is like saying that that only Team US Postal or Discovery/Garmin was dirty on the Tour de France. Like saying Lance was dirty but Floyd was clean or Tyler was clean.
Except of course that I am NOT saying that "Jerry's group isn't as dirty as NOP". I am saying that Jerry's group is as pure as the new fallen snow.
Derrick is there. That is 100% proof.
The first American in history to break 13 is BK. And he does so after training with several people whose cleanliness is questionable.
Then we go through the dark ages. In 2003, Jorge Torres was the only American in the 5k at the world championships, and that was because he was the ONE runner with the B standard. In 2004 there was a documentary made about the travails of chasing the Olympic 5k A standard, and I don't think anyone hit it. In 2008, Fam led a LAP in the steeple at the Olympics and we were just so excited.
Then, out of nowhere, the floodgates open. We have a top ranked steepler. We have a slew of runners under 13:05. Olympic and world championships medalists. And they primarily come from two groups.
How could you possibly believe that ONE group achieving similar results (that were previously unobtainable) is doped, while the other one is clean?
Both of those groups are clean, or they're both dirty.
Class of 97 wrote:
The first American in history to break 13 is BK. And he does so after training with several people whose cleanliness is questionable.
Then we go through the dark ages. In 2003, Jorge Torres was the only American in the 5k at the world championships, and that was because he was the ONE runner with the B standard. In 2004 there was a documentary made about the travails of chasing the Olympic 5k A standard, and I don't think anyone hit it. In 2008, Fam led a LAP in the steeple at the Olympics and we were just so excited.
Then, out of nowhere, the floodgates open. We have a top ranked steepler. We have a slew of runners under 13:05. Olympic and world championships medalists. And they primarily come from two groups.
How could you possibly believe that ONE group achieving similar results (that were previously unobtainable) is doped, while the other one is clean?
Both of those groups are clean, or they're both dirty.
INCORRECT!
You obviously are not familiar with Chris Derrick.
Nice try though, Salazar stooge.
Your logic is incomplete.
Let's get back on the topic guys. How happy is Jerry that Salazar is getting raked over the coals?
Anyway to your point that one is dirty and one is clean is ridiculous. Jerry has had success at all levels and is a superior coach to Alberto's mad scientist methods.
A lot.
I was told that Jager's big drop came because he "finally got his hypothyroid straightened out." He's also on asthma meds.
The two Nike groups are just different sides of the same coin. They use the same grey area methods and use the same Nike lab.
Me personally, I'm ok with that. The only people not hanging out in the grey zone are those who live in the black zone.
Uh uh wrote:
I was told that Jager's big drop came because he "finally got his hypothyroid straightened out." He's also on asthma meds.
The two Nike groups are just different sides of the same coin. They use the same grey area methods and use the same Nike lab.
Me personally, I'm ok with that. The only people not hanging out in the grey zone are those who live in the black zone.
Great, if any of what you mention is really true, would it be that shocking if he actually had a hypothyroid condition or developed exercise induced asthma ? I think the key is does ALL of Jerry's athletes use something for a thyroid condition or asthma? Is Jerry suggesting surpassing the doctors recommendations for a "legal benefit"??
Jer-Bear wrote:Anyway to your point that one is dirty and one is clean is ridiculous. Jerry has had success at all levels and is a superior coach to Alberto's mad scientist methods.
I just don't know how you could possibly believe that Alberto MUST be a Mad Scientist, and Jerry MUST be a superior coach, when they are nearly an identical program, with identical sponsorship, identical facilities, and nearly identical results.
Because Jerry and the boys hail from gold ol', blue collar, hardworking, middle class, cheese and beer loving Wisconsin?
Like a recent poster, I don't mind them hanging in the gray zone. If it isn't illegal, I don't care. I'm certain all of these groups have their "questionable" methods.
Class if 97 wrote:
I just don't know how you could possibly believe that Alberto MUST be a Mad Scientist, and Jerry MUST be a superior coach, when they are nearly an identical program, with identical sponsorship, identical facilities, and nearly identical results.
Because Jerry and the boys hail from gold ol', blue collar, hardworking, middle class, cheese and beer loving Wisconsin?
Like a recent poster, I don't mind them hanging in the gray zone. If it isn't illegal, I don't care. I'm certain all of these groups have their "questionable" methods.
Certain: A state of mind in which one has a hunch about something but really has no way to know.
Class if 97 wrote:
Jer-Bear wrote:Anyway to your point that one is dirty and one is clean is ridiculous. Jerry has had success at all levels and is a superior coach to Alberto's mad scientist methods.I just don't know how you could possibly believe that Alberto MUST be a Mad Scientist, and Jerry MUST be a superior coach, when they are nearly an identical program, with identical sponsorship, identical facilities, and nearly identical results.
Because Jerry and the boys hail from gold ol', blue collar, hardworking, middle class, cheese and beer loving Wisconsin?
Like a recent poster, I don't mind them hanging in the gray zone. If it isn't illegal, I don't care. I'm certain all of these groups have their "questionable" methods.
Because there has been so much smoke around Alberto for years and years and years and years. The guy is a well known associate of Victor Conte, Lance Armstrong, and Mary Slaney. He is as dirty as the sewer in NYC.
can't say anything about Schumacher/Salazar, but i've been struck by this recently: between the NOP allegations, the relative decline/aging of other horses in Schumacher's stable, and his recent SC and 1500 performances, it does appear that Jager really is going to rule the roost.
RIP: D3 All-American Frank Csorba - who ran 13:56 in March - dead
RENATO can you talk about the preparation of Emile Cairess 2:06
Running for Bowerman Track Club used to be cool now its embarrassing
Great interview with Steve Cram - says Jakob has no chance of WRs this year
Hats off to my dad. He just ran a 1:42 Half Marathon and turns 75 in 2 months!
2017 World 800 champ Pierre-Ambroise Bosse banned 1 year for whereabouts failures