Why aren't any former Alberto/NOP athletes defending him?

Have you actually spoken to all of them?

There are none wrote:

Some may be clean but know something, or have suspicions. They don't want to go down with him. They are all staying quiet for a reason.

Must be those NDAs they signed.

Wrong. http://www.oregonlive.com/trackandfield/index.ssf/2015/06/former_nike_oregon_project_ass.html#incart_most_shared-trackandfieldMoreover there are plenty of others who are silent altogether. They are not defending Salzar. But they are not supporting the allegations either.

There are none wrote:

Some may be clean but know something, or have suspicions. They don't want to go down with him. They are all staying quiet for a reason.

qui tacet consentire videtur wrote:

Must be those NDAs they signed.

NDAs do not provide employers protection over illegal activities. Now, giving someone --a competitor, the media-- a photo of the latest, unreleased, company-secret Nike shoe you are trying out, now that would be an improper action by someone who signed a NDA.

ryan foreman wrote:

Wrong.

http://www.oregonlive.com/trackandfield/index.ssf/2015/06/former_nike_oregon_project_ass.html#incart_most_shared-trackandfield

Moreover there are plenty of others who are silent altogether. They are not defending Salzar. But they are not supporting the allegations either.

Those that at silent, at least for the time being, need to carefully consider their options. Getting a lawyer would help them, but many probably can't afford one. All it takes is for a few current and former teammates to tell everything they know for the others to start corroborating the stories.

Tell us more wrote:

Have you actually spoken to all of them?

They're talking. They're talking a lot.

ryan foreman wrote:

Wrong.

http://www.oregonlive.com/trackandfield/index.ssf/2015/06/former_nike_oregon_project_ass.html#incart_most_shared-trackandfield

Do you understand the difference between a former NOP ATHLETE and a former NOP ASSISTANT? It is a non-trivial distinction.

Jesus, this place is just a seething mob of ADD-ravaged clowns and, apparently, illiterates.

Okay, I'll bite. What is the distinction? Keep in mind that a couple of those making the allegations were former assistants or at least doing contract work with NOP. You can't have it both ways.

What? Former teammates HAVE told everything they know. That is the story we are all discussing.

Not protected wrote:

ryan foreman wrote:

Wrong.

http://www.oregonlive.com/trackandfield/index.ssf/2015/06/former_nike_oregon_project_ass.html#incart_most_shared-trackandfield

Moreover there are plenty of others who are silent altogether. They are not defending Salzar. But they are not supporting the allegations either.

Those that at silent, at least for the time being, need to carefully consider their options. Getting a lawyer would help them, but many probably can't afford one. All it takes is for a few current and former teammates to tell everything they know for the others to start corroborating the stories.

There are none wrote:

Some may be clean but know something, or have suspicions. They don't want to go down with him. They are all staying quiet for a reason.

That's because the award winning journalist, Mr. Epstein, hasn't appeared to have contacted any former, very recent or current NOP members outside of the ones that were fired or had an axe to grind (or the accused). Looks like Epstein had all the balance he needed and wanted.

That being said, why would anybody want to come forward in support or against The NOP? For what, so they can get slandered by the crazies on this reputable website? I've run with a few of the guys from time to time over the years and they've all said the rumors (swirling around at that time about the NOP in general) were bogus - and this was after their time there for a few of them.

Trimming man wrote:

There are none wrote:

Some may be clean but know something, or have suspicions. They don't want to go down with him. They are all staying quiet for a reason.

That's because the award winning journalist, Mr. Epstein, hasn't appeared to have contacted any former, very recent or current NOP members outside of the ones that were fired or had an axe to grind (or the accused). Looks like Epstein had all the balance he needed and wanted.

Patently false.

Sounds like you've run a few miles with A Duck.

The majority of track athletes are afraid of their agents. They get into meets via their agents. They're afraid to ask their agents, all of whom's websites state that they provide all these other services for their athletes (they don't), to get them in the press additional sponsors etc. The agents see the athletes as a steady flow in and out, sign em, make money off em, say good-bye, because most of the athletes have short careers, and most of the athletes make the smallest sized contracts. So the 80/20 rule applies here. 20% or less of an agents clients make the agent 80% or more, of her or his income.

Track is clearly a star system, and a scam, Nick Symmonds had to race for free at DL meets? Usery. Crazy. They couldn't afford to pay appearance fees for all the athletes...in...say...Monaco?

Essentially, almost every poorly paid pro track athlete, which is most of them, remains quiet on ALL doping stories, because they may need the shoe company behind the athlete who's just tested positive...Puma in Jamaica, or Nike anywhere.

That's your core ecosystem behind the scenes.

And I'm going to add this. For most of you, if you ever got behind the scenes after the last night of a big meet, and saw some of your heroes stumbling drunk, puking in the gutter, or having their hair held up by a friend while they puked onto the porcelain god... Well, you'd come away with a lot of the athletes demystified.

Behind the scenes of anything isn't as idyllic or as cool as you might expect. Sometimes it is, but often it is just "they put their undies on one leg at a time like we all do" or "they make stupid choices just like the general public."

"It's like high school, only with more money."

Oh shoot I really thought my favorite pros didn't party just like I do. Darn, time to throw away all that TnF memorabilia.

A Duck wrote:

...And I'm going to add this. For most of you, if you ever got behind the scenes after the last night of a big meet, and saw some of your heroes stumbling drunk, puking in the gutter, or having their hair held up by a friend while they puked onto the porcelain god... Well, you'd come away with a lot of the athletes demystified. ...

You throw some wild parties, A Duck.

"

A Duck wrote:

"It's like high school, only with more money."

And cattiness, and drama.

Way more drama.

PS It's not just runners who won't talk about doping. Athletes in many sports talk openly about drugs in their sport in private, but not in public. Jim Bouton is the exception, not the rule. And even when athletes do talk, most fans are willing to wish away what they hear.

A Duck wrote:

And I'm going to add this. For most of you, if you ever got behind the scenes after the last night of a big meet, and saw some of your heroes stumbling drunk, puking in the gutter, or having their hair held up by a friend while they puked onto the porcelain god... Well, you'd come away with a lot of the athletes demystified. "

Oh God, there he goes again, trying to make himself and insider once again. Grandpop, tell me about the time that Zuckerman tried to get you in on the groundfloor of Facebook, over wine, but you turned him down?

ryan foreman wrote:

Former teammates HAVE told everything they know.

How could you or anyone here possibly know that this is the case? I can think of a half-dozen reasons in short order why some of the people interviewed may have disclosed a certain amount of pertinent information while withholding a great deal more.

Trimming man wrote:

That's because the award winning journalist, Mr. Epstein, hasn't appeared to have contacted any former, very recent or current NOP members outside of the ones that were fired or had an axe to grind (or the accused). Looks like Epstein had all the balance he needed and wanted.

That being said, why would anybody want to come forward in support or against The NOP? For what, so they can get slandered by the crazies on this [ un ] reputable website? I've run with a few of the guys from time to time over the years and they've all said the rumors (swirling around at that time about the NOP in general) were bogus - and this was after their time there for a few of them.