Salazar, Farah, talk about use of L-carnitine, a legal supplement with 11% performance gains

I dont care one way or the other. Full disclosure, I think Salazar is a sleaze bag. That aside, it is one thing to drink coffee (nutritional supplement) it is quite another to inject coffee.

slippery slope wrote:

oh no! wrote:

Oh crap - I just ate a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and had a little coffee.

Someone write a story about how obscure masters athletes are now openly using special high protein foods and performance enhancing liquids strained from a berry found mostly in the jungle. The question is not if it is legal - it is.

It maybe be legal, but it sure ain't right.

Has anyone ever told you to deny using coffee?

Angry Willy wrote:

From good ol' Pub Med.

Effects of carnitine on thyroid hormone action.

In the randomized trial, we showed that 2 and 4 grams per day of oral L-carnitine are capable of reversing hyperthyroid symptoms (and biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction) as well as preventing (or minimizing) the appearance of hyperthyroid symptoms (or biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction).

So, if a guy were wanting to get the performance enhancing benefits of thyroid "supplementation" without the nasty side effects of hyperthyroidism, he might take a little L-Cartinine. Do we know any guys who might have been taking a thyroid hormone in Oregon?

Hmm. A bunch of nobodies are listed here:

No chance that's because athletes were taking HGH. Yeah, not a chance.

Thought it might be interesting for people commenting to see a little background on carnitine. Pretty interesting. Mentions the study quoted in The Times article as well.

Thought it might be interesting for people commenting to see a little background on carnitine. Pretty interesting. Mentions the study quoted in The Times article as well.

Your have single handidly just taken a gigantic dump on scientific and medical research. How in the name of God did an imbecile like yourself get a PubMed account?

quote]Angry Willy wrote:

From good ol' Pub Med.

Effects of carnitine on thyroid hormone action.

In the randomized trial, we showed that 2 and 4 grams per day of oral L-carnitine are capable of reversing hyperthyroid symptoms (and biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction) as well as preventing (or minimizing) the appearance of hyperthyroid symptoms (or biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction).

So, if a guy were wanting to get the performance enhancing benefits of thyroid "supplementation" without the nasty side effects of hyperthyroidism, he might take a little L-Cartinine. Do we know any guys who might have been taking a thyroid hormone in Oregon?[/quote]

Surely, an educated person like yourself, will see the irony in calling someone an imbecile, while misspelling "handedly" and overlooking the grammatical infraction of not using a hyphen in "single-handedly".Care to elaborate on how Mr. Willy has taken a gigantic dump on scientific and medical research? This was quite an astute find and observation on his part.

Sha wrote:

Your have single handidly just taken a gigantic dump on scientific and medical research. How in the name of God did an imbecile like yourself get a PubMed account?

Angry Willy wrote:

From good ol' Pub Med.

Effects of carnitine on thyroid hormone action.

In the randomized trial, we showed that 2 and 4 grams per day of oral L-carnitine are capable of reversing hyperthyroid symptoms (and biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction) as well as preventing (or minimizing) the appearance of hyperthyroid symptoms (or biochemical changes in the hyperthyroid direction).

So, if a guy were wanting to get the performance enhancing benefits of thyroid "supplementation" without the nasty side effects of hyperthyroidism, he might take a little L-Cartinine. Do we know any guys who might have been taking a thyroid hormone in Oregon?

No one has yet mentioned something that is very interesting: Alberto Salazar learned about L-carnitine in very short order after the 2011 research paper was published, and he very quickly placed a very large purchase order. Someone must have brought the paper up to Salazar before it was published. It doesn't make sense that he had the time to vet the paper himself.

I am trying to understand the thread. What is the issue? Is it the supplement? The injection of the supplement ? or the prepared responses to testers?

It seems like old news that Salazar tries things to look for advantages, like altitude tents. He takes a super technical, 'no stone unturned' approach. It's who he is. I am not surprised to hear he calls USaDa to talk about these things. Some people think it is wrong but what is the more damning part here that is different? Do you think he bought off USADA? Seriously, is that what people are saying?

In the new world of WADA, a combination of concerns can create an issue: recent positive results research, promptly followed by a large purchase, athletes stating they had taken something, injection (medical professional oversight) versus oral (over the counter), a second large purchase, don't tell anyone the secret, and major performance improvements immediately following the purchase (less than one year).

Legal, or not, overall the events don't look kosher.

Roelants wrote:

I am trying to understand the thread. What is the issue? Is it the supplement? The injection of the supplement ? or the prepared responses to testers?

Both are clues he's a "do whatever it takes to win" program manager.

How many more times do we have to repeat the cycle of "oh, that's not proof of anything." only to later find out there was totally out of control doping? Clues: Jones/BALCO, Armstrong, countless Russian re-positives, IAAF taking bribes to hide positives.

I know, this time it's different.

the drink containing L-carnitine was presented as "a prerequisite" to being part of the team and that she (Jackie Areson) regularly consumed it from October 2011 to April 2012.

So, forced, team-wide, within the rules, doping program including iron injections. But, it's all good. All within the rules.

Dr Jeffrey Brown, a former paid medical consultant to the Nike Oregon Project, said he had carried out experiments involving L-carnitine injections with permission from the US Anti-Doping Agency (USADA).

Dr. Brown pops up again. This time blatantly lying.

Yeah, all clean at NOP.

The LRC article asked how much 50ml (1.6 oz) equals. There are 240ml (8 oz) per cup so it is a little less than a quarter cup. It is about 3 Tablespoons (3/16 cup) or about the amount of fluid in a medium sized egg.

There are medical 50 cc syringes which look large because of the plastic thickness.

Roelants wrote:

I am trying to understand the thread. What is the issue? Is it the supplement? The injection of the supplement ? or the prepared responses to testers?

No, it's rojo trolling just to get more hits.

yawn wrote:

Roelants wrote:

I am trying to understand the thread. What is the issue? Is it the supplement? The injection of the supplement ? or the prepared responses to testers?

No, it's rojo trolling just to get more hits.

No, it's NOP fans running scarred that the walls have started to crumble on their beloved program.

NONE OF THIS IS SURPRISING

Salazar published a white paper long ago that made it clear he is willing to do anything (or use any substance) under the law

Moreover, in past interviews, like around an NYC Half, when Rupp was wearing that mask, Rupp's argument for the mask was "anything for an edge"

WE KNOW THEY'RE RIDING THE EDGE AT NOP, THIS IS JUST AN INSTANCE

This is absurd. We are talking about a LEGAL supplement (around for decades) that was taken LEGALLY. Slice it however you want and make as many reaches as you possibly want, but in the end, it comes right back to the fact that this was a LEGAL supplement that was taken LEGALLY.

Not it's.... wrote:

yawn wrote:

No, it's rojo trolling just to get more hits.

No, it's NOP fans running scarred that the walls have started to crumble on their beloved program.

A legal substance which Salazar is openly communicating with USADA about on the one hand and then innuendo, conjecture and general spewing from the underlings on LosersRant...I missed the crumbling walls part

Hmmmm, your response is very much "A Duck"-like. Right, or wrong, defend to the death.

babylon NOT wrote:

Not it's.... wrote:

No, it's NOP fans running scarred that the walls have started to crumble on their beloved program.

A legal substance which Salazar is openly communicating with USADA about on the one hand and then innuendo, conjecture and general spewing from the underlings on LosersRant...I missed the crumbling walls part

Why the hell is sleazy communicating with USADA at all? Just stop all the shady sh*t. If sleazy is a good coach, then coach running. Not guzzling every single shady thing that comes along. Quit being such a punkassbitch cheating doper. Damn, not every single waking second has to be filled with evil.