Any healthy man can run a sub 2:30 marathon

Which pretty well spells out what has happened presently.

More miles whether we like it or not is the real deal for success in distance running. I used to see this happen with a lot of guys who were determined to do well, put in the miles and surprised even themselves with stellar times. Though it's a hard call whether anyone could do a 2 1/2 or better marathon.

DontFeedTheTroll wrote:

Next up: Based on my experience at Julliard, everyone with a modicum of talent can learn to play the piano well. It just takes practice.

ha.

I know plenty of guys with good running background that trained hard and didn't hit 2:30. I ran 90-110 miles per week (plus 2 significant workouts and a long run of 20mi+) for two marathon cycles in one year and only got down to 2:29 in my early 30s.

I do agree that most of us could run faster than we do with the right training, but stating that any healthy man can run 2:30 is obviously ridiculous.

I disagree.

Yes, any young man can train and eventually run sub 2:30 marathon. However, all that training will lead to that young men no longer being "healthy".

Google CHRONIC CARDIO and you will understand what I mean.

The side effects of CHRONIC CARDIO are well documented and hormonal imbalances are just one of them.

So far everyone who on this thread with 100 mpw in his 20s or 30s broke 2:30 except Alan, who came close, 2:30.

What was Lydiard's PR?

NO WAY.

People of letsrun. Please realize the vast majority 'are into' running because it's something you excel it. You started it early, were good at it, work harder and got better. But you are people naturally inclined to distance running. Many of you don't understand that key fact.

Many people just suck at distance running. They are fast twitch people.

How can I get you to understand it? Think of it this way.

I'm sure there are weight training websites saying any normal man can bench 200 pounds, sprinting sites that say any normal man can break 11.00 in the 100.

The idea that most people can break 2:30 is flat out laughable. I had a guy at Cornell - one of the worse guys on the team - who ran 100 mpw and couldn't break 2:50. But he was a pretty good HS runner (10 minutes roughly).

Dictionary Dickweed wrote:

Dictionary Dabble wrote:

Def'n: Healthy, normal man (n) - a man who can run a 2:30 marathon given the right training.

Proposition: With the right training, any healthy, normal man can run 2:30.

True

Proof: by definition

Hey dickweed, i just substituted 2:30 with 2:00, now all healthy men can break the unbreakable 2 hr marathon. So why don't you go run a sub 2, make yourself a pile of cash, and buy yourself a new brain to fill that empty skull of yours.

Are you as stupid as your post suggests? Seriously, I am trying to keep track of the most mentally challenged people that I encounter here and I think you have put in a serious bid for the # 1 spot. So, were you just trying to be funny or are you really that stupid?

runningart2004 wrote:

jjjjjj wrote:

Okay, how many healthy men in their twenties and thirties trained 100 miles per week or more and did not break 2:30 in the marathon with a few attempts?

I ran many 100 mile weeks up to 120-140. AVERAGED 95 miles a week for an entire year where one month was mostly recovery from a marathon (50-60mi/wk). Had about 5 years focused on the marathon. . Ran 2:32. Ran 4:27/9:32 in HS so I had some talent. Was on pace for sub 2:30 a few times. I was just never built to run...I just trained hard and made the most of it.

Alan

Totally attest to runningart's statement... He let gave us detailed insights to his training 10 yrs ago. If the premise of this thread was true, then Alan would have done it. (Perhaps even 2:22 at Utah or CIM)

know body wrote:

Interesting article, do you guys agree or disagree with the statement that with the right training, any healthy, normal man can run 2:30? I'd say I agree, but it would take a ton of dedication for most. Discus

http://hitsystem.com.au/any-normal-man-can-break-2hrs-30min-for-a-marathon/

I agree that any healthy man would be physically able to run a 2:30 marathon with good training from childhood. However, most men today are pussies. Just look at all the excuses that they come up with in this thread.

You are taking this out of context. The author is a world class runner from the past who is having a quote thrown in his face from long ago. He back peddled when pushed.

How many men tried to break 2:30 and failed?

A lot more failed than succeeded

T-Rex wrote:

Could well have been.When this was proclaimed back then years ago, people who then ran were serious, and fast and maybe talented runners. As Roger's article pointed out it IS evident winning road times these days wouldn't have gotten you into the top tens or maybe the top twenties back then.

Myself I was a 32 3/4 min. 10 km, 15 3/4 min. 5 km guy but was just able to run 2:37 for the 'thon. And preparing for that race did take hard work - but maybe for me a few more regular 100 mpw's could have taken my time 5 or 6 min. lower?.

I too saw Roger Robinson run Vancouver, BC, Canada 1981 marathon in 2:18 and on a really wet miserable day, 'monkey's weather' as described by I think the second placer.

Roger Robinson had really efficient running form with good leg turnover.

Didn't he make Kiwi international teams in his late thirties?

Also, he was the voice of the 1974 Commonwealth Games.

Would you want a person coaching you that thinks you are not normal if you can’t break 2:30 in a marathon?

Mickster wrote:

runningart2004 wrote:

I ran many 100 mile weeks up to 120-140. AVERAGED 95 miles a week for an entire year where one month was mostly recovery from a marathon (50-60mi/wk). Had about 5 years focused on the marathon. . Ran 2:32. Ran 4:27/9:32 in HS so I had some talent. Was on pace for sub 2:30 a few times. I was just never built to run...I just trained hard and made the most of it.

Alan

Totally attest to runningart's statement... He let gave us detailed insights to his training 10 yrs ago. If the premise of this thread was true, then Alan would have done it. (Perhaps even 2:22 at Utah or CIM)

Hindsight being 20/20...I could have done longer marathon pace workouts...my best marathons always came in the fall with a 30k "race" 3-4 weeks out. I did a lot of stuff at or just below marathon pace, I did the 10x1mile and 5x2mile at between half mary to mary pace. I did the faster stuff..10x800 at 2:20-25 was always fun. I did long runs, long fast runs finished long runs with 3-5 miles under 6:00.

I was a 5'5.5" 140-145lb little dude still too big to be a "serious" runner but I loved to train and work hard and that carried me and my flailing legs to some minor success in my neck of the woods.

Alan

I'm sure Roger Clemens thinks the average healthy adult male can throw maybe 80 mph. Allen Iverson probably believes any healthy guy above 6-feet should be able to dunk. Einstein likely figured pretty much anyone could figure out this physics stuff if they tried.

And there you go. People who are way more talented than the norm like the former runner quoted in this article often don't realize that they have extraordinary natural talents. Many figure the baseline is what they are when they themselves are out of shape and that their improvements from training is what made them the best at what they do (as opposed to that combined with extraordinary natural talent).

xxx_the z wrote:

I'm sure Roger Clemens thinks the average healthy adult male can throw maybe 80 mph. Allen Iverson probably believes any healthy guy above 6-feet should be able to dunk. Einstein likely figured pretty much anyone could figure out this physics stuff if they tried.

And there you go. People who are way more talented than the norm like the former runner quoted in this article often don't realize that they have extraordinary natural talents. Many figure the baseline is what they are when they themselves are out of shape and that their improvements from training is what made them the best at what they do (as opposed to that combined with extraordinary natural talent).

This is right.

However, what I really suspect is the author is doing is using weak false modesty to brag. It's no different than if he said this: "sure my penis is 12 inches long, but where I come from every man's penis is at least 12 inches. Heck, a few of the big boys I knew were at least 18 inches long. Us 12 inchers were just normal. I'm sure if you went around and measured, most guys would have a 12 inch penis just like me". Simply put, the guy sounds like an a$$hole.

Lol..excellent analogy, perspective. And yes, I agree.

xxx_the z wrote:

I'm sure Roger Clemens thinks the average healthy adult male can throw maybe 80 mph. Allen Iverson probably believes any healthy guy above 6-feet should be able to dunk. Einstein likely figured pretty much anyone could figure out this physics stuff if they tried.

And there you go. People who are way more talented than the norm like the former runner quoted in this article often don't realize that they have extraordinary natural talents. Many figure the baseline is what they are when they themselves are out of shape and that their improvements from training is what made them the best at what they do (as opposed to that combined with extraordinary natural talent).

Right, though that works the other way too... the average person who gallowalks a color run probably believes they could NEVER have the talent to finish a full half 'thon.

"From 1961 to 1964, (Peter) Snell ran '100 miles a week with me' for two eight-week blocks each year. In 1964 when he won the 800m and 1500m double at the Tokyo Olympics, Snell ran 160km (100 miles) a week for 10 weeks in a row, Magee said.

Seven weeks before he broke three world records in eight days – the mile record at Cook's Gardens in Whanganui preceded his Christchurch feats – SNELL RAN A MARATHON IN 2 HR 41 MIN."

As far as I can tell, Snell does not have a faster recorded marathon time than this 2:41.

So Lydiard's star pupil did not break 2:30 while putting in 100 mile weeks just two months before breaking multiple world records in the half mile and mile. Obviously, Snell may not have ran all out for that marathon but I doubt he ran a recorded time without putting forth a decent effort.

The fact that people with ordinary leg speed can break 2:30 is no more surprising than the fact that people with ordinary endurance can run sub 11s 100 m or high jump 6'-0". Yes, there are ordinary milers who can run sub 2:30 marathoners but that is because they are above average to extra-ordinary marathoners.

I agree with the post that used average VO2 max in the discussion -- most guys even otherwise healthy just cannot run even close to that fast even in their prime. And they have to have bodies that are capable of training for a 26.2 mile race and running it at what most people consider a sprint. People are different and few have that VO2 max -- they may have strength or ability to play the piano or be very smart but you gotta have major talent to be even thinking about 2:30 in your athletic prime. I would consider the statement more believable around 3:00, 3:10, something like that. It may even be 3:30 as someone suggested.

Put it this way --

Do you think Albert Einstein could have gone sub 2:30 ? he was an average healthy male in his time.