Why Shalane and other Top US distance runners don't win

Why Shalane and other Top US distance runners don't win:

Has anyone explored the possibility they simply are not intrinsically fast enough?

2:20 Marathon is "only" 33:10/10k, Flanagan has a 30:22PB, she should be able to run 33:10s in in her sleep. She ended up running 33:28/10k. The difference between her Berlin marathon pace and her 10k PB pace is 9.26%

Kimmeto's Berlin MP pace was 29:09/10k, subtracting the same 9.26% yields 26:27 10k pb. Could Kimetto run that? I don't think so, which means he was marathoning closer to 10k PB pace then Flanagan was, in other words, he was running more effectively than her.

In the end, i think the AR was too much for Flanagan, but getting closer to 2:20 was possible. She should have run for the win, not AR, that could have pushed her harder near the end when she faded pretty badly (though not as bad as Bekele).

Again, decisions on half way split, pacing etc is largely a coaching decision/error, so blame it on Schumacher!

All of that is BS. A couple of others already said it but it's worth restating: It's a numbers game! Kenya and Ethiopia have their entire population dedicated to running at a high level and a culture that fully supports anyone who has any kind of talent completely. If we had 1/10th the interest and support for running in this country, we would be right there with them or better. 1. Not enough rest? BS! Take Haile, Bekele, and Wilson Kipsang as examples. All of those guys travel around the world making appearances all year. More than that, they all own hotels, run training groups, participate in local politics and are responsible for the financial support of countless people. Look at Kipsang. Remember what Renato said about him? He has to modify his training to fit around all of his obligations to friends, family and hangers on. The other two are the same way, and they have the added pressure of the expectations of an entire country on their shoulders every time they go for a jog. 2. American's have more pressure to compete? BS!!! The vast vast vast majority of Americans couldn't name a single U.S. distance runner. Much less do they know what a good time is, how often they race or what the hell is going on in their world. You could probably fit every single American who cared or even knew about Shalane's record attempt this morning in one small stadium. That's not pressure. Pressure is, "if I don't win today I can't financially support the 50 dudes who depend on me and I'll have to kick them all out to fend for themselves."There are no excuses that need to be made. In these African countries, running is not only the only sport they care about collectively, it's also the only way out of a life of poverty. That's motivation! Think about how much harder you'd push on those intervals or those long runs if you knew that if you didn't make it running, you might have trouble feeding your family. Add to that the numbers and it's pretty damn obvious why American's don't compete.Your reasons are ridiculous and simplistic.

wrong. its because americans are fat and lazy.

I think the Africans win because they are faster. Case in point: Dennis Kimetto won today because he could run a 2:02:57. No one else could do that. Glad I could help with this question. :)

Flanagan just is a stupid marathon runner, she will never win running that way, she will always be caught and pass as she dies and others pass on by. she didn't learn from Boston. Coach must be fired.!!!!!!!

Life is easy in Kenya. There is only one big focus running and everything else evolves around it. Not so if you are an athlete for a big brand that you are lecturer,posterchild, handshaker, model, speaker, motivator, interviewer, and so on. That means less time for recovery. E.g. Mo Farrah flew to Nyc for the half and then collapsed in the race; he should have better stayed across the pond before his first marathon.

The less complicated life the better of a marathoner you are. Complicated in terms of obligations, honesty, friendships, relations, .....

Absolute nonsense. The biggest sport, by far, in Kenya is soccer - just as it is in basically all countries outside North America, Eastern Asia and Australia. Running is something that is done by a few tribes on the Kenyan highland.

Ding! Ding! We have a winner Johnny!

Since you asked wrote:

Better PED's and less stringent testing for those who

"Come out of nowhere".

You are right, having a guaranteed contract can give one a peace of mind; just as Kara Goucher said when she signed her new contracts.

However, not all contracts are the same. Some requires you to run a certain amount of races through out the year and to attend various events to support your sponsors. This means that a runner has to run certain races and take time out for appearances; whether they feel like it or not.

Also, some of these elite runners have a supporting cast that has to be paid. This can put a lot of pressure and stress on runners. A lot of African runners lives off $1 US per day, so

any amount of money earned during the year of racing is a plus for them.

Fritz wrote:

Life is easy in Kenya. There is only one big focus running and everything else evolves around it. Not so if you are an athlete for a big brand that you are lecturer,posterchild, handshaker, model, speaker, motivator, interviewer, and so on. That means less time for recovery. E.g. Mo Farrah flew to Nyc for the half and then collapsed in the race; he should have better stayed across the pond before his first marathon.

The less complicated life the better of a marathoner you are. Complicated in terms of obligations, honesty, friendships, relations, .....

Life may be simpler in Kenya. It is not easy. Do your laundry by hand for a few weeks and get back to us.

itapinfo wrote:

You are right, having a guaranteed contract can give one a peace of mind; just as Kara Goucher said when she signed her new contracts.

However, not all contracts are the same. Some requires you to run a certain amount of races through out the year and to attend various events to support your sponsors. This means that a runner has to run certain races and take time out for appearances; whether they feel like it or not.

Also, some of these elite runners have a supporting cast that has to be paid. This can put a lot of pressure and stress on runners. A lot of African runners lives off $1 US per day, so

any amount of money earned during the year of racing is a plus for them.

Stop with the stresses an elite has. That is crap. Attending an event to support a sponsor, wow, sit and sign a couple of autographs, that will kill the training, holy crap.

Here is the day of an elite runner, get up, run, come back, eat, take a nap, watch TV, run, come back and eat, go for a massage, watch TV and go to bed. This is what three olympic marathon runners I lived with did made me laugh, those Leave it to Beaver reruns were a killer.

If you read my post correctly you would notice that I said MOST top US runners. Not all runners are the same; what can cause stress and anxiety to some can be a motivation to others. Please go back and review Haile, Bekele, and Wilson Kipsang schedules when they first started out and let me know how many "Business" and other activities they engaged in during the first two years of turning pro.

"Not enough rest? BS!"

"American's have more pressure to compete? BS!!!"

Please provide me the name of a Coach or Runner that agrees with you that "Not having enough rest and the pressure to compete" is BS in regards to their Performance.

Thank you

Neel, Ritz Raff, and the OP are the same poster. Way to congratulate yourself, does it feel good?

Genetics- If black-americans started running long distance in large numbers they would immediately dominate at the national level. The ncaa 5k would look like the 200m.

Training- Africans run 3x a day from the time they're like 12. Americans start running 2x a day when they're 23.

Mentality- American runners overanalyze everything. You don't need to be doing math in your head while running. Just go.

Shalane was gonna FVCK SHIT UP!!!

I call bs. Look at the times of West Africans they are rather pathetic. Picture state champions in high school would be the national record holder of Nigeria or Ghana. Keep spreading myths because you watch the NFL or have Usain Bolt poster on your wall.

runnerboy1 wrote:

While Shalane had a good effort today, talk is cheap. How often to do you hear from the kenyan or ethiopian of setting a WR, or a specific time. Never. Anytime one of the USA upper crust begins talk of AR, CR or a specific time, it does not happen.

Best to let the fitness do the talking during the race and results speak for themselves. Then the post run commentary of 'I thought, or my training indicated' etc.

A humble approach is best.

old timer... wrote:

The top US runners don't race enough. Very simple, they don't know how to race, they don't know how to shift gears, they can't handle tempo changes in a race. Because they don't race enough. Even Saladbar knows that, Rupp races more than many US guys and gals.

Worst post of the century and dumbest poster....ever. How often do Kenyans talk about WRs....how about today moron. And Ethiopians? Are you kidding? Have you never heard of Geb??

[quote]runnerboy1 wrote:

While Shalane had a good effort today, talk is cheap. How often to do you hear from the kenyan or ethiopian of setting a WR, or a specific time. Never. Anytime one of the USA upper crust begins talk of AR, CR or a specific time, it does not happen.

Best to let the fitness do the talking during the race and results speak for themselves. Then the post run commentary of 'I thought, or my training indicated' etc.

A humble approach is best. [quote]

You are clueless. This was right on LR front page:

Dennis Kimetto: “I know I am ready. My preparation has been good and I’m confident for Sunday. If the conditions are good we could break the world record.”