Horses are okay. Centaurs are dicks.
Horses are okay. Centaurs are dicks.
Horse riders are nice people. Horses are some of the nicest animals around, they would never want to cause anyone any harm.
The problem is that horses weren't equipped to be strong fighters, they don't have claws, sharp teeth etc. to defend themselves. Horses come from an age where these beings existed on Earth:
- Roaming lion packs
- Roaming dire wolf packs
- Short-faced bears
- Saber-tooth tigers
- Humans
ALL of them preyed on horses. The only way horses managed to survive in the ecosystem was by being extremely attentive to their environment and run away as soon as they sensed danger. Boars did the same, btw.
So what happens if a cyclist or runner at high speed approach a horse from behind? It gets shocked, and starts "rearing". This is dangerous for anyone involved - the horse, the rider, and the runner.
How to pass horses on narrow trails? Stop the run/bike ride and shout to the rider, making contact "hello!" or "runner coming up!". They will stop the horse, and calm it. Then SLOWLY WALK past the horse, move away from the trail to the forest to make the encounter even safer. Once the horse sees that you are no threat, you can start running again.
Runners need to have a basic understanding of animals that are frequently encountered on trails and can lead to dangerous situations, such as dogs and horses. The trails belong to everyone, not just us.
DC runner 2 wrote:
Agreed on all points. Just the other day I was doing mile repeats on a pretty remote section of a wide, gravel road and was asked to stop running by this horse lady coming head on because I would scare her horse.
Let me guess, was this on the C&O towpath near Riley's Lock?
I've done tempo runs and mile repeats on that stretch only to be interrupted by a lady on her horse taking up the whole path.
Kvothe wrote:
-Horse riders always go very slow, like a walking pace. They aren't galloping through the trails actually training their animals for a race, they are out for a joy ride just to show off how rich they are.
-Horse people are generally uncomfortable to be around. Talking to them, you get a sense that there is something off about them. Maybe if I'd had more than a short conversation with these people, I could put my finger on exactly what it is, but I've never had, you want to extricate yourself when you feel there is something off.
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Awesome summary, especially the points above. Although I think the attitude is worse than the 'crap' -- the crap is pretty much hay that breaks down quickly. It's gross and we'd be better off without it on the trails, but horses gonna horse. The people, OTOH...
An example: my kids and I were stopped off the side of the trail, with some thunder/storms approaching, and some dumb horsewoman said "Can you move your child farther off the trail so we have room? We want to make it back before it storms" Ok, so do we, but regardless we moved even further into rattlesnake territory so the horses and the dumb riders could pass. Shortly after that, when it started to rain lightly, they decided to cut off the trail, right through a field anyway, to make it back (which they could have done in the first place).
It's not the horses fault, just keep in mind that the people riding them are too fat to exercise themselves, yet have some combination of money/entitlement in which they decided to spend money and time to put a horse in a trailer and take it to a trail. They want to think they're some sort of cowgirl/cowboy and are covering up insecurities with a display of wealth.
I've found that it's more important to make a big show about yielding to the horsepeople than actually doing it. If I stop as soon as we're in visual contact and move way off the trail and say something, they might wave me through and share the trail. If I slow to a slow jog and approach to a more reasonable distance where I can then move off the trail, they'll be upset that I haven't yielded from like a quarter mile away.
So a 10M rail trail should be a reasonable spot for horses because you would have good visibility and room to pass each other. In reality, many-a-horse-person will expect the runners/bikers to slow to a crawl or stop if you are anywhere near them, which ruins your run.
tony soprano wrote:
Horse people are up in arms that they're being left out of this rather narrow trail which brings its users over tight bridges with low-hanging canopy branches.
If they're allowed on the trail, they'll demand that everyone else give them the right of way - since they are on horses and can't control them.
Most definitely they should be banned from the trail.
tony soprano wrote:
What is your experience with this situation?
Horse poop. Horse poop. And more horse poop. Unlike with dogs, horse owners will not pick up after their steed.
opinionated guy wrote:
Trollhard wrote:
only experience: lots of horseshit everywhere
I've always wondered why people are expected to clean up after their dogs, but people get a free ride on the whole horse defecation issue. I have been on shared trails where it is literally everywhere.
This. There is one trail so messed up with horse defecation I will never us it. And if you have kids on one of these horse trashed trails that can be a real problem.
No to horses.
Horse poop, yep. Entitled affluent riders, often. Another negative is the fact that horses and their large poop piles attract flies and ticks. When I used to run on a trail in SoCal that was used a lot by equestrians, there were tons of horse flies and I had to check very carefully for ticks after runs.
Here's the thing though. When this country gains its senses and decides to tax the bejesus out of the .5%, their horses (and airplanes and yachts and multiple homes and other indicia of their wealth) will make it easier for the rest of us to find and identify them, so as to turn them upside down and shake the money vigorously from their pockets.
So there is that.
Horse owners (at least in urban areas) are the literal worst. Leaving poop all over the place has already been mentioned. Assuming they own the trail and everyone has to bow to their will has already been mentioned.
Some of my interactions:
Came behind two horses on a 7ish foot wide trail and yelled from probably 60 feet back 'coming up behind'. They looked at me and slowly kept meandering, i slowed to a crawl thinking they just weren't going to move at all. After about 30 seconds, one of them painfully slowly finally starts nudging aside, when there's enough room I did a kind of shuffle jog to get by quickly at which point I get yelled at for 'running' past their horses when 'the law' (?) is that I have to walk past.
Crested a hill on a blind corner and a horse got a bit spooked and the rider had to work to keep from getting tossed. Got yelled at for not making enough noise.
Was running along a trail and a riderless horse blasts by me from behind (probably could have killed me). When the party of riders going after it went by me I told them that public trails are not a great place if you can't control your horse and there are plenty of equestrian centers nearby. Got yelled at and told I should be running on a track.
Came upon two riders casually having a conversation blocking entire trail. They watch me approach for literally ~50 meters ~20-30 seconds. I got to them and stopped and just looked at them. They slowly meandered off the path over the course of 20 seconds.
Dozens of other similar or minor interactions cementing in my mind there is a very high % of rich, entitled a-holes in the equestrian community. Of all I encounter, maybe half are polite and understand they should be the ones being careful in public spaces.
Here in Cherry Hills Village are hundreds of miles of horse trails. Plenty of the villagers have horses, but I only see a few a month on the trails. Rich people are too lazy to exercise their animals.
opinionated guy wrote:
Trollhard wrote:only experience: lots of horseshit everywhere
I've always wondered why people are expected to clean up after their dogs, but people get a free ride on the whole horse defecation issue. I have been on shared trails where it is literally everywhere.
There's a multi use trail about 100m from my house. It's used by walkers, runners, mtn bikers, and of course horses. A lot of people out with their dogs but at least they scoop their poop. Not so for the entitled horse owner. They crap all over the place. They should be required to pick it up and pack it out.
Horse riders claim that their poop is OK because it doesn't carry parasites etc. or cause water pollution.
Maybe that's true, but that doesn't make it OK to force everyone else to walk through your animal's crap...
sdfasdfds wrote:
I'd better get to run on horse trails.
you mean you want to run among numerous horses?
That’s why I carry an old Starter pistol when I run a trails that horses have no business on by the horse owners believe otherwise. After an encounter where I was chastised by a pair of riders blocking the trail by riding very slowly side by side and not making room for me to pass when they clearly saw me coming for over a minute. Now I just fire off a cap or two when I see riders blocking the path so they are very aware that it’s time to move over and share the path that they shouldn’t be on in the first place.
They sure are finicky. Used to see a lot more 10 years ago in the Back Bay in Newport Beach. Haven’t seen a horse there in 5 years.
I have my pet Tiger on pacing duties. He clears the way pretty darn quick and can handle short fartleks with ease. If I blow up, I have my transportation. He also helps out with carrying my nutrition and hydration. I save on gas and do not contribute to global warming. As a trade, he eats all the annoying punks on the trails...cyclists, horse ladies, people walking four abreast, hobby jogging fitness girls/bros on their phones etc. You should consider such an amicable partnership.
If horses are so dangerous, they shouldn't be allowed on any trails. I can inconvenience myself and follow these instructions, but how about a teen. He's not used to horses as they aren't common on trails, but he's trying a new place. A horse rears and kicks him. You can see how this is something that should never be allowed to happen.
No trails are not for everyone. They're not for motorcross riders, they're not for skateboarders, they're not for unleashed dogs, and they shouldn't be for horses. Anyone on the trail should be safe from other trail users no matter his knowledge of their animals or activity. I have a reasonable expectation that a cyclist or runner isn't going to hurt anyone on the trail while chasing strava records. I don't have the same expectation about a horse rider.
I'm not going to follow your made up horse rules and no one else should either. Keep your horse on the farm or whatever fancy pants riding place you ride it at, don't take it out where it can hurt others.
Imagine if we keep up with a list of rules so you wouldn't get hurt by strava record chasers. You must move off the trail, you must call out when the cyclist is 200 feet away, etc. It would be preposterous, just like its preposterous to take an animal you admit is dangerous on the trail.
You admit humans were around when horses were feral, yet I have a reasonable expectation that another human isn't going to hurt me out on the trail, unlike your horse. Humans and dogs evolved to be able to use the trails together safely. We'll re-evaluate if horses should be on the trail when they've had another couple hundred years of evolution. Until then stop doing something that could hurt others. You're what is wrong with horses being on trails, you expect others to inconvenience themselves so your activity doesn't cause them harm, no one else does this.
You probably don't pick up after your horse either. All the crap it leaves is someone else's problem, not the horse rider's right... Heavy horse use makes trails disgusting.
You one up yourself daily with stupidity on this forum. It is truly incredible. I am beginning to start to believe that you are trolling. If so, 10/10
Kvothe wrote:
I have a reasonable expectation that a cyclist or runner isn't going to hurt anyone on the trail while chasing strava records.
Had you ever used a multi-use trail that expectation would probably change.
Horses can easily kill people. They’re no different than an ATV on a public trail. Actually they’re worse because they’re more unpredictable. The problem is these rich horse people donate to these public trails. We all know that money rules so horses and their lazy riders aren’t going away anytime soon unfortunately.