Ryan Hall has built mega base for first time since HS

I think he's full of shit. He says he "just" built up a big base since Boston? In all of, what, two, two and a half months? And people are supposed to believe that he didn't do significant base mileage before his 2:06:16 in London or his 2:04:48 (worth a 2:07-high at best on a fair course, but still) in Boston? Or before either of his Olympic races?

Also, his comments suggest that he doesn't know the first thing about physiology; no one "starts from scratch" after a marathon and a couple of easy weeks. Also, by emphasizing that he's done no speedwork in months, he's making excuses in advance for running poorly tomorrow.

Finally:

"My body never responded well when I went straight from a marathon to 5K and 10K training"

When did Ryan Hall *ever* dedicate himself to 5K/10K training for any length of time since becoming a marathoner? Codswollop. He'll mail in another ~29:30 effort at Beach to Beacon and hopefully by this time no one will be surprised.

Alaskan Punch wrote:

When did Ryan Hall *ever* dedicate himself to 5K/10K training for any length of time since becoming a marathoner?

2011, when he ran a road mile and then stated he wanted to compete in some track races over the summer.

Your whole post shows just how uninformed you are.

He has stated he hasn't done any speed, and just wants to see if he can run 4:40s for this race. So I am not expecting anything big here.

He got a 4:17 road mile in that year!

Is Canova still coaching him? If so, why is he still doing months of slow easy miles? His 'aerobic house' should be pretty well built by this point and he should be including tons of strides (like Meb) and/or doing some hill sprints & tempos in his early season workouts. 4:40 pace should be ~tempo pace for a 2:06 man that has a MEGA BASE.

I'm gonna have to call BS on his too... Guess we'll find out soon enough.

I think Ryan Hall should hit the track and try to rebuild from there. He needs to get that speed back that he had when he ran 59. Putting in a season of 10k training could be just what he needs to bounce back. He knows that his speed has deteriorated and when you combine that with his injuries his recent results make perfect sense.

Bubbadeeboo wrote:

Is Canova still coaching him?

He's been averaging 18-20 miles a day for 8 weeks now. He's done workouts like 10 x 1 mile with short rests, and 2 hour long runs with tempo intervals(he's posted on facebook about these 2 workouts). He has a big base. Ryan is a hero to me, and I'm excited to see that he's healthy and stringing some training together. He found out what was getting him injured, and he addressed it. If he's careful with the speed, he should make it healthy to New York.

You have to remember, that at the elite level, these guys have many years of hard training under their belt. Due to this, its possible to run a lot faster on a random day than their training may indicate because they have 10s of thousands of miles on their legs already. If he makes it to the line healthy, anything is possible. I would say anything sub 2:10 in New York would be solid progress after the injuries, and if he runs under 2:08 I'd consider it a success.

Ryan not's going to go out and run like he did in Boston 2011. Best case scenario, 2:06 on an absolutely perfect day if God is running inside of him. (he says on good days it feels like God is running with him, but when he ran 59:43 in the half it felt like God was literally running inside of him; if he has a day like that, he runs 2:06)

killarney wrote:

Alaskan Punch wrote:

When did Ryan Hall *ever* dedicate himself to 5K/10K training for any length of time since becoming a marathoner?

2011, when he ran a road mile and then stated he wanted to compete in some track races over the summer.

Your whole post shows just how uninformed you are.

---------------------------------------

Alaskan made a great post. You though ignorantly argue Hall's stated dedication to a 2011 road mile & desire for track races- that never panned out.

Alaskan Punch wrote:

And how did those track races turn out, oh expert on all things Hall? Did he even run any?

Uhh... that's precisely the point. His training that way didn't last long. He stated he'd incorporate more speedwork in the future, and again, DNF'd three marathons in a row.

ttc wrote:

Alaskan made a great post. You though ignorantly argue Hall's stated dedication to a 2011 road mile & desire for track races- that never panned out.

It "never panned out" is EXACTLY what Hall is saying. Wow you guys are slow today.

"which I haven’t done since high school".

Sounds like he has exhausted all other training options and is resorting to desperation.

NotAustin18 wrote:

He's done workouts like 10 x 1 mile with short rests, and 2 hour long runs with tempo intervals(he's posted on facebook about these 2 workouts)

So in other words, he says he's done no speed work at all, which is true with the exception of the speed workouts he's done. I'm glad that's been cleared up.

trello wrote:

Uhh... that's precisely the point. His training that way didn't last long. He stated he'd incorporate more speedwork in the future, and again, DNF'd three marathons in a row.

Oh, bullshit. He said he hasn't had success going straight from a marathon to 5K/10K training, whereas you're saying that he's figured out speedwork in general is bad for him. If that were really the case, Hall would be in a world of shit, wouldn't he? Like a bowler who has a phobia of smooth round objects or a NASCAR driver with a pathological distaste of loud noises? Are you saying he simply can never be a 5K/10K runner? When he set his AR in the half, he in effect ran back-to-back 28:23 10Ks plus a little, so anything shy of 28:30 for a road 10K marks a serious drop-off. (Not every day should be compared to the most magical in an athlete's career, but still...)

Again, Hall is frighteningly inconsistent when it comes to how he supposedly trains and what his goals are. In recent years he's clearly become more desperate, to use the words of another poster -- switching or dropping coaches with aplomb as his race results have suffered. He seems to thrive on showing up and going balls out off the line like he did at the Olympic Trials last year (even though he lost there) but other than that his confidence is in the crapper regardless of whether his body is cooperating.

Canova>God wrote:

I think Ryan Hall should hit the track and try to rebuild from there. He needs to get that speed back that he had when he ran 59. Putting in a season of 10k training could be just what he needs to bounce back. He knows that his speed has deteriorated and when you combine that with his injuries his recent results make perfect sense.

I can give you thou$and$ of rea$on$ why that will never happen.

Alaskan Punch wrote:

his 2:04:48 (worth a 2:07-high at best on a fair course, but still) in Boston?

Don't forget Mutai went on to run 2:05 in New York on what everyone agrees is a tough course. Yes, the tailwind was nice, but not enough to negate the hills from 10 - 22. Boston is more than "fair".

You seem to get worked up very easily and be very negative. That will make life stressful as you get older. Choose to be happy.

Cheers. Time for 8 miler.

It appears most of you have superior knowledge on how Ryan Hall should train, but, have any of you come close to any of the running accomplishments of Ryan Hall. He is easily one of the top American marathon runners of all times. You might not like his stance on God and his approach to running but he's definitely a very gifted runner. I wish he was a little more consistent at times, but it's a lot of pressure on the body to run times like he has on a consistent basis (unless your Kenyan or Ethiopian).

Serious thought. Does everyone benefit from the same training? Is it possible that Ryan Hall knows something about his body and the way it responds to certain types of training that you don't?

There are many ways to train for a marathon, but to me the most important element is that you believe in what you are doing. Ryan Hall is clearly gaining confidence and gradually racing himself into shape.

The Rocket.. wrote:

Ryan Hall is clearly gaining confidence and gradually racing himself into shape.

He is or is going to gradually race himself into shape? If he is gradually racing himself into shape, can you post some of those race results?

You are good to go wrote:

Don't forget Mutai went on to run 2:05 in New York on what everyone agrees is a tough course. Yes, the tailwind was nice, but not enough to negate the hills from 10 - 22. Boston is more than "fair".

You seem to get worked up very easily and be very negative. That will make life stressful as you get older. Choose to be happy.

I messed up -- it was 2:04:58, of course.

OK, if the tailwind wasn't enough to "negate" the Boston hills (I'm trying hard to hold in derisive laughter at this point -- and where are the hills on that course starting at 10 miles, by the way? Did you mean 17 - 21?), then

1) Why have times at Boston never been close to what they were in 2011? And

2) Why haven't Hall, Mutai, Davila, et al. along with a huge army of recrational marathoners never approached their times from Boston that year, before or since?

I'm honestly not sure which is more mindless: You assuming I'm "worked up" merely because I'm not blowing sunshine out of my butthole in this thread, or the guy beneath you resorting to the usual primitive "If you can't run as fast as X, you can't criticize X" canard. Ryan Hall is a great runner and I neither dispute that not wish him ill -- I'd like nothing more than for him to return to his 2:06 form and he still has plenty of time to do it.

The Rocket.. wrote:

Is it possible that Ryan Hall knows something about his body and the way it responds to certain types of training that you don't?

Sure it's possible. It's also possible that Hall will decide to enter the NBA draft next year and wind up as a shooting guard for the Washington Wizards.

Rather than pose formulaic, abstract questions, keep it simple and stay with the concrete, to wit: Do Hall's results in recent years suggest that he has an intimate familiarity with what works best for him?