just sayin wrote:
ya it was great watching el g and everybody else going back all the years
but then when you learn that basically one generation of dopers replaced another decade after decade
you can become cycnical to the point of losing interest
I don't believe doping was anywhere near as rife as it was in the late 90's or early 00's, in middle distance and distance running.
There wasn't really much money to be made for those competing in the 60's up to the late 80's. The vast majority of those taking then were the east europeans and communists. And even then, that was predominantly in the strength events. There was little on offer to the middle and distance guys. The only possible doping was the blood transfusions, which the Finns and Italians are linked to. They often trained in groups and were state endorsed, rather like the russians or east germans. If there were peds available in the 70's and 80's for middle distance guys (as opposed to the testosterone used by some women), then surely the Germans and Russians would have dominated in men's middle and distance running as well? They didn't. US and UK women weren't in the same league as their East European counterparts in the middle distance events, yet their men were more than a match for the germans/russians.
I don't buy the idea that the Brits were doping their men, when clearly their women were not.
If you look back to Ryun in the late 60's, he was clearly capable of 3:30/3:31 on synthetic, so it doesn't look suspicious that 15 years later the likes of Coe and Cram were running 3:29 and probably capable of 3:28. A 2 sec improvement in almost 20 years is highly plausible, so If you're going to suggest that the 80's mid distance guys were on the juice, then one has to ask about Ryun also. Unless you're one of those that think only the US produces the best clean athletes?
What is far more implausible is the 1500 WR dropping over 3 secs in 1 generation, or about 12 years. And not just by one outlier, but by a bunch of 3 or more. Perhaps for 1 event in isolation, it could be accepted, but when the same thing happens in 3, 5 & 10 k too, it's looks more than suspicious. When you then put it into context with the availability of EPO, then it just looks blatant.
Add that to the fact that since the disappearance of EL G around the time that the new EPO test emerged in 2006, that sub 3:30 is about as rare as it was in the mid 80's, then the evidence is pretty damning to the EL G/ Lagat/ Ngeny/ Cacho generation.
The only milers from the 80's I'd not be surprised if they were doping would be Aouita ( Moroccan for a start, but also implicated by advising his athletes to take drugs while coaching) and some of the East Germans (Beyer, Straub) who seemed to run a level above their normal form whenever a major champs were held behind the iron curtain.
I think Kiprop is perhaps the only athlete under 3:29 who is clean. The only caveat on that is the fact that he (ok, the injury probably was legit) and his Kenyan team mates, who were all running around 3:29 weeks before London, all bombed at the games. They are also rather inconsistent generally. But apart from that I have no real reason to doubt Kiprop is legit.