Mary Cain does her easy days in 6:30....Whaaaat !?!?!?

Not too fast for her. She can run the equivalent of a sub 4:30 mile so 6:30 pace should be something of a walk in the park for her

Elite highschool boys do not run slower than 6:30 on their easy runs. Maybe on recovery runs, but not easy runs.

Obviously Salazar knows what he's doing technically and I don't think there's reason to question the validity of his workouts.

My concern with Cain is about the intensity of Salazar - he's shown with Rupp that he likes to get a runner young and develop long term, which worked wonderfully, but I think this is more dangerous with a young girl entering such an obsessive detailed environment. I think that it's very easy for girls (and I say this as a woman), especially talented ones, to be externally focused - to want to please coaches and adults rather than having an internal sense of satisfaction.

Being a pleaser and being a good obedient girl makes one initially very coachable, but it can also be very challenging for dealing with pressure - I think the athletes that do the best mentally are ones in it for themselves, with a strong sense of what they want to achieve on their own terms. If you want to please Daddy, and please Daddy substitute coach, and are in such an obsessive environment I think that can be very difficult emotionally to handle and lead to burn out.

I sort of think we'll see a year or two of spectacular performances and then trouble either eating-wise, or injury or burn out. I hope not, I want her to do well, but what I read about her dad seems like he's a very dominating Alpha male type (that doesn't mean he doesn't love or want the best for his daughter, but I get the sense of him being ambitious for her - unlike, say, Hasay's parents who seem to stay out of her training) suggests to me that she is a pleaser who is being pushed into this environment. I don't know if Alberto knows how to create a successful but balanced environment that allows a young girl to train at a high level while allowing her to develop a personality, interests and other outlets. I remember reading Rupp's blogs way back when he used to do entries on some running site, and it was literally nothing but run, eat, sleep, video game which obviously led to success, but was also a lifestyle totally focused on running with no other thought ever in his head. I don't know if women survive that kind of thing as well, and Alberto thus far hasn't really had success with women.

Cain seems happy, confident, easy going, and very outgoing. She doesn't seem like the type that would succumb to an eating disorder or to a must-please-the-males mentality.

Girls also seem to be able to run a faster relative pace on their easy days. Has anyone else noticed this?

so she can run 31:30 for the 10km then?

kdkdk wrote:

Elite highschool boys do not run slower than 6:30 on their easy runs. Maybe on recovery runs, but not easy runs.

Wrong. Plenty do. I ran sub 9 and I was definitely not running sub 630 on every training run. During season, the quality days were always the focus and my coach wanted me to keep my training runs pretty relaxed.

Lawguy wrote:

kdkdk wrote:

Elite highschool boys do not run slower than 6:30 on their easy runs. Maybe on recovery runs, but not easy runs.

Wrong. Plenty do. I ran sub 9 and I was definitely not running sub 630 on every training run. During season, the quality days were always the focus and my coach wanted me to keep my training runs pretty relaxed.

No, I'm right. You clearly cannot read.

It seems like she would have a hard time recovering running that fast but I guess not.

Yes because you know what every elite high school boy runner does on their easy days in the United States. Plenty of elite high school runners take some recovery days @ 7 minute pace or higher.

cray cray wrote:

http://www.runnerspace.com/eprofile.php?event_id=13&do=videos&video_id=77612

Isn't that a little bit too fast, even for her? That's faster than a lot of ELITE high school boys run their easy days. AlSal also mentioned that she can do this because she ONLY runs 50 miles per week. But 50 is not exactly low mileage for a high school junior girl. 50 seems to be equivalent to about 70 for boys. She is obviously very successful so I guess it works for her.

It's interesting that the Coaches of Mary Cain and Sarah Baxter continue to reveal more info about their training.

Seems reasonable.

70% of race pace. And you'd expect a 800/miler type to run their mileage faster than a miler/2 miler type.

(70% of race pace, by the way, would be like saying a 5:00 miler runs 7:10 pace on easy days; 5:30 would be 7:50, 6:00 at 8:35, 6:30 at 9:15, etc. none of which I would say is extremely fast)

It's also slower than Canova's fundamental training pace for a 1500m runner.

Women do seem to be able to do general running at a faster pace than comparable men.

Ken Martin used to complain when his wife ran too fast for him.

When Mottram ran with Benita Johnson he had the same problem.

klhf wrote:

Yes because you know what every elite high school boy runner does on their easy days in the United States. Plenty of elite high school runners take some recovery days @ 7 minute pace or higher.

Are you talking about me (your post says you are responding to me)? If so, I will add you to the list of people that can't read.

If my math is fairly accurate, she is running no more than 5.5 hours a WEEK.

This doesn't seem excessive for an elite high school athlete.

I always thought it quite odd that elite wowmen ran their average training runs at a faster pace than elite men. I've run with several elite women who could run in the 15's for 5k who ran 6:20 pace on regular runs, whereas a male that runs 15's for 5k usually runs closer to 6:50 pace on regular runs.

Yes, women appear to easily be able to run closer to their race pace in practice than men do. Why is that?

klhf wrote:

Yes because you know what every elite high school boy runner does on their easy days in the United States. Plenty of elite high school runners take some recovery days @ 7 minute pace or higher.

klhf wrote:

Elite highschool boys do not run slower than 6:30 on their easy runs. Maybe on recovery runs, but not easy runs.

Bolded for you because, as mentioned, you don't seem to read very well.

Partly I think it's insecurity (women are notorious "one steppers"), and partly it's the lower mileage that women are usually doing.

yesstiles wrote:

I always thought it quite odd that elite wowmen ran their average training runs at a faster pace than elite men. I've run with several elite women who could run in the 15's for 5k who ran 6:20 pace on regular runs, whereas a male that runs 15's for 5k usually runs closer to 6:50 pace on regular runs.

Yes, women appear to easily be able to run closer to their race pace in practice than men do. Why is that?

yesstiles wrote:Yes, women appear to easily be able to run closer to their race pace in practice than men do. Why is that?

Perhaps it's a difference in fad in training for women vs. men

Or maybe it suits women better to focus even more on quality than quantity

I ran with two 9:15 two-milers in high school and we did most of our easy runs at 7:30 pace or so. If they were training alone, could they have gone a lot faster? Sure. But what I worry about is the impact stress of training at a fast pace all the time.