Fascinating thread from 8 years ago. How come no LRCers accuse Kenyan distance runners of being on EPO?

VoR wrote:

ventolin^3 wrote:

moron

Your posts look exactly like what I imagine a keyboard with Tourette's would produce.

lol. i was visualizing some drunk italian guy...

Vento' is a med doc and one of the few knowledgeable people

on the board. He presents careful analyses of the potential

of runners and is never far off with his predictions.

Younguy wrote:

I would suspect that some of their long standing regular" top" performers are using Epo just like other countries but would suspect that Epo use is far less in Kenya just due to the number of athletes they produce on A regular basis. I am far more suspicious of the Ethopian athletes who are tightly controlled by their federation where doping could be systematically controlled and administered.

I am an Ethiopian. But I have no patriotic feeling of blindly defending Ethiopian dopers, however, I would like to point out one key point you missed in your suspicion of Ethiopians. True the Ethiopian Athletics federation is tightly controlling Ethiopian runners, but had it tried to dope and hide it would make the most laughable mess ever simply because a significant majority of the federation members are former athletes who like the current athletes are virtually illiterate. I bet you a thousand bucks if you can find me 10 athletes/federation leaders who have completed high school.

Ethiopians are not cheats simply because they would immediately get caught. I know of two "drug cheats" one for morphine (taken for tooth extraction) and one for EPO (for medication taken while competing in a race the winner of which gets 1000$) - both errors caused because they couldn't tell their respective doctors they were athletes. Why? Neither can speak English!!!

DoubleStandard wrote:

They live and train at attitude, and get the same effects EPO gives you, but with injury risk ! I have been to kenya and seen how they train. They give nothing but 110% , eat, sleep and run 0 distractions, competition is like rest to them, because they train SO HARD!

Exactly!

El Kleo wrote:

DoubleStandard wrote:

They live and train at attitude, and get the same effects EPO gives you, but with injury risk ! I have been to kenya and seen how they train. They give nothing but 110% , eat, sleep and run 0 distractions, competition is like rest to them, because they train SO HARD!

Exactly!

Dude, post about your training to go sub 60.

Leave these childish feuds alone and help other masters improve. Thanks :)

Well this thread hasn't aged well. Not sure who besides the dopers themselves and their doctor handlers will argue east Africa is THE hotbed of doping.

truth is out wrote:

Well this thread hasn't aged well. Not sure who besides the dopers themselves and their doctor handlers will argue east Africa is THE hotbed of doping.

Take an English language course, and try to post again.

You may want to drop the pipe and get some rehab.

Cristal Palace wrote:

Asbel Kiprop could test positive and there would barely be a blip on the radar in major sports coverage.

Nice example, randomly picked in 2012...

But yes, what's one more Kenyan drug cheat? Barely a blip...

60 Kenyans have tested positive for EPO the last five years.

SprintTriathlon wrote:

60 Kenyans have tested positive for EPO the last five years.

They sure like that rocket fuel. ?

Seeing a Kenyan runner in the U.S. is like people seeing an NBA player. What you see is 1/100000

of the people who started in that sport. An NBA player was likely a great HS player who was then a great college player, and is now in the NBA. To make it that far, you are reaching a statistic of about 1 in 250,000 . Of all the high schools in this country and all the colleges, this player is one of only 25 to 50 people drafted into the NBA each year. That is what we see in our country when we see a Kenyan runner. They are about 1/250,000. They are the best of the best. Distance running is their NBA. Their way out!

So, to see a 10 year old running 4 miles to school, is not unusual in Kenya. Carry that on for 12 more years, and what do you have. ? Whoever survives, is the best of the best!

Most LRCers are white, they do not like blacks beating them so they reconcile this by saying the blacks cheat.

In 2012 I lived in a southern US city and a girl in my training group was Kenyan. While in college, she ran for a DII school, but was far from elite, so she really didn't have much of a grasp about how elites trained. One day, a few of us in the group were having a conversation about doping, and the subject came up about whether or not Kenyans were on the juice. I was the only person in the group who was adamant that they were, or at least the majority of those at the highest levels of the sport. The Kenyan girl was not at all pleased with my response and she hated me from that point on. I tried to explain the reason for training camps/groups of elite runners and how it's not just for the purpose of running together, or with other fast runners, or so that coaches can be around all their athletes at once. Training groups allow for doctors to be able to administer drugs to the athletes and be able to monitor their vitals, since doping is extremely dangerous. Plus, the doping needs to be controlled so the athletes don't test positive (but that's another subject)...

You're a FREAKIN' IDIOT!

F.O.A.D

truth is out wrote:

Well this thread hasn't aged well. Not sure who besides the dopers themselves and their doctor handlers will argue east Africa is THE hotbed of doping.

The only place a greater percentage of elite athletes dope is Russia.

Unfortunately, many of the LR threads from 2012 were from people with little or no knowledge of how long doping had been prevalent with the Kenyans and Ethiopians. Both have been Doping since the late 1980s and 1990s. The reason for this is that the number of elite runners from these countries was very limited and relatively unknown. Being from impoverished countries with little or no athletic support created a mystique that these athletes were motivated to "Run for their country and family" and that they were raised in the high altitudes of their respective countries which ultimately led to their success. These did factor into much of their success combined with some doping (some, not all). This pretty much lets them "Run under the radar" of suspicion of cheating. There were a few pioneers in the sports management/coaching world who would go to Kenya and Ethiopia and would recruit these already talented runners and develop them to be world-beaters. Notably, the late Kim McDonald from England (Kenya) and Jos Hermanns from Holland (Ethiopia) were famous for their stable of elite African runners. Not that they were pumping all of their athletes with the "Juice" but a few were very suspect with more suspicion toward Jos Hermanns and the Ethiopians. Imagine taking a legit sub 13:10 min 5000m Ethiopian and juicing him up.........Now you've got a sub 12:50 guy. It was only a matter of time before the African 'Pipeline" of doped up runners hit both the road and track circuits. The world records and PB's began to tumble.

We also used to take everything Canova said as gospel - and now I (and I think other LRCers) are fairly skeptical of his claims and defensiveness on the boards.

Maybe this is like how in cycling Bruyneel was such a master of training and tactics and know how (he is those things) his teams didn't cheat or need to. But they did cheat as well - and he knew it, and he behaved a lot like Canova.

BUTTHOLE SURFER wrote:

Unfortunately, many of the LR threads from 2012 were from people with little or no knowledge of how long doping had been prevalent with the Kenyans and Ethiopians. Both have been Doping since the late 1980s and 1990s.

Where is you evidence hmm? You seem to speak without thought. Perhaps go back to your bong and let the adults speak hmm?