50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

amkelley wrote:

I suppose the right answer is to try downing a gel near the end of my next long run and see if it makes me sick or makes me feel better, but gosh, I hate to screw up a potentially good long run in that way. Do any of you care to toss out your two cents' worth?

I’m planning to experiment with in-run energy supplements for the first time, and I’m only training for a half. But I prefer making my own and seeing what goes down easiest. Also that way I can control the ingredients (keeping it plant based).

Of all the ways to screw up a long run, this seems one of the more benign....

KCgeezer wrote:

amkelley wrote:

I suppose the right answer is to try downing a gel near the end of my next long run and see if it makes me sick or makes me feel better, but gosh, I hate to screw up a potentially good long run in that way. Do any of you care to toss out your two cents' worth?

I’m planning to experiment with in-run energy supplements for the first time, and I’m only training for a half. But I prefer making my own and seeing what goes down easiest. Also that way I can control the ingredients (keeping it plant based).

Of all the ways to screw up a long run, this seems one of the more benign....

I drank a mixture of half Gatorade and half water in my young man career. As a master I used gels for some halfs and two marathons with some success. I safety pined the gels to the inside band of my shorts with the singlet tail protecting the skin from rubbing. I followed the instructions at the time to take one before the start and every 45 minutes thereafter. While racing I consumed before a water stop and chased down with water. Wish we had these forty-seven years ago.

I found the eventsmap for Parkruns in the US, the number seems to grow a lot by year.

https://www.parkrun.us/events/

Huge Congrats SCGal! And I'm sure that was a tough course. Running anywhere around Greenville is hilly (at least to me!). Makes an easy run a not so easy run. I'm impressed that SC has Age-Group records recorded. Wonder if Indiana does?

L2b: My opinion is you just need to shoot for consistency again. Be it walking, jogging, crawling or whatever. No need for a watch.

amkelley: I have no problem with you writing down 19.9 miles. I always stop my runs right in front of my house and log whatevers on my watch. I have a friend that has to finish all runs to the tenth, and all weeks to a whole number! Probably drives him nuts to see me write down 6.98 miles like I did Sunday.

No help from me on the gels or fluids during a run. I rarely, if ever, take as much as a drink during a run or a race. Probably don't need too as I really don't race past the HM distance.

I had another nice week. 56 miles with most runs outside. Nailing the workouts and took to leaving the watch home on the easy days. Tuesday striders, Thursday 4xCV 1000's and a solid 12 Saturday.

I'm still thinking about a race in two weeks. Though if I do I'll probably step down to the 10k rather than the HM. I don't think I'm ready for a decent half.

That's it from here. We got a lot of ice last nite so I'll get my workout in on the TM this morning.

Dave

amkelley, we sell a lot of Tailwind in our stores, which seems to be more bland and easier for a sensitive stomach to digest, but it is a drink mix. I hear that many ultrarunners request Scratch, but don't know anything about it. Perpetuam by Hammer is sometimes requested, too. Don't know of any that are organic, if that matters, but seems that Gatorade products have artificial colors.

My limited (of late) experiences keep me away from any calories for the first hour (and no intake before the run). I do like the taste and flavors of Huma gels, as they have ground-up chia seeds as part of their products.

To all Masters runners in the area, the KU Relays plans to have a Masters 800 and a Masters 1 mile (both on the track) as part of their Thursday and Friday schedules, for both men and women, $25 per event. Don't know anything more for when, except that the races are on April 18 and 19.

Managed 19.5 miles last week, plus two indoor bike sessions, d/t the risky road surfaces here in KC, will be a balmy 50 degrees today, and then dropping to near zero in the next 40 hours or so. Hoping for a good quality run today, and maybe a bit of speed tied in.

Goal is a KC Corporate Challenge 1/2 marathon in mid-May.

SprintTriathlon wrote:

I found the eventsmap for Parkruns in the US, the number seems to grow a lot by year.

https://www.parkrun.us/events/

Houston just got its first Parkrun about a month ago:

Mike Lundgren wrote:

...To all Masters runners in the area, the KU Relays plans to have a Masters 800 and a Masters 1 mile (both on the track) as part of their Thursday and Friday schedules, for both men and women, $25 per event. Don't know anything more for when, except that the races are on April 18 and 19. ...

From the Masters Milers group on FB:

Just got this regarding the Kansas Relays:

* The 2019 Kansas Relays will be held April 18-20 at Rock Chalk Park in Lawrence.

* The Relays will offer both a Masters 800 and a Masters Mile this year. Neither event was held last year.

* One of those two events will be contested on Thursday, April 18. The other will be contested on Friday, April 19. The Relays has not yet let me know which one will be on which date. Thursday's track events are typically in the evening while the Friday event is likely to be in the afternoon.

* Registration will be through DirectAthletics only. I am told that registration will open in early April, but I do not have a URL for the registration link yet.

* The cost per event is expected to be $25. You may enter either or both events.

* Once you register, you MUST SHOW UP TO RUN!! No bailing out except for extreme circumstances. The reason that the Masters events were eliminated from the Kansas Relays in the past is because Masters runners were registering and then not showing up. We don't want to go back there!!

I just posted this response on your triglyceride thread, but it belongs here:

Unless you typically have a very sensitive stomach, I think you should plan on taking gels. And you should practice during a long run or two. You could first try the gels before/during shorter runs to see how your stomach reacts.

I'm not convinced it makes a big difference, but especially if you're gonna be out there for close to four hours, it seems like a good idea.

During my first marathon, I consumed only water, and my last 5K was by far the fastest of the race. I drank some Gatorade during my second marathon, and again finished very strong, no bonking. In subsequent marathons (in my early 20s), I ran more aggressively from the start, and ran even splits, consuming only water and Gatorade. No bonking.

From my mid-20s to mid-30s I completed a marathon each year, and I "bonked" badly in every one of them. despite drinking Gatorade. But I was ridiculously undertrained. My typical "training" started four weeks from the marathon: First week 10-mile walk/run, rest six days; second week 14-mile walk-run, rest six days; third week 18-mile walk-run, then rest for two weeks before the marathon.

In my most recent marathon (at age 58), I consumed water, Gatorade and gels. I still hit a minor "bonk" with three miles to go. After averaging 7:06/mile for the first 20 miles, the last 6.2 were 7:02, 7:04, 7:02, 7:33, 7:33, 7:39, 1:29.

Again, though, I was a bit under-trained, and maybe too aggressive at 20-23; so, was it a question of pacing, fueling or fitness?!

amkelley wrote:

And now to change the topic back to my current obsession, the marathon. I'm trying to figure out what to do about fueling. You'd think this is something a 60-year-old lifetime runner would have figured out? Guess again. I have finished something like 15-18 marathons in my life--I don't remember exactly and at one point I threw away all my racing and training logs in a frustration fit. The first was in 1983 and the last in 2004. Since then I've DNF'd twice and DNS'd two or three other times.

I’m no marathoner but I have crewed several people for ultra’s and hung around ultra people enough to get some ideas: I’ll list actual things people in 50 and 100 mile races fueled with knowing some seem nutty: 1) V8 juice, 2) flat Dr. Pepper, 3) Gummies, 4) pbj’s in 8ths, 5) Coca-Cola flavored gels with lots of caffeine, 6) Clif energy shots. They all experiment to see what works. Who knows, V8 may be the magic solution……

Rtype wrote:

I’m no marathoner but I have crewed several people for ultra’s and hung around ultra people enough to get some ideas: I’ll list actual things people in 50 and 100 mile races fueled with knowing some seem nutty: 1) V8 juice, 2) flat Dr. Pepper, 3) Gummies, 4) pbj’s in 8ths, 5) Coca-Cola flavored gels with lots of caffeine, 6) Clif energy shots. They all experiment to see what works. Who knows, V8 may be the magic solution……

I won't have a crew, and carrying much with me when I run is anathema to me. A couple of gels in my pockets is the most I'd be willing to do. I'm certainly not going to carry fluids; it'll have to be water and whatever else is available at the aid stations. Some of the aid stations will be providing Honey Stinger gels. I've just ordered some and plan to try them on a few long runs to see if I can tolerate them.

I suspect that come race day I'll be more worried about getting sick than about running out of fuel, and won't take in any calories. That used to work just fine.

I ran my first road race in the summer of the late 1960s. Bill Gookin one of the masters pioneers and a professional chemist had a product ERG (Electrolite Replacement with Glucose) also called Gookinade. ERG was handed out at the race. Bill had a brother Ed who was also a masters athlete at the time. I asked someone what was in ERG and his response will give a clue to the color of the product: “It’s Ed Gookin’s piss.” Bill passed away recently at the age of 86.

Belated congratulations to SCgal on that 10-mile state record. Very good time on what sounds like a tough course!

I had a somewhat nondescript but solid training week, logging 68 miles in six days of running including a medium-long run of 16.3 miles at 9:00 pace yesterday. My heel came up somewhat alarmingly sore this morning, however, so I took the day off and just spun the bike trainer for 45 min, and plan to go to the gym later and do a bit of rowing.

Assuming my heel doesn't blow up any further, I'm still on track for my marathon in 6 weeks. Next weekend I want to go for something in the 21-22 mile range. I discovered on yesterday's 16-miler that one of the two remaining drinking fountains in town has gone defunct. It didn't matter yesterday since it was cold and I wasn't running that far. However, I may have to plan my longest runs as multi-loops passing by the functional drinking fountain at the dog park several times, particularly if the weather ever starts to warm up. That sort of sucks but i'm not willing to carry a useful amount of water, nor to spend the time pre-run to cache water bottles out on the course.

One of my running friends is really into the marathon. Has been logging state marathon bucket list for over a decade. He typically logs Saturday long runs carrying a bottle of water. I’ll run with a single bottle in summer if I am going 10 miles and above.

We are back in winter mode in the Treasure Valley. Temperatures at freezing in the mornings with light snow. At the same time we have trees showing buds after a warm January. A few weeks back we were only at 85% of normal moisture so the snow is welcome.

Valentine’s Day 2018 I received my diagnosis of Follicular Lymphoma 3a. To paraphrase the oncologist “There is good and bad news. The bad news is you have an aggressive form of lymphoma, the good news is it is cure able.” My first routine CT scan turned out to be on Valentine’s Day a year later. My oncologist was kind enough to call me late Friday that the CT scan was clean.

I am back on a regular exercise routine covering 24 miles running and walking for the week.

Monday: AM- 2 miles E; 5 x 600m critical velocity @ 3:45 / 1:00 rest; 800m easy/walk; PM- 3 mile walk

Tuesday: 2 miles easy/walk; core exercises and weights

Wednesday: 2 miles easy; 4 x 200m hill interval pace / 200m walk; mile easy

Thursday: same as Tuesday

Friday: 3 mile walk

Saturday: 6 miles easy

Sunday: Off

Targeting 30 miles next week. Have a good week.

Igy

I hope the heel issue resolves quickly. good idea to practice your race nutrition/hydration strategy. I usually alternate water and gatorade or whatever drink the marathon is providing on course [i'm with you on not carrying anything], and a gel around halfway or whenever the race is providing. Generally don't care about one product vs. another, though I do remember one brand of drink that seemed to have paradoxical effect of making me feel fatigued right away. I was glad I'd tried it ahead of time and therefore avoided during race.

fun week of training for me:

M 1:25 with 2 X 20:00 at marathon pace (4:00 recovery)

Tu 2:00 double

W 2:00 double with 3 X 10:00 at half-marathon pace (2:00 recovery) + survived dental appointment

Th 1:15

F 1:30

Sa 2:05 with 2 X 20:00 at marathon pace (4:00 recovery)

Su 1:20 + 1:00 x-t

have a good holiday tomorrow if you get it. Trend line is not great from my point of view. When I was a kid it was two days off school (Washington, Lincoln), then 1 (Presidents' Day), now 0 as my employer does not recognize the holiday. Eventually I'll probably go into negative numbers and have to work Sundays in February.

Dave

dhaaga, we still get Presidents' Day off. However, we're looking at a low of 29 degrees for tonight so tomorrow's run will be a chilly one by my standards!

I also survived a tooth extraction and dental implant placement this week. It's my fifth one,, so no big deal anymore. I did have to go on antibiotics for four days, which always messes up my guts a bit. So it was a good week to not do anything really hard. Hoping to be in top shape by next weekend.

It was another decent enough week with 20+ actual jogging miles over my last 7 days (4 jogs). Bumped up the intensity while lowering the volume of my fartlek activity. Continuing to gradually reintroduce some of the hip/glute/core exercises that I set aside when the hips were sore. Weather has been bearable, though not conducive to golf.

Sun: walk w/ the bride

Mon: 51’ jog w/ fartlek (3 x 440y on/off); body wt ex

Tues: off

Wed: 50’ jog; body wt ex

Thu: walk w/ the bride

Fri: 51’ jog; body wt ex

Sat: walk w/ bride & co.

Sun: 51’ jog; body wt ex

Best to most.

56 miles on the training plan this week. All of it went reasonably well even with a couple of windy rainy days.

M- 7 walk with about 150M stride every 1/2 m

T- 8 hills 8:06/mi ave

W- 7 walk with about 150M stride every 1/2 m

Th- 8 hills 8:07/mi ave

F- 7 walk with about 150M stride every 1/2 m

S- 12 hills 8:13/mi ave

Su- 7 walk with about 150M stride every 1/2 m

Good running to all!

Great news Igy!

Good week 7 days 40 minutes a day about 5 miles. Most runs are barefoot in the sand dunes easy with about 15 minutes of tempo. I did time one loop running LT at Miller Park .73 in 4:42 about 6:25 pace HR 150 which is promising.

Really wish there were a 1 mile venue coming up soon as I want to get my official sub 6 in while fit and healthy;) Not sure if they will even have Hayward Classic this year with Hayward Field under construction but 2020 is gonna be a great year around here Oly Trials and hopefully Hayward Classic on the new track.

B Complex seems to be good for me but it might just b in my head knock on wood I am running fast and comfortably. Probably has something to do with base. No base no aerobic fitness no good ok learned that one!

I am happy to say that I have run farther this week than any time before in my life:

72.8 kilometer / 45.2 miles

It makes me believe that peaking at 70 miles before the end of the year is feasible.