Dear Americans if you want AR be prepared to run sub 12:49 this year. Sincerely Bernard Lagat

Improper handling of the B sample you mean.

Improper in the sense that it wouldn't look at all good if the nice smiley Kenyan tested positive for EPO, so we'll give him a pass. So we'll handle this sample improperly and declare him innocent.

Just like nice smiley Jamaican Merlene Ottey.

The nasty unpleasant Russians don't get that sort of treatment.

trollism wrote:

Improper handling of the B sample you mean.

Improper in the sense that it wouldn't look at all good if the nice smiley Kenyan tested positive for EPO, so we'll give him a pass. So we'll handle this sample improperly and declare him innocent.

Just like nice smiley Jamaican Merlene Ottey.

The nasty unpleasant Russians don't get that sort of treatment.

You're no different than the birthers. No credible evidence to your case, and your premise flies in the face of all logic.

This thread is a joke. Lagat has done nothing to indicate he's capable of 12:49 this year. Just because he says he thinks he can do it doesn't mean he can do it. The guy is 36. If he matches his time from last year that would be an amazing accomplishment.

interesting stat on bernard lagat, bernard lagat has run under 3:33.00 for 1500 an amazing 42 times, every other american COMBINED has done it 34 times.

trollism wrote:Improper handling of the B sample you mean

you are a moron without even the meagrest clue about biochemistry

improper handling such as over-heating/bacterial contamination or overgrowth/etc has virtually 0 chance of turning a +ve sample into a -ve one

you idiot, it works the other way round

concord wrote:

An Historian wrote:

Mohammed Mourhit - 3:36, 12:49, 26:52

Brahim Lahlafi - 3:43, 12:49, 27:43

Paul Tergat - 3:42, 12:49, 26:27

Chris Solinsky 3:35, 12:55, 26:59

Ok, but compare Solinsky's 3K time to the other 3:

Mourhit - 7:26.62

Lahlafi - 7:28.94

Tergat - 7:28.70

Solinsky - 7:34.22

that 3k pb for him is meaningless

if you noted his comments afterwards, he said his legs felt "dead" & he felt flat ( probably one race too many )

if he coud run 7'34 with "dead" legs & feeling flat, what do you think he couda done with fresh legs & full of vim & vigour ?

mourhit's 3k was basically just what was expected from him ( a 12'49 / 26'52 guy ) - the other guys somewhat underperformed

for sol, i reckon a good line of fit for him this year if he runs somewhat to expectations ( prelim estimate to nearest 0.2s for 400/800m ) :

51.40/1'48.40 ->3'32.8 , 4'49.6 , 7'26.6 , 12'50.1 , 26'50.1

the only figure that looks slightly suspect is that 1500 time, but remember, farah ran 3'33 in his 1st serious 1500 & i have to believe sol is as good/better than farah at any middle/long distance

sol coud go very close to 12'50 this year

MAPIV

I think you're so infatuated with me you were compelled to use my name backwards just to have some connection with me. Unload all the insults you want but your actions speak the truth. If I hated someone or really didn't agree with them, then I would avoid anything to do with that person/poster; however, you do the opposite. If I'm such a moron why you constantly find, read, and then post numerous times on my threads?

VIPAM wrote:

MAPIV

I think you're so infatuated with me you were compelled to use my name backwards just to have some connection with me. If I hated someone or really didn't agree with them, then I would avoid anything to do with that person/poster;

VIPAM, if you don't mind my asking: where are you from? You and your pseudonyms struggle with using the language correctly, but if English is, for example, your second language, this would explain a lot. However, I really think you are misguided in your appraisals of athletes. Every once in a blue moon you're on target, but even you, as stupid as you are, can't expect Bernard Lagat to run 12:49 at age 36 when he is so obviously not in his prime. Lagat could have run 12:50 in 2006. Everybody knows that. Lagat probably had the physical tools to run 12:45 or slightly faster in his prime. Those days are gone for good.

This is the Bernard Lagat who might have been able to run 12:49 and put the fear of god in Kenenisa Bekele.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2rHmSKqs2w

In that 12:59.22, they came through 4000 meters at 13:11.8 pace, and the last 1000 meters was in 2:25.76, which is 7:17.28 3000 meter pace, or 12:08.8 5000 pace, and of course Lagat's last lap was 51.7 or so.

ventolin^3 wrote:

concord wrote:

Ok, but compare Solinsky's 3K time to the other 3:

Mourhit - 7:26.62

Lahlafi - 7:28.94

Tergat - 7:28.70

Solinsky - 7:34.22

that 3k pb for him is meaningless

if you noted his comments afterwards, he said his legs felt "dead" & he felt flat ( probably one race too many )

if he coud run 7'34 with "dead" legs & feeling flat, what do you think he couda done with fresh legs & full of vim & vigour ?

I agree that Solinsky is faster at 3k than his pb, but I was responding to an historian who was comparing his 1500 to those of the other 3, which are just as meaningless.

ventolin^3 wrote:

mourhit's 3k was basically just what was expected from him ( a 12'49 / 26'52 guy ) - the other guys somewhat underperformed

for sol, i reckon a good line of fit for him this year if he runs somewhat to expectations ( prelim estimate to nearest 0.2s for 400/800m ) :

51.40/1'48.40 ->3'32.8 , 4'49.6 , 7'26.6 , 12'50.1 , 26'50.1

the only figure that looks slightly suspect is that 1500 time, but remember, farah ran 3'33 in his 1st serious 1500 & i have to believe sol is as good/better than farah at any middle/long distance

sol coud go very close to 12'50 this year

I agree that on paper Solinsky can run that fast. But my larger point was that there have not been that many races in which someone is willing to push the pace necessary for a 12:50, and the conditions are right.

El G and Bekele pulled a lot of people to fast times because they were willing to do all the work themselves. Maybe Isiah Koech or someone else will emerge and usher in another era of faster times.

But I'm sure as this season unfolds there will be a lot of surprises. Solinsky was certainly a surprise last year. And personally, I think Lagat has a much better chance of winning another WC medal than running sub 12:50.

I think factoring a 1500m race-time for someone who is focusing on the 5,000m is tenuous. Often elite runners who are focusing on the 5,000 have modest 1500's in competition. Even a 3:32 for 1500m is fast enough to run near 12:50 for the 5,000.

If we are going to predict a runner's 5,000m time, let's take a look at that runners 3,000m or 2-mile time. In Lagat's case, if he can run 7:28 for 3,000m, he can break 12:50 for 5,000m in a well-paced race.

Lagat is a proven runner, so his goal of running 12:49 is realistic. Even if he falls a couple seconds short, due to the race dynamics, he may come close to the level he thinks is necessary to compete in the WC and OG. Everyone knows that a fast time in the WC or OG is not what matters - it's about winning / beating your competition - but having confidence that you can compete with anyone matters a heck of a lot.

The 5000 isn't the only American record someone can break.

Can't believe I'm the first person to point this out.

ventolin^3 wrote:

you are a moron without even the meagrest clue about biochemistry

improper handling such as over-heating/bacterial contamination or overgrowth/etc has virtually 0 chance of turning a +ve sample into a -ve one

you idiot, it works the other way round

No sweetie cakes, you misunderstood what I meant.

Nothing degraded in his B sample - it was positive too. But they had to come up with something for the nice smiley guy.

Does heating/bacterial contamination cause synthetic EPO to appear in an otherwise clean sample? I'm not convinced by this. Can I see the studies please?

These guys could be caught with a needle in their arm, wearing 'we heart EPO' T-shirts and you'd still give them a pass. Perhaps it might be nice to think like that.

I agree Tinman

i know this may not translate well to te 5k but he did run 2:48 low on the usa red dmr at penn. Now i know it does translate to a fast 1500 with the strength lagat has. What that could translate to is a chance that this old kenyan american is still our best chance at gold in the 5k at worlds and could def run 12:49 in a good race.

You have to think a guy like lagat, being the 2nd fastest 1500m runner of all time and the strength he's shown in tactical 5ks that in his prime this guy could have been pretty close to bekele's 5k world record. Its safe to say while 12:49 is a great feat for a runner his age, he's not an ordinary runner and is def past his prime.

forgot to mention that was the 1200m leg of the USA dmr at penn tho im sure you guys know that already.