Canova and Other Elite Coaches--Questions about Training

opposite for me, 1/2 and full pace are very comfy and 5k pace sucks

A few ideas:

1. As you suggest, tempo runs before an interval workout. Something like 4-6 miles at half marathon pace followed by 10k of intervals.

2. Consider your rest between intervals. Doing 10 X 1K w/ 2 min between each is a big difference from 10 X 1k w/ 1 minute or shorter. Not sure what you're currently doing, but this could be a key.

3. High repetitions of 100 meter sprints with full recovery, building up to 30-40 X 100 meters. These will really address the muscular issue you are describing.

4. Long runs with varied paces. 20 miles with 15-20 X 1 minute surges, etc...

Just a few ideas that might help to address what you're describing. Best of luck.

ccrunner609 wrote:

opposite for me, 1/2 and full pace are very comfy and 5k pace sucks

That's pretty normal. That's why I'm looking for suggestions as to what I'm feeling...

Thanks for the suggestions. I have done workouts like the 10 x 1000 you mentioned with both 1:00 recoveries and even brisk recoveries of 400 in 1:30.

I like the idea of a harder run/longer run/ or even tempo run before doing some intervals. Definitely something I haven't tried.

There are a few possibilities.

The first would be that your build makes you more of a 1500-5000 runner without the same sort of options moving up as someone built more like a jockey, working the birdcage chest. The allometrics of longer distance performance favor a smaller/lighter framed athlete, from a fuel utilization, heat dissipation and eccentric load perspective. In this case, your best bet for qualifying for trials would be the 1:05 option, which you would run not too long after a good track 10000m. And you would tend to run best on cooler days.

The second option relates to gearing, motor unit fatigue etc. My guess is you are actually comfortable in <1:05 and that holding yourself back early in races confers no benefit in fatigue resistance. You might actually need to aim for positive splits, running well while you can, for as long as you can.

The third possibility relates to respiratory muscle fatigue. The sustained work at ~85 VO2peak (and slow component VO2) leads to a good amount of oxygen uptake in the work of breathing. Several approaches would be useful in addressing this. Basically if you are unable to blow off the CO2, you will feel fatigue in the active muscles, compounded with the frustration of slowing itself, sort of like the morale boost of getting thrown off the back of a train.

The fourth relates to fueling. The RQ at these velocities would be almost exclusively carbohydrate. You have numerous options worth trying here. I can explain these in more detail if you contact me directly.

As for the training itself I would guess you may want to experiment with slow/fast work as the IIa fibers oftentimes work best at varied tempo. A decent way to test this is to try a workout like 10x1mi w/ 1' rest. If you find yourself feeling stronger as you continue (relatively better compared to a steady paced 10) then there is something up along these work/rest lines. Basically you might have to work in higher velocities relative to other aspiring marathoners with similar 10000 capability. Certainly I would not advise racing slow marathons to prepare for fast ones. Anyway, email me if you have specific questions; it is pretty much impossible to include all the pertinent info in a LR post.

dsrunner@juno.com

Bump

any other suggestions?

what would the point of 30-40 x 100 meters be? When would you do these? Would it count as a whole workout?

Sounds like the training philosophy/talk that the 1990s American male distance runners followed...