There are 9 days rest (after a straight final in the 10K). That seems pretty sufficient to consider the double.
I am surprised that everyone is assuming that Meb and Browne have to CHOOSE one. They could run both, and conceivably do quite well doing so.
After all, how many times after a bad race do you think, "I wish I could run that again." The marathon would be that other race.
Totally agree. John Treacy 1984. Ran a heat in the 10k, finished 9th in the final then took silver in the marathon. Wicked!
Why not do the 5000 as well?
Zatopek pulled off the triple: 5-10-'thon.
Viren was one of the best runners in the history of the world and he couldnt do it...
I'd say that Viren "did it" rather well. Winning the 5K and 10K, and then finishing with a 5th place showing in the marathon, which was either his first or second ever, was quite an accomplishment, in my opinion.
Which comes first, the 10k or the marathon?
Come on guys! These are serious professional athletes that you are talking about. They will be looking for the best way of attaining the best possible position in their chosen event. They wont be sat there saying, "yeah, back in 1984....", because they have never even performed to olympic medal standard at this level in one race yet.....not one, not never! So don't heap pressure on them to double, when they should be looking to prepare for the race of their lives.
If these athletes double up, then you are more likely tosee them write off any chance of a marathon medal than anything else. There is no way that they would medal over 10k if we are realistic, but over the marathon, if they are allowed to concentrate on it 100% and have a bit of luck on the day, then there is always a chance .....if they are in very very best form of their careers.
Just remember, times have changed guys. Western athletes aren't exactly the force that they used to be in distance running as the sport has been taken to another level by the Africans. Remember too that there were no Ethiopians in the 1984 olympics Bazza, not that this would have stopped Treacy i doubt......but this year it will quite possibly play a huge factor on the medal prospects of others.
Dave
culpeper IS NOT viren...even if he run both, will be a non-finalist 10,000 and a 27th overall in the marathon!!!if he runs only the marathon...not in the top 10
The only events the US distance guys could seriously consider doubling in are the opening and closing ceremonies.
sad, but.........................................TRUE!!!
George Young did it....And he remains the toughest distance runner the usa has EVER had....Check out the '68 results...The us trials in the marathon was his first marathon ever and he WON....
Virren was obviously a pussy then. Zatopek did the triple...Shorter ran the 10 and the 'thon. Sure...didn't run great in the 10, but he kicked ass in the big daddy. 'Nuff said. Americans need to step it up again. I think Kastor should do the same. But...ya know...if it comes down to having a 7th place in the 10, and a 5th in the marathon, I'd rather have a no-show in the 10, and a 3rd in the marathon, or whatever. Tough decision to make. I'd go the double though...we gotta start getting some balls here in the states.
Shorter did run a great 10,000 in the Olympics! I was there. On August 31st, he ran 27:58.2 in his heat. On Septmber 3rd, he was 5th in the final in 27:51.4. It was a great race! The first five, including Shorter, broke the existing Olympic Record. He then came back on September 10th to win the marathon in 2:12.20 which happened to be only 8 seconds over Bikila's Olympic record from 1964. Many on this board do not seem to understand that making an Olympic Final is great running. Times are not important in Olympic and World Championship running. It is all about placings and the first 6 in the world in any event are great athletes. Most of the critics on this board will not even get to run an Olympic Trials race.
I do not think our marathoners are competative enough in any one event to add a second one. They need to train for and think about one event only.
Some of you are overlooking how many have doubled successfully in an Olympic Games, they include:
Viren (in '72, '76 and '80)
Yifter (in '80)
Puttemans
Gammouddi
Zatopek
Maaninka (Finnish guy in '80)
There are a couple dozen other men who have done excellent doubles in a European Champs or a World Champs. Foster, Vainnio, Vaatinen come to mind.
In fact, before EPO came along, the 5k/10k medallists were more often the same guys than not in major championships.
This doesn't mean a 10k/marathon double is a slamdunk, it's not. But I think it is more because of the perceived difference in training than the physical difficulty. After all, lots of guys have done it successfully.
BILLZEEBUB wrote:
Come on guys! These are serious professional athletes that you are talking about. They will be looking for the best way of attaining the best possible position in their chosen event. They wont be sat there saying, "yeah, back in 1984....", because they have never even performed to olympic medal standard at this level in one race yet.....not one, not never! So don't heap pressure on them to double, when they should be looking to prepare for the race of their lives.
If these athletes double up, then you are more likely tosee them write off any chance of a marathon medal than anything else. There is no way that they would medal over 10k if we are realistic, but over the marathon, if they are allowed to concentrate on it 100% and have a bit of luck on the day, then there is always a chance .....if they are in very very best form of their careers.
Thanks for adding a bit of common sense to the discussion Dave.
Even if the 10000 is a straight final, nine days before the Marathon, it's not the best preparation. It might be good preparation for some, but only if they were not in their ideal 10k shape to begin with.
Perhaps some runners will do the double, but they won't be top 5 in both events. This is 20004, not 1976.
Just remember, times have changed guys. Western athletes aren't exactly the force that they used to be in distance running as the sport has been taken to another level by the Africans. Remember too that there were no Ethiopians in the 1984 olympics Bazza, not that this would have stopped Treacy i doubt......but this year it will quite possibly play a huge factor on the medal prospects of others.
Dave
Historian........you are talking about championships which happened at least 24 years ago!! Back then the African nations were mere fledglings who were still in the early stages of training/perfomance development. How can you possibly compare pre1980 to 2004?? try putting Frank shorter out there this year to run his sub 28 10 and he will be eaten up and spat out the other side as the leaders lap him! This is just how it is over 10k nowadays. If your US athletes want to succeed over 10k, then they should put everything into running as close to 27:00 as they possibly can.....not go doubling up with a marathon, just because the program timings allow it!
Nobody is denying that in the old days athletes could do the double, today the Africans still can......but as i have said before, they have taken the sport to another level.
Dave
Dave -
I was not suggesting that athlete X should double in the 10k and marathon, but I am suggesting it is perfectly possible to do so. Whether or not they are going to get a medal is somewhat immaterial. I think that hard 10k a week or so before a marathon can make ideal preparation for the longer event. The other factor which needs to be considered is whether or not doing the doubel prevents someone else form competing. I would imagine this wasn't the Treacy's situation in 1984 - and of course his 2:09:56 remains the 3rd fastest Olympic marathon.
and another thing...
whiel it's true there weren't so many Ethiopians around, there were plenty of Africans
Men's 800m. Final. Olympic Games 1984
4. Billy KONCHELLAH (KEN) 1:44:03
6. Edwin KOECH (KEN) 1:44:86
Men's 1500m. Final. Olympic Games 1984
4. Joseph CHESHIRE (KEN) 3:34:52
8. Omer KHALIFA (SUD) 3:37:11
Men's 5000m. Final. Olympic Games 1984
1. Said AOUITA (MOR) 13:05:59
5. Paul KIPKOECH (KEN) 13:14:40
6. Charles CHERUIYOT (KEN) 13:18:41
Men's 10,000m. Final. Olympic Games 1984
3. Mike MUSYOKI (KEN) 28:06:46
6. Sosthenes BITOK (KEN) 28:09:01
Men's Marathon. Final. Olympic Games 1984
6. Juma IKANGAA (TAN) 2:11:10
7. Joseph NZAU (KEN) 2:11:28
8. Djama ROBLEH (DJI) 2:11:39
Men's 3000m. steeplechase Final. Olympic Games 1984
1. Julius KIRIR (KEN) 8:11:80
6. Domingo RAMON (KEN) 8:17:47