Question for Renato Canova on long runs under the threshhold

If the training is going as well as that, then surely Shaheen felt great after the workouts, but maybe not during?

Wellnow, you don't need to feel well during, you need to feel motivated, and AFTER you need to feel well. How much mental strength can you build when you are able to do something BETTER than before, that means you can overtake your limits ?

Probably also Shaheen as every other runner during a hard session suffers - towards the end of the session. And when he suffers he may not feel the best; But if, as Renato said, he is well aware that for reaching the best he needs this training, and this is his personal choice, he can easyly overcome the sufference and feels great. And the management of his training is also very important - he needs to be fresh for this kind of session - As Renato mentioned

A question for Renato: In your book Marathon training I have come across the chapter "training the muscles' capacity to use lactate." One possibility to train this is to use continuous run at speed between AT and AnT. Other is to use repetition runs at the speed of AnT or slightly higher with intervals of slower paced runs as recovery.

The question is how you manage the recovery of an athlete when he goes for repetition runs. When to use walking, jogging or running at AT speed as recovery. What effect may different types of recoveries have on the whole session.

I apologize, maybe I have some grammar or vocabulary mistakes in my text. English is not my mother tongue. I hope it's clear what I want to say.

Have a nice day, Luka

Will Shaheen still run the 3000m Steeple next season or will he focus more on the 5km? Will he attempt a double at the world cup again?

Renato thanks for the reply to me questions, hopefully you can reply to Luka's comments about rest btw reps, I know you mentioned on another thread that you were upset a some idiot posters but please just ignore them and just respond to those of us that appreciate your knowledge of training

Absolutely great post, Renato. You nailed it! Thank you for putting into words my feelings.

I hope to revive the discussion, becouse i think we can have some great informations out of it.

Now in my country it is winter and about 20cm of snow. All my rural roads (on which I run) are covered with snow. Now I have to choose between running on 20cm of snow or to go to the stadium and run on the track. I prefer to run my normal runs on snow, becouse i think running on snow can be a good strength-resistance training (beside the aerobic training) and a good proprioceptive training as well. Of sure you have to be more cautious, that you don't get injured.

I'm interested to hear what you Mr. Canova think about running on snow, and thoughts from all others, who might have some idea, are also appreciated.

Luka

Luka Ljubi269; wrote:

I'm interested to hear what you Mr. Canova think about running on snow, and thoughts from all others, who might have some idea, are also appreciated.

Luka

It's worth talking to gyms or health clubs to see if they have a treadmill. Soft snow is fine for longer runs or hill-type sessions, but icy sidewalks are dangerous. We just had snow in London (unusual) and I decided to do the harder weekly tempo runs on a treadmill. It's much more pleasant, and good for your legs to be warmer and run freely. Listen to music and count songs, not kilometres - time goes faster!

I don't know where you are in Slovenia but you might also have the option to cross-country ski a couple of times a week - this could be a very good way to build up your mileage as Renato suggests, with minimal impact, and change back to running when the snow melts.

I can agree that running on icy sidewalks can be dangerous, and I think that every athlete must be responsible to evaluate if it's dangerous or not. You can not allow to get injured becouse of such "stupid" mistake (wrong evaluation of terrain).

In my case the snow was soft at the begining, but later it got a bit icy (becouse people walk, run on it), and I am going on such terrain only for my normal or slow runs (normal runs are slower now becouse i have to be cautious), for tempo run or fartlek or anything faster than normal run I go on the stadium, becouse in my opinion is to dangerous on icy terrain.

About cross-country skiing. It have came on my mind few times; i have a nice rural area, with a lot of possibilities for cross-country skiing but i don't have the skies and equipment. I will have to get the equipment somehow :)

About treadmill, i don't know why but i refuse to use it, i just dont have the right feeling on it.

anyway tnx for your advice :)

I would rather use snow shoes, then xc ski.

Mr. Canova can you please give examples of some of the key workouts you use for your half marathon runners. Thank you

Regarding intervals on track, Lebid usually goes for short repetitions (from 200 to 400m) at good speed (28 / 62) for many times, with very short recovery. What he never did before our collaboration was the so called "Italian Medio", that is a long continuous run from 6 to 15 km at a pace of 95% of PB in 10000m. In the case of Lebid (that has a 28:08 not "real", because can run in 27:20 when in shape)a "Medio" can be, for example, 12 km at 3:00 / 3:03 pace. We have to consider that Sergey uses to compete frequently, almost every week, and the competitions are his "Medio" training. When instead we are during the track season, and Sergey goes only for few competitions, he needs to put in his training long intervals (from 2000m to 1000m) that never used before. He started to use these distances in St. Moritz, training with the Kenyan Mark Bett, a my athlete having 12:55 and 27:02 of PB. After using this type of training, Lebid was able to beat all the National Records from 3000 to 10000m, being very competitive in meetings like Monaco and Berlin.

When he is at home in November - December (before European Championships), he uses a lot of hills and long run on very hilly courses. He is very strong in his muscles, but is not able to stay with the leaders if the beginning of the race is very fast. I think that this problem is due to a lack of long-fast run, and is at the same time physiological and psychological problem.

For increasing his kick, one of the workouts that he prefers is 400 fast (61) / 200 recovery in 45 / 300 fast (45) / 200 recovery in 45 / 200 fast (27) / 200 recovery in 45 / 100 sprinting (1600m in 4:40), that he repeats 5 times with 4/5 minutes recovery.

Speaking instead about Shaheen, we must not forget that are speaking of an athlete able running in 7:53 steeple, and probably under 12:40 in 5k. If you think that he has the ability to run for 5k at 2:32 pace, and for 10k at 2:40, you understand that 3:20 is 25% slower of the 10000m pace (16.0 every 100m compared with 20.0), and this is not so hard. If we want to follow the same proportion, for a runner of 28:20 the same intensity is running at (17.0 + 4.25 = 21.25) 3:32.5, and for one of 30:00 is running at 3:45. Another thing : don't make the mistake to think that the altitude can penalize too much the pace in the case of a Kenyan living at high altitude. The difference for an athlete like Stephen or John Korir or Moses Mosop, that live normally at 2400m, in case of long run, may be of 5% compared with the same training at sea-level (3:20 in Iten = 3:10 at sea level). The best Kenyan runners in 10000m, if living at 2400 / 2700m, have difference between their PB in Nairobi and their PB at sea-level, not too big : John Korir 27:44 - 26:52 = 52.0 (5.2 per km), Paul Kosgei 27:44 - 27:21 = 23.0 (2.3 per km), Wilberforce Talel 27:46 - 27:30 = 16.0 (1.6 per km). Their parameters are not the same of European and American runners

This is something I wrote in 2004, in any case is always a real example connected with a European, and not with a Kenyan.

kingofthehill wrote:

Mr. Canova can you please give examples of some of the key workouts you use for your half marathon runners. Thank you

Kingofthehill, and all others, no offense but please go through other threads of Mr. Canova on this forum before you post a question. So the questions will not repeat (ex. what are the main workouts for 1500m, main workouts for HM ... and so on). And if you still don't find what are you looking for, or if it's not clear than ask. Thanks

In this winter time a lot of runners go onto the treadmills into gyms. I'm wondering what effect might runing outside have, becouse of the cold (-5°C). On what you have to be especially carefull, that something unpredicted will not happen. Thanks

Am I the only one who doesn't really understand what this means?

Here is my interpretation of the great Renato Canova post.

Canova is saying that coaches often ask which do you focus on first, extending the distance of the interval or run, or increasing the intensity. Canova points out that they both work together and that you must extend the distance and increase the intensity at the same time. It is not a choice between which of the two to focus on first. they must both be done at the same time.

Canova goes on to give an example of how he increases a 5000 meter runner's aerobic capacity through a variety of endurance runs at different paces. He mixes in hills, fartlek, and temp runs, and that is Canova's secret to developing endurance during the preparation phase of training.

how fast the *fast long run needs to be?

HI its amazing reading your post sir, The Fast Long run, How fast needs to be?

Renato, do you have any comments on the training of Hitomi Niiya?

https://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=9940279