Geb blocked Wanjiru from destroying him in Berlin

I apologize for not being more to the point. But Geb is not interested in letting his race or record plans be disrupted by a racer like Wanjiru that is extremely good at changing the pace and starting very fast to wear down competitors. That is why we are not likely to see Geb and Sammy run against each other in the future. I think that is a major reason why Geb did not run the Olympic marathon (that plus money).

Selassie wrote:

All this speculation and mudslinging by people who even Ryan Hall called 'don't know what they are talking about', is absolutely waste of time.

Hall may be right about individuals and even groups of posters on here. But, as a whole the collective is usually smarter than any individual. Witness Ritz, when the collective outrage reached a fever pitch, he finally switched coaches. And it paid off, boy did it ever pay off.

Portsmouth Runner wrote:

The last two marathon WR holders, Paul Tergat and Haile Gebrselassie, are both RHYTHM runners. With their high aerobic capacity and efficient mechanics they are able to maintain very fast tempos. They love to run at steady pacing for most of the marathon (which is generally the best strategy for running a fast race). Both have had difficulty in championship type road races and races without pacers where there is surging and sometimes lots of tactical running. They also prefer to run flat and fast courses.

But neither had much of a problem running in tactical championship track races where surging is common and tactics play a large role.

I guess winning golds in multiple Olympics and World Championships, running in World Cross, racing down in Indoor Worlds, and now setting multiple (25 in all) records as he nears 40 makes Geb scared.....It could be turned around. Why doesn't SW race against the best in track? Why won't he run World Cross? Why does he follow his defeats at half marathons with the tired statement of "I am in the middle of training" Do you think he'll be around in 15 years setting records? Geb has done it all and should by all rights be at home chilling....not running 2:04 to 2:06 twice a year and beating 2:04 guys like mincemeat. Of course, soon he will be dethroned due to age, just as Ali was. But to even remotely say he is ducking is nutty.

So why didnt Samu go to NYC. Cant they pay more the Chicago. Lel against Samu would have been OK.

Selassie wrote:

Let's cut the bullcrap right now -

While Wanjiru is a talented runner, GET this -

Wanjiru is not WR material. He surely is not now - and may not even be down the road. Just get used to it.

You have clearly been away for a while, so let me update you: WANJIRU *IS* A WORLD RECORD HOLDER. THE RECORD HE HOLDS *USED TO BE GEB'S*

Still confused?

Could he take the record from Geb in the full the way he did in the half? Given the pacing and weather that Geb had for his WR, maybe. I'm not saying yes. I'm just saying we don't know, and that it seems like we don't know because of some dirty pool.

Portsmouth Runner wrote:

But Geb is not interested in letting his race or record plans be disrupted by a racer like Wanjiru that is extremely good at changing the pace and starting very fast to wear down competitors. That is why we are not likely to see Geb and Sammy run against each other in the future. I think that is a major reason why Geb did not run the Olympic marathon (that plus money).

A lot of that is nonsense. Of course I'll agree that Geb the last few years has been much more focused on setting WR's in the marathon than taking on all comers. However....

1) he took on all comers in every race from the the 1500 to the marathon for 15 years, and just about beat everyone, so can't we give the guy even a little slack on this point?? He can't focus on the WR if he wants to ??

2) If he was really afraid of any competition or other top runners "disrupting his race", he'd never have lined up against Kibet this year. Kibet HAS THE SECOND FASTEST MARATHON EVER, LESS THAN 30 SECONDS BEHIND GEB'S PR FOR CRISSAKES! Kibet was being dubbed the "next one". If Geb was so scared of any competition, he would have never allowed Kibet in the race, right?? Right. Kibet has run faster than Wanjiru. He is not better, but going into Berlin, he appeared as if he could have the potential to be as good.

3) Geb is worried about having his record plans disrupted by a "fast pace" ?? Then why did he, just last year, go out in these splits in Dubai:

5k-14:17 10k-28:39 15k-43:20 20k-58:10 25k-1:13:04 ??

Those first 3 splits are just slightly slower than Wanjiru's all time record 5-15k splits for a marathon (from London 2009, 14:08 28:30 43:12) and the next two splits(20,25k) are faster than Wanjiru's best ever splits ( 58:14 1:13:35). And Geb hung on to run sub 2:05 while Wanjiru could not.

Geb is not afraid of a fast early pace.

4) Geb did not run olympics because he thought the hot smoggy conditions could be harmful, and he was targeting WR in Berlin. I too was disappointed in that decision, but yet I don't think it was about ducking competition or being afraid to lose (he did run the 10k after all, which he was not even training for and which had Bekele and Sihine, arguably harder to beat at 10k than Wanjiru at the marathon). He just was focused on the WR, for better or worse. And he did set it after the olympics, and he did set history's only sub 2:04. So for him, skipping the Olympics was worth it. For some fans like you, maybe not.

Sir Lance-alot makes some very good points and backs them up with data. But I still feel it is very clear that Geb and his manager in the last two years have definitely focused on races which do not have really competitive fields. It is understandable that he would want to maximize his earning potential and extend his career. In the Olympic 10K, he had 3 friendly compatriots to control the race and work as a team (I recall they even slowed down for him at one point to try to get him into the bronze). So that is not a good example of a risky competition for him. It seems better for the sport if the competitors compete/race against each other, rather than the clock. The upcoming NYC marathon is an example of a very competitive and interesting race that should be exciting to watch.

Geb is an amazing athlete with a wonderful career record. I would not think any less of him if he competed against the best marathoners and did not get first place. And it would be very interesting to see a race with both Geb and Wanjiru in it.

Geb just costs too much to bring in another major player like Wanjiru.

And those three were?

Yes, but not all the time. If Lagat and Bekele raced against each other over 5000m every week, and Bekele wins every time, where's the excitement? Hasn't Lagat's stock gone down, in that case?

Agreed. London is the only place with the money for the matchup, I suspect. Maybe Dubai, too.

Sorry, I thought Gebremariam was in the Olympic 10K final. Bekele and Sihine were Geb's only compatriots, but they clearly were working together until the last lap.

You are right, money is the likely main factor in all this.

It was interesting to watch Bekele's Ethiopian compatriots deliberately position themselves in the last Golden League race to ensure no one could make a surprise break and potentially ruin Bekele's share of the $1 million jackpot. Watch the video!

Are people on this board really accusing Geb of ducking? GET OUT OF HERE. ARE YOU SERIOUS? THIS IS HAILE MFIN GEBRESELASSIE. Expose GEB to SAMMY WANJIRU? What the hell are you morons talking about. This is literally the most unbelievable nonsense i've ever read on this board, and it's full of garbage every single day.

Wanny Boy wrote:

Selassie wrote:

Let's cut the bullcrap right now -

While Wanjiru is a talented runner, GET this -

Wanjiru is not WR material. He surely is not now - and may not even be down the road. Just get used to it.

Not WR material? Seriously? Are you braindead?

Agree, stupid comment. The guy has run 2:05 more than once, that makes him a potential world record holder. He's also the Olympic Champion, running away from a brilliant field minus only Geb.

Not WR material...? You need to watch the 2008 Olympic Marathon and 2009 Chicago Marathon once again, then come back to me.

Selassie wrote:All this speculation and mudslinging by people who even Ryan Hall called 'don't know what they are talking about', is absolutely waste of time.

So move on to the next topic ...

Ryan Hall is also the same man who poses for photos in arm warmers no matter what the weather.

Yes Wanjiru has absoloutley crushed how many talented fields? Having the strength to start so fast and to surge like he does while still ending up running 2:05-2:06 indicates that with good conditions and pacing he can probably run 2-3 minutes quicker without a problem. Remember the guy has run 20+ seconds fast than Geb for a half marathon as well. Geb has years and experience with pace on Wanjiru, once Wanjiru settles down a bit and is able to get good pacemakers so he can focus on running evenly rather than tactics the WR will be his.

For all its worth, SM has a vandetta against GEB. His attitude is based on national pride and the love of Athletics.

However, MONEY is a factor in the asemi arid area where Wanjiru and myself comes from, ENTERS MANAGER/FINANCIAL CONSULTANTS etc... then its no longer a matter of national pride but the Pursuit of Happiness and a few hundred Dollars more.

SM might never have the opportunity of racing GEB as the old man is past his sell out date... SM also might not last the next 5years but he will take the Record and the Contract offered to GEB in Berlin. Watch your local listing for the PR release soon

Sir Lance - most on this forum are talking out of their az*es anyway. So no need for you to go through this big elaboration to explain anything. Haile's illustrious accomplishments are there to see for anyone.

Accusing Geb, of all people, for being 'afraid' of Wanjiru , who by the way, hasn't proven anything by comparison, is just plain stupid at best.

Lawler Boy wrote:

Wanny Boy wrote:

Not WR material? Seriously? Are you braindead?

Agree, stupid comment. The guy has run 2:05 more than once, that makes him a potential world record holder. He's also the Olympic Champion, running away from a brilliant field minus only Geb.

Not WR material...? You need to watch the 2008 Olympic Marathon and 2009 Chicago Marathon once again, then come back to me.

Sorry to bust your little bubble - but WR is not 2:05. So, still not a WR material.

I had already said, he's a very talented runner - but still not Marathon WR material.

" Shaheen was well known to make fields NOT including his toughest Kenyan rivals part of the deal when he raced, and as some have pointed out this is not uncommon for sprinters."

_________________________

No, this isn't "well known." Just the typical stuff that LRcom posters rattle off as fact. Where did you hear this? Who's your source?

He is world record material once he figures out that he doesn't need to go out at 1:01 HM pace for the first 10-15k. That killed him in Chicago, sure they hit the half at the right pace but if I was trying to break 4 in the mile going through in 2:00 with splits of 55-65 is not the way to go. As soon as Wanjiru does that he will obliterate the WR. Or if he gets in a race with Geb that is fast I think he could get it because the two of them would push each other past 40k and Wanjiru will not be beaten. He is the king of the marathon.